Brownies incident stopped me singing, starting to see how messed up it was.

[Magenta82]

When I (44) was 8 I went to a big division meet up, not many people from my pack went. There was show put on by another group as part of their Entertainer badge, they played the spoons. Someone then described the award and I thought it sounded like fun. I went back and badgered the leaders until they agreed to do it.

We did a big group show for all the parents and everyone had to do an individual piece as well, some at the show and some on a normal Brownies night. I chose to do it at the show.

I decided to sing from my school hymn book (the blue one with the ugly kids on the front #4 Autumn Days), on my own, in front of everyone with no musical accompliment. The "judges" were 3 quite elderly ladies from some kind of group of retired Brownie leaders or something (trefoil?). They failed me. I didn't get the badge.

Now admittedly I can't carry a tune in a bucket but still! I was basically put off singing for life, gave up trying, if I was so bad I couldn't get a brownie bade I must be the worst in the world.

It seemed unjust at the time, but now I have a child in Squirrels I really just how fucked up it really was.

AIBU

Playing the spoons is certainly much easier than singing but not sure if it can ever be described as entertaining

I have a friend who is the most exemplary human but she cannot sing, by her own admission. She could learn to be in tune, anyone can, but she hasn't and she's all-round terrible at it.

She once sang a lullaby to her son when he was a baby and he took the dummy out of his mouth and put it in hers 🤣

When we did this badge at Brownies, we divided into two groups and each spent a couple of weeks learning a simple dance to perform for the other. Made sense... had to do a bit of work and learning so it wasn't just handed out, but nobody was going to fail to do a very basic choreo as part of a group.

Actually I think I can still remember it...

@Goditsmemargaret I have a very similar story! I joined the choir in Y5 and was told very bluntly by a bigger girl that my singing was flat (I didn’t know what flat meant). That knocked my confidence, so I told the music teacher I wanted to leave the choir, and she said, “maybe that would be for the best, dear.”

I didn’t sing in public for YEARS after that; I would even mime to ‘happy birthday’. But when I had my son four years ago, it felt very natural to sing to him. I also didn’t want him to grow up wondering why I never joined in with all the other mummies and daddies at groups etc.

Now I’m much more confident, and my voice is actually a lot better through increased use! I’m not a good singer by any means, but I can more or less hold a tune and I also give much less of a shit what other people think when they hear me.

I haven't sung in public other than pee taking since primary either as back in the seventies they were selecting for the choir, and bopped us on the head if we didn't pass. I was bopped and the clear message was to never to sing again.

But maybe if adults had been honest with x factor growlers when they were children, they wouldn't hear jow bad they ate it in front of millions on national tv.
I can't sing and recited a comic monologue for my entertainer badge. Tnis is why young people jave no resilience now.

Have you considered joining a choir as most don't expect members to audition and singing in a group is a lot of fun.

You were let down, not by the judges but by being allowed to get up there while not being good enough yet. You should not have for that badge on the day; you should have been helped to prepare for the badge

No, I think you need to take it to a much higher level if you want to truly be a winner in variety entertainment.

1

I teared up reading this as the same thing happened to me. Finished C25K and just felt sad that my whole school life I was never encouraged to find something about exercise I could or would do. Just had to sit watching.

Agree with this completely. As a brownie guider now we would always give the badge if the girl had clearly put the effort in and tried her best. I was a brownie around the same time as you OP (I’m 42) and after brownies and guides I went on to become a young leader and then an adult leader. Things have changed a lot in 32 years since I left brownies.

I sympathise. I was thrown out of recorder group at Primary. They said my fingers weren’t long enough to reach the holes!

The head at our girls’ primary ( years ago) said no auditions for choir as she’d been damaged by not getting in choir as a child. They also had a brass band (regular mainstream primary) they had a unique sound!!

As an aside the lad in the middle at the back on the Come and Praise hymn book looks just like my DH when he was young. 🤣

Loved the songs in there, not sure the kids are ugly though??

It seems to have been a thing back then to take these kinds of things unreasonably seriously when actually kids should be encouraged to just do their best!

I was unwell (in fact, dying, until I got a diagnosis) in childhood and extremely weak and small for my age. I tried to do my 600m swimming badge. The other children finished, got out of the pool and went home. I wasn't finished so I kept on going. It took my 2.5 hrs in the end and I got out, exhausted but proud- I had managed it despite the fact it had taken everything out of me.

The swimming teacher told me that my stroke had not been good enough and therefore I couldn't have the badge. I remember that I was too tired to even cry. What the teacher got out of withholding a badge that means nothing at all outside of the leisure centre from a dying 7 yo, I do not know.

I think a lot of us have had similar experiences. Only to be told that millennials are snowflakes who got participation trophies.

Exactly @Username19893847477374 !
Discouraging children and telling them they can’t do something or are bad at something is so sad.
I am sorry it took us so long to realise we could run - all because of rubbish PE lessons at school.

This post has actually made me very upset. Horrible way to treat a child. I was a Brownie and know how much badges meant to those little girls.

My friend used to go to church with her gran as a little girl and she was so excited about being old enough to join the choir. Until the day someone said ‘well you will never be good enough for the choir’. She is in her 50s now and it still makes her emotional.
And FWIW she has a lovely voice.

I am older than you but that's how it was in my childhood. I don't remember any of my junior school teachers saying anything encouraging. Plenty very negative though.
I think it was in Brownies that we went to a day in the leisure centre's sports hall for our Agility badge. Lots of other Brownie packs were there. It was crowded and overwhelming and we spent all day there. I didn't pass even after the whole day. I still remember the feeling I had.
And as a small guide on my very first camp, a couple came to show us how to do those trails where you leave arrows made of sticks to follow. I accidentally kicked an arrow- which was on the ground which was absolutely covered in sticks and twigs. I was really told off. I didn't realise it was the arrow.
I don't remember the fun of following the trail but I may have just forgotten that part.

I was in the group that had the job to 'clap and cheer loudly' whilst others sang in the school play.

Solidarity @Magenta82

I have two similar experiences.

1. I auditioned for the primary school choir when I was in Junior 3. I sang There were 10 in the bed. I was told no. I was really upset and embarrassed.

At the end of term concert, we all sang a song, then us plebs who weren’t in the choir had to stand there in silence whilst just thr choir sang. The girl next to me was dreadful. Even to my tone deaf ears I could hear she was horrible. Screechy, whiny, out if tune and time with everyone else. I had to listen to that and know that I was worse than her.

2. Art badge at Brownies. Had to make a collage. I was making “collages” all the time, it was my thing, so I thought I would smash it. My collages consisted of cutting out pictures from my colouring in book, colouring them in, then sticking them on a piece of plain paper to make a scene, and drawing a background behind them. For the Brownies one I added on some leaves.

My friends mum drove us to a local artist to be graded. She then helped my friend to carry hers in as it was huge and heavy. When it was unveiled, my heart absolutely sank. It was a beach scene, with real pebbles and shells, glitter for the waves, real feathers and fluff for birds. It wasn’t on paper, it was on a large piece of MDF.

She went through first and the art teacher obviously said she passed. I went next and I passed too but I felt like absolute shit.

The artist and the friends mum obviously felt really sad and embarrassed for me but were kind enough not to say anything.

So I guess it’s different in that the artist was kind enough to let me pass, but I felt horribly let down by my mum but was too young to express it.

Like you, I gave kids going through Rainbows / Brownies now and these memories have stayed with me.

Pardon what? You can't do the thing but you get the badge? What's the point? if my DD got a badge for swimming a width at the pool, I'd expect her to be able to swim it. Also if a child had tried and learned a skill, they get the same result as a child who showed up?

In 6th Yr, I remember getting a disdainful look from a young English teacher (who later snogged a 6th Yr at the school dance) when I went to put down my name for the school play.

The same month, I went along to see about a community play and was asked to read something. Was given the female lead on the spot.

The school play was cancelled. My own English teacher pointedly told me "...because we couldn't get enough people of your calibre".

He knew that I knew that I'd been rejected for not being fanciable.

Haha is that what it said! I don't know if I have the heart to tell her 😂

Mean biaatches!

I auditioned for my junior school choir and was not let in!

Think nowadays everyone is let in a state school junior choir.

Can't hold a tune in the bucket either, Op.

It's important to realise the criteria for badges these days is not purely outcome based. There is no Swimmer badge (a mistake in my view but anyway...) so we're not talking about someone ticking off "swim 25m" when the girl can't. Nearly all are more subjective e.g.
"Choose 2 of the following paper crafts to try out:

• origami
• card making
• decoupage...etc"

We aren't judging whether they are a brilliant origami artist, we're judging whether they've challenged themselves and tried something.

Interestingly a lot of the Cubs/Scouts badges are still more fixed in terms of what is required. Pros and cons to both!

I can empathise. A different situation but when I was in primary (way, way back in the 60s), it was compulsory to audition for the school choir whether you wanted to or not. It was excruciating for me as I was very shy and knew I couldn’t sing. We were made to sing solo in front of everyone while our scary music teacher played a hymn tune. While my friends all passed I failed. I felt so upset, not so much at the failing, but the forced potential humiliation (got teased by some kids afterwards) and not unnatural anxiety of performing for a crowd (against your will). I think I may even have cried. I never felt confident singing after that until I had my own children and freely sang in front of them (they are the only ones I ever sang out loud to). Teachers didn't give a shit about kids wellbeing in those days 😒