Neighbours angry at DS for snapping back and daughter’s homophobia - hypocrisy??

[TheNoisyDeer]

DS, 13, came out in Year 6 at the age of 10 and he has struggled with making friends ever since. His boy friends always used to make him the butt of the joke so he stopped being friends with them. He has a couple of female friends now but he still feels like he can’t be himself around them because they give him the side eye when they talk about boys and he talks about boys too. Due to this he feels on the defence when his sexuality is spoken about.

I invited our neighbours over earlier this evening for chat and drinks in the sunshine and the younger girl, 8, overheard her sister (the older daughter), 11, talking to DS about their crushes. She laughed at him, made a few comments about it being weird and called him a “gay boy”. I don’t know whether she’d picked it up from school or somewhere, but DS was clearly upset. He snapped and called her “a stupid bitch” and to “f off”.

There was immediate anger from her parents because she’s only 8 and they said there was no excuse for speaking to a young girl like that and demanded I tell him off. The older daughter also took her side and shouted at him to not talk to her sister like that. He looked startled, humiliated and ran inside.

I went inside and spoke to him about the language he used and said it wasn’t acceptable, especially to a girl that young, but I also told him I understood why he was hurt and that nobody should mock someone’s sexuality. DS said he didn’t care how old she was because she’d been horrible to him first and then refused to go back outside and apologise. I explained this to my neighbours and the mum said she wanted to leave and won’t put up with her daughters being spoken to in that manner and they left.

Ideally I would have expected the children to apologise to each other, preferably her first as she started it and then moved on but I was shocked by their reaction to just leave. We’ve been good friends for years and now I feel hurt by their lack of accountability for the homophobia and hypocrisy. I wouldn’t like the friendship to end but I won’t be bowing down to them.

AIBU for thinking both children were in the wrong but both the daughter and parents are more so?

"He has a couple of female friends now but he still feels like he can’t be himself around them because they give him the side eye when they talk about boys and he talks about boys too. Due to this he feels on the defence when his sexuality is spoken about."
I'd say there's something going very wrong with how far he is talking about sex and how he views girls.

Don't be so ridiculous.

8yo using homophobic (or sexist, racist etc) language needs educating. 13yo telling an 8yo to fuck off and calling her a bitch needs discipline.

She was homophobic

She's 8
Be for real

So he needs to mind his manners but it’s okay for her to be homophobic? Oh okay then…

So straight people can talk about crushes but LGBT people can’t? C’mon now you know that’s a double standard.

I don’t know why people think I’m all on his side when I’ve blatantly said he was inappropriate and should have apologised. If it were up to me they’d have apologised to each other and moved on.

She's 8. 8!

Yes I thought this too, your son needs to dial it down. I'm sure the child's mother had a word with her daughter when they got home, but I don't think an 8 year old would really understand or intend homophobia. A 13 year old male however should not be calling any female a bitch, especially not a child.

Your attitude towards your son, taking his side when what he did was unacceptable is probably why he has a terrible attitude himself and no friends..

She's 8 and being called a bitch and to fuck off from a boy old enough to know better.

No, it’s not “ok” for her, but you can’t hold a 13 year old and an 8 year old up to the same standard. As a PP said, an 8 year old needs educating , a 13 old should know better and needs disciplining

She's EIGHT years old and you're calling her a bitch????

Wow.

Weird

I absolutely guarantee you would not think twice about a thirteen year old girl talking about a crush she had on a boy in front of an eight year old.

At 8 my son and his friend were being bullied for being gay just because they were close friends and both boys.

I guess that wasn't homophobic at all and the other boys didn't know what they were saying? Children are a lot more aware than they were in the past.

So at what age would her comment be unacceptable and she would need to apologise? 9, 10,11 or older?

Someone taught her that gay boy was a slur, maybe at school. We know this because of the context she used it, so she knows it’s wrong.

Why hasn’t she been corrected? Either by a teacher or her parents?

If I had an 8 year old using that phrase, she would have been told off before the OP’s son had an opportunity to say anything. It is not acceptable.

Whereas hearing 13 yo boys talk about the “crushes” they have is generally hormone fuelled, sexually orientated and very misogynistic from what I’ve had the misfortune to overhear!

Your son had just been put through an emotional assault for being gay by an 8 year old girl who was prejudiced, arrogant and callous. There is absalutely no wonder she got a full on reaction from him.

Then everyone backs the girl up, jumps to her defense because she is 'only 8'.

How else should he have reacted? He is 13 so he is still young himself your DS was defensive and how else was he supposed to react?

She should have been pulled up about her prejudice and told to apologise to your DS.

I can understand DS being upset after being insulted, but his language was extremely harsh in return to a young girl who is in the early stages of primary school.

It is good that he stood up for himself, but could go it in a more "taking the moral high road" fashion, rather than vicious abuse, but as he is young himself we can understand.

I think the problem here is that all of these kids are really too young to be talking about sexuality and crushes, especially a girl of 8 (what's that? Primary 3 or 4?)

Young kids do not have a proper understand of sexuality - especially the more complex / possible controversial aspects, like homosexuality - and so its hardly surprising that they do not fully appreciate that its wrong to mock someone's sexuality.

I’d think it weird for any 13yo to be talking about crushes to an 8yo. They’re hugely different ages and every 13yo I know (I’m a secondary school teacher) would consider primary school children little kids (unlike how grown up they consider themselves!). However, he wasn’t talking to an 8yo, she overheard. He had done zero wrong at that point.

OP, do you think this points to a bigger problem? If he’s been struggling with friendships due to homophobia he may have lashed out in this instance because it had all built up. I’d have a serious chat to him about why he was so angry at a little kid.

Personally I think using homophobic insults is worse than calling someone a bitch. The two children should have been made to apologise to each other and seeing as the other couple didn’t think that necessary I wouldn’t be rushing to have them back. Yes he reacted badly but also having a gay 13 year old struggling with friendships the words I immediately wanted to type out about your “friends” were a lot worse than what he said so I can understand how easy it is to lose the head (I’ve calmed down now).

I have an 8 year old and I'm fairly confident he wouldn't say something like that (and if he did we'd be having words) but the gulf in maturity between 8 and 13 is extremely wide. 8 year olds don't fully understand these things, being primary school children who still spend most of their time playing with toys.

A 13 year old using a misogynistic slur to a much younger little girl? I'd be so ashamed of him.

So what would you have said to an 8 yo that was worse than “bitch” and “fuck off”..?

I agree. I would want them to apologise, not just your son.

I'd end the friendship. I think the language the girl used has probably come from the parents. I'd be mortified if my child was acting like that and would be pulling then up on it rather than laying all the blame on your DS.