To be disappointed that my ds has decided not to go to uni.

[Fearandanxiety]

Ds is 19 years old and has been on a GAP year and has worked full time in a pub and had a few holidays. He has a place at uni starting this September to study business management. He has started to get cold feet and said it was due to the amount of debt he would get from being at uni, but I think his girlfriend has been putting pressure on him not to go. My parents have offered to pay his tuition fees which is incredibly generous but he has decided today not to go. He has no alternative long term plan and I’m trying hard to hide how disappointed I am. I really think he has a fantastic opportunity and I feel sad that his girlfriend has persuaded him not to go. She isn’t academic and is content for them to carry on working locally and move into together. Aibu?

Was reading a list of university courses that led to the highest unemployment figures yesterday. Business management was one unfortunately.

If the grandparents are willing to pay let it be for a couple of years. He's working, bringing in money. He's happy. His mind set may change as he matures.

Not everyone is ready to commit to the studying at 19. My son is 23 and starting uni in September, I went at 22 and got so much more out of it than if I’d gone in my teens - studying felt like a privilege rather than a chore.

could you suggest to him that he defers a year to keep his options open?

I don't understand the issue, given the fact that he is working.

Perhaps he's conducted his research and decided against this degree for this very reason.

Hi @Fearandanxiety he’s making a wise decision on not going if he was going to study business and management. He could look at an apprenticeship. Your parents money would just be wasted on fees and that degree most likely won’t give him a job at the end of it. I did a similar degree

Is this the daily mail one where they also included Law? And did it by university of which included very few RG unis in the list if any? Mostly unis based in London which has a much denser population?

You don't really 'need' a degree in business management to manage a business. If he's currently working full time in a business he'll probably get as much, if not more, knowledge about how to manage a business from doing that (if he wants to train to be a pub manager or landlord, for example) than from doing a business management degree and will have earned the whole way through.

Before you mentioned having tuition fees paid I would have erred on the side of Yabu, even though it would be understandable to
feel a little disappointed.

But with the tuition fees not an issue then yes I feel it’s a missed opportunity especially as uni life means so much more than just a qualification.

Exactly and this is his choice

Also what metrics did they use? We use the Graduate outcomes survey which is also highly flawed - has around a 45% response rate, surveys after 16 months post graduation and uses an outdated occupational coding system that doesn’t always best reflect the realities of the graduate labour market!

Nobody is saying don't go to uni and get a mortgage instead if you have have a clear plan of what you want to do and actually want to be there. Im saying don't go to uni if its not what you actually want to do. Choosing to settle down is ok to. Everyone is different

I think quite a lot of people on this thread have dismissed education as a waste of money!

As a uni careers adviser, I fully support people’s choices in whatever they want to do. But this thread is also full of misinformation about university courses, graduate prospects, the labour market and the apparent availability of apprenticeships as an alternative.

They do, but us an unmotivated person who wants to be earning at his pub job and be with his girlfirend studying business going to be researching cancer or insect decline?

I think people are responding to the ops sons scenario, that a fairly generic degree with no aim, that he doesnt want to do might not be right for him anyway.

Im sure if she said he had a lifelong passion for preserving cultural heritage and has suddenly ditched it for a girl people might be more in favour of of not giving up his dream. But noone really has a passion for business, they think it will be useful for a broad range of jobs, but generally its not the only way to get those types of jobs

I haven't. Ive dismissed education in this case as he has cold feet regarding the debt. In that case he thinks to have a rethink.

"But employers still want graduates"

That wasn't exactly the point that I was making (sorry if I wasn't too clear).

The pp mentioned graduating 40 years ago. At this time, the number of graduates was tiny compared to today.

There was a genuine 'graduate premium' for having a degree.

I don't know the exact figures off the top of my head, but today I think that there are around five times as many people graduating with first degrees every year compared to forty years ago.

Unfortunately, the economy has not grown over that time to create five times as many high-value jobs that require graduate skills and offer a 'graduate premium' in terms of pay.

As a result, there is a great deal more competition for what might be considered a 'graduate job'.

The pp was considering the situation forty years ago when one could indeed walk into a good job with a BA in Business Studies. Things are very different today.

.

"Brexit hasnt helped any of the economic issues. "

This situation long predates anything at all to do with Brexit.

I did uni and I don’t work in the field I studied. I did it in coding and game design and I’m a legal secretary for a top 500 firm. You do not need to go to uni. Everyone has a degree nowadays it means nothing! I also went at 23, not 18. Maybe he will decide he wants to as an older and wiser adult!

I think it's rather refreshing that your son has decided University is not for him - we need to get away from this mindset that EVERY 18 year old has to go to University. Not saying his intended course isn't worthwhile, but there are an awful lot of kids who go, thinking they will have a good time for 3 years and then walk into a high-flying job straight away! Apprenticeships should be offered more; then they are learning a skill but still earning.

I just hope the girlfriend hasn't influenced him not to go. I was in a similar position and turned down a place because I didn't want to leave my boyfriend. I have always regretted it.

Haha no I see your point - I was thinking more management grad roles, rather than specifically business - very few have ended up in roles you specifically needed a BM degree for.

And yes you are right re the volume of graduates. It was 5% of the population with a degree when I graduated in the early 90’s and now it’s 50%.

I guess we are getting the reckoning around what kind of society do we want to live in. As I said earlier in the thread, Burnham is right to rebalance technical education. But I also think that education for education sake is a more common ideal in Europe and other nations. Education and learning is valued for its own merits.

The problem with Blair’s neoliberal vision is that it links degree education value to employment - rather than for its own sake and we are living with the consequences of that now- as is being played out in this thread.

Do we, as a society, value learning for its own sake? It’s almost impossible to do that in a system that puts the burden of funding on young people. European nations don’t do this in the same way at all.

They are like gold dust there aren’t enough at all for all the people applying.

Yes this is the thing that would concern me most. He has plenty of time for studying later if he changes his mind but having a baby now would make his life a lot more difficult.

Likely because that is the course that involves a sandwich placement? Universities often put a lot of effort into finding placements for students who are on courses that involve a placement.

Why would somebody doing say a history degree or a maths degree just want to randomly take a year off?

My ex's eldest daughter's friends were almost all going to uni. She was undecided. More so bearing in mind her parents weren't in a position to offer much in the way of financial support.
She ended up getting an apprenticeship (not quite sure if that's what they called it, but that's basically what it was) with a huge finance firm, so she was being paid, and they also paid for her to do her accountancy qualifications.
That was ten years ago. She's still with the firm, and doing very well now.
And no student debt.
Uni's great if that's what you want to do, and you can afford it.
It just wasn't for her.

I would try to persuade him to get an apprenticeship for a useful job . Plumbers, joiners , electricians etc will always be needed and good ones can earn a fortune . My 19 year old grandson is doing an apprenticeship as a car mechanic. My other 19 year old grandson is going to uni in September to do aeronautical engineering. Different boys , different jobs , different lives .

Can you look into apprenticeships with him?
X

He’s a smart kid. He doesn’t know exactly what he wants to do and so is waiting. I am 31 and doing a third degree because I grew up and changed my mind on my career track… he can go to university at any time but he won’t get the money back if he chooses on a whim and regrets it.