AIBU to attend a friend’s party when another friend was excluded?

[Ricecrispiesatsix]

I have a group of friends from a mutual hobby. We live locally to each other so share lifts to hobby nights and over the years have become close.

Friend A (let’s call her Clara) is now devastated at friend B (let’s call her Steph) for not inviting her to her birthday party and is furious at me for going to the party.

For context, Clara is not someone who finds life easy. She’s been diagnosed with autism, adhd, borderline personality disorder and depression. She has a dysfunctional family and is basically no contact with her parents, struggles to hold down a job, and struggles to sleep/feed herself properly. She also has a heart of a gold, is one of my best friends, godmother to my daughter and when I broke my foot last year she was absolutely there for us in a very practical way. Still now she’ll often pick up our kids from school and have dinner with us (mutually beneficial as it gets her out the house and eating something nutritious!).

Clara went through a break up last year and for about a year things got really bad. She barely left her house, when she did come to hobby nights she’d cry outside the room while we took it in turns to sit with her. During these months, social occasions would often be dominated by her crying, sometimes until 1 or 2 in the morning. We’d have the same conversations with her over and over again, literally hundreds of times and it was quite emotionally draining.

She can also be quite argumentative, sees the world in black and white and has had a few autistic meltdowns when things haven’t gone her way. These look like her shouting, swearing and storming off. Often directed at Steph who has a very different approach to life than Clara. Steph is the kind of person who dances through life. She’s super bubbly and friendly, successful in her career, has loooads of friends and generally has rock solid boundaries around protecting her free time and her peace.

Steph is basically done. She values having a drama free life and has decided to only spend time with people who bring her joy. She has stopped inviting Clara to her events. Clara is understandably hurt and confused by this and feels excluded.

Last weekend was Steph’s birthday and she had a small party in her garden. On Friday Clara asked in the group chat whether anyone wanted to hang out at the weekend. None of us mentioned Steph’s party, we just gave the times we were free to do something with Clara. Clara then asked me directly “is Steph having a party for her birthday?” and I answered her truthfully. I figured it’d be worse if she found out afterwards that we were all there without her.

Clara spent the entire weekend and next 3 days at home crying. Which is probably an over reaction but Clara has lots of trauma from previous friendships that ended badly and I feel terrible. Should I not have gone to Steph’s party out of solidarity for Clara? And going forward can I be friends with both of them? Steph has clearly said she’s done with Clara’s drama, and Clara thinks Steph is a selfish fuck. I can see both sides. But now Clara is quitting the hobby that she loves because Steph is there and it’s all very sad and difficult.

Sorry it’s long. Hard to strike the right balance between brevity and not drip feeding!

I have an ASD diagnosis and I find your suggestion ludicrous and embarrassing. The world doesn't revolve around us.

I was going to mention the fact Clara waits until the kids go to bed and then starts up with the crying episodes , so she can control herself and I do believe that to be manipulative behaviour .

I've said it before and I'll say it again but I'm extremely cynical about the increasing expectations for average bog standard people on the street to understand complex psychiatric or neurological conditions. While we do live in an information age where it's possible realistically most people have enough of their own problems to want to learn to cope with before taking on other people's problems.

I think you're overthinking this op. You can be friends with both of them. If Clara wants to talk about it, you can remind her that she's shouted and sworn at Steph in the past. She must be able to understand that that means Steph is unlikely to invite her to her house in future, surely?

Sadly my daughter is a bit like Clara with some similar diagnosis. Life is always full of friendship dramas where I regularly try and guide and explain appropriate social behaviour.

I'm glad you're still staying friends with Clara and are patient and understanding with her. I also fully understand why Steph has had enough.

I'd gently explain why Steph didn't invite her but I would still make the effort to be Clara's friend. She desperately needs friends that can overlook her faults as most people won't be able to.

Clara clearly can control her reactions, but she chooses not to when it comes to her friends, and Steph in particular.

What happens if Clara does scream and swear at your children, and as a result they want to distance themselves from her? Understanding that the issue wouldn’t be theirs would not make it any less distressing to be on the receiving end, and not wanting to be around someone who behaves like that is not in any way unreasonable. You don’t win virtue points by being a doormat and taking abuse.

Your children shouldn’t be taught that they should accept shouting and swearing at them because the person doing it has autism/a personality disorder/a history of trauma. That leaves them wide open to manipulation and abuse.

Steph is not responsible for Clara’s reactions, and you cannot expect her to keep accepting how Clara behaves towards her in order to mollify Clara and avoid rocking the boat. I say this because I get the impression that you’re annoyed at Steph for not just sucking it up to keep the peace. Steph isn’t the one that has put you in this position, Clara has.

I say this because I get the impression that you’re annoyed at Steph for not just sucking it up to keep the peace. Steph isn’t the one that has put you in this position, Clara has.

This is the impression I have as well

Her reaction to hurt is extreme but this is the nature of BPD. It doesn’t make you wrong for going. She needs to understand fang people are entitled to their own boundaries and just because you went it doesn’t mean you don’t value her friendship. It’s not really something you alone can fix explain to her. The sensitive to rejection and exclusion is so incredibly painful for people with BPD. I hope she’s had DBT or is in therapy.

It revolves around neurotypicals and always has done. If you're cool with them continuing to do things exactly as they want them whilst telling us we're the ones with a problem then I'm sure you're a very happy person.

Maybe we should try to meet halfway...

Well, of course it does 'revolve around' whoever the overwhelming majority are.

Which doesn't mean that adjustments should not be made in society at large, obviously, but if it comes down to Steph having to continually invite to her social events a woman who is signally failing to manage what is clearly quite a portfolio of MH conditions in addition to possible autism, and which translates itself in practice to hours of crying, punctuated by targeted shouting and swearing at her host, I don't think Steph is under any obligations whatsoever.

If you’re someone that shrieks, swears, and throws tantrums at people for not adjusting their lives precisely to your liking; and taking whatever abuse you see fit to throw at them, then yes, you are the one with the problem/s.

People are absolutely free to decide who they want to be friends with, invite to their homes, and include socially. What’s not cool about that?

If someone verbally abuses someone else then yes, they are the problem and its not on the receiver of said abuse to just grin and put up with it no matter how horrible it gets

This. I mean, in a court of law, it matters whether someone uses a defence of insanity for attacking someone, say -- and if the judge/jury agrees, an insanity mitigates the severity of the sentence, or might involve a secure psych hospital rather than prison.

But in a purely ordinary 'people interacting with people' way, it doesn't make a whole hill of beans to me whether the person wrecking my party by screaming abuse and crying is doing so because they have significant MH problems, or whether they're just uncontrolled and aggressive. I don't need to be around it either way.

Like it or not there are social norms, and I would really struggle to tolerate "Clara" as well and also avoid her because she'd exhaust and drain the absolute life out of me. So how can I blame an NT if I'd do the same?

This. And why would autism get particular attention if googling how to make adaptations - there’s hundreds nay thousands of conditions that would benefit from adaptations. My son would be mortified to think that @ImImmortalNowBabyDoll view that everyone should Google how to adapt to those with an ASD diagnosis. Not least because it seems to suggest that all those with an ASD diagnosis would benefit
From the same adaptations

My son would be mortified to think that view that everyone should Google how to adapt to those with an ASD diagnosis. Not least because it seems to suggest that all those with an ASD diagnosis would benefit From the same adaptations

How often do we hear on autism threads on MN that 'when you know one person with autism...you know one person with autism'. Ie it is not a homogenous group like tins of baked beans on a production line, and they will all have their own behaviours and needs. So it seems odd that one person with autism here seems to be advocating for a one-size-fits-all response. It might be what they need. They don't speak for all people with autism.

Absolutely

And also some autistic people do things that distress other autistic people with different triggers.
And if you're considering one disability, then surely you should have to consider others. What about someone with PTSD from domestic violence, for example. Should they have to put up with being shouted and sworn at by Clara even though it sets off their triggers?
Do some disabilities trump others?

You can't please all of the people all of the time, comes to mind.

Why does Clara want to go to the party of a selfish fuck? She can’t have it both ways. And she has no right to dictate who gets to hang out with others of when. She sounds like she needs a lot of help - is she seeking it?

Someone with Emotionally Unstable Personality Disorder needs a lot of help. CBT works well apparently.
With my relative it was all about her.
She never took on board the advice she asked for.

And absolutely shouldn’t be left to care for children

Stay completely neutral, be friends with both separately. Sadly, Clara has brought this on herself and I really don't think I could be around someone like that all the time, not being disrespectful regarding her issues, but that would spoil a lot of events for me. I'm team Steph on this. I wouldn't want to spend my fun times having to deal with this volume of drama.

I do have a feeling though, that you're going to be like piggy in the middle. Clara sounds like she's the type to keep bringing things up, having meltdowns over it, questioning you about Steph and being a bit resentful that you're still friends with her. So be prepared to shut this down by either being direct if you think she can handle that, or by steering the conversation gently away from the subject of Steph!
Good luck!

I didn't say it was.

But a quick Google search would inform someone that an autistic meltdown is not "manipulative" as has been suggested on this thread.

The very fact that people are describing the concept of listening to autistic people as "ludicrous and embarrassing" is telling and very sad.

If she can adjust/control her meltdowns according to her audience (which apparently she can) then of course its manipulative.

Thats a classic EUPD strategy. Nothing to do with autism