Bit early, but AIBU for not wanting two nights at in-laws over Christmas?

[BitTooEarlyForXmas]

I know it's a bit early but this sparked a huge argument last night so here I am.

DH and I met while we were at uni 15 years ago, we were on and off throughout the years as we moved around different continents for work and distance didn't really work for us.

He changed industries last year, I transitioned to a national role instead of a global role, and we finally decided to get married, buy a house, and move in together. His parents live an hour away from us, mine live in New Zealand so they're not really relevant to this problem we have.

Yesterday I learnt that he expects us to go stay at his parents house for 2 nights (as per their tradition) this Christmas!

They have 1 bathroom in their entire house.

His parents are lovely (to him) but his mum can be a bit much.

When she first brought it up in passing (I thought it was just a request then and didn't know that DH was serious about the arrangement), she even said 'I don't know what you guys do in New Zealand but this is how we do it in England'. It just rubs me the wrong way and has compounded since then. Doesn't help that her whole personality is that she's 'nice' and that she's 'just being a mother'.

AIBU to not want to stay over for 2 nights? I don't mind day visits but 2 nights esp when all 4 of us have to share a bathroom is really a bit more than I'd feel comfortable with.

I think you need to compromise and do Xmas his way and your way on alternate years , you’re married now you need to build your own traditions . You might enjoy it too!

Suck it up & spend at least 1 night with the in laws. But I would be getting MIL a book on New Zealand history, including Māori heritage, to answer any her ‘I don’t know what you do in New Zealand but here in England….’ statements.

Obviously that is not the only reason and why should she have to stay with them when again there is no reason to.

No one has yet to explain why it is reasonable for OP to stay over two nights when she lived an hour drive away and she could drive over and come back vs staying overnight.

Why is OP unreasonable but not the MIL expecting OP and her son to stay overnight 2 nights?

It’s not selfish not to want to sleep over someone’s home and have to share a bathroom with three other people when your own home and comforts are close by especially when it’s people you have an off relationship with.

.

In fairness I would think “apron strings” for both, and I would have sympathy for the guy that had the decisions made for him about what he would be doing and when. Luckily for me both mine and my partner’s parents understand that they had 35 years of christmases with their children and would never try and dictate what we did, and my dad actively encourages me to spend the time with my own family as he is a strong believer in that being the right thing to do. He could very easily say “well you spent every Christmas with me until you were 35 so that’s what we do in our family and we will continue to do it”, but thankfully he’s a normal human being and those words would never come out of his mouth. If so there is no doubt that he would be the spoilt and precious one in that situation and my partner would be perfectly justified in saying that he didn’t want to do that.

Having read your last update Op this is more than a Christmas problem, your MIL saying your DH used to take her everywhere with him is at the heart of this. His DM thought now he was back in the UK she'd see him all the time, she's sees him once a week but she wants more even if it means gatecrashing your days out.
It might be a good idea to invite her out yourself, just the two of you so you could talk, obviously if she says no unless her DS comes with you then you know where you stand.

Why not get taxis?

The thing is that with OPs family living in NZ it can become very swallowed up with his family.

A domineering family of inlaws can assume entitlement to your time at a level that you simply have no wish to allow.

OP has developed a life of her own I assume and has married this man.
She may not want to suddenly feel this group of people that she likes, but who are certainly not family to her, feeling like they can dictate her time.

Yes she is married to him, but she may not have realised this would become an issue OR he may simply have hid this from her.

THAT is why she needs to start as she means to go.

The alternative is unthinkable IMO.
Her family living the other side of the world and his family expect to be dictating to her about all festive occasions going forward.

Because not drinking is easier?
And cheaper.
And more flexible.
(OP has said in a followup they don't drink anyway).

Hour long taxi at Christmas ££££
They don't drink so why use a taxi.

Why?
If they want some sex they are hardly going to do it with his parents in the next room.

Sorry to be blunt but bathrooms, and tradition is only a part of it. Privacy is a massive part of what's going on

You said 'DH thinks we should just do whatever makes her happy.'

I have not read the full thread, but as we say here on MN, you have a DH problem. This is not about her, it is about how he prioritises her over you.

If he is keeping her happy for a comfortable life, then the solution is for you to dig your heels in and make his life extremely uncomfortable if he does not prioritise you.
Spell it out to him: you are his wife, so now he has to put you first. If he fails to do so, tell him that the marriage will not last. This is not an idle threat - no marriage can survive a man continually putting his mother before his wife.

Never concern yourself about feeling you are being "rude" to her. She is the one being rude by trying to impose herself and get her own way, so it is not rude to stand up to her.

e.g. for occasions like the surprise BBQ, if it happens again, just don't go, and don't engage with her - let DH relay the message that you are not going.
Then if DH goes without you, have an almighty flaming row when he gets back and make his life hell. Repeat the message that he has to put you first. He might choose differently next time.

Time to start a new tradition.

The book would be irrelevant. Most white settler's, Christmas won't have much to do with Māori heritage and it's patronising to think because MIL is older, she doesn't already know all she needs to about it. Hana-Rawhiti Kareariki Maipi-Clarke, doing the Haka in parliament sparked interest in what was going on. I'm probably MIL's age, yet recommended the film, the Nightingale 2018, on another thread.
Only on MN is a man emeshed with his Mother if he wants the odd Christmas with her.
@BitTooEarlyForXmas you have a honest conversation with him. Being in a couple means compromise. You set out not wanting every Christmas with them and go from there. They aren't likely to add another bathroom, so that's were you need to compromise, or forgo spending the odd Christmas with your DP. You got with him knowing he was close to his family. The other things are on you not being forceful enough. Tbf, MIL is right, the majority of people try to have at least one Christmas out of three, with their parents, unless there are relationship issues/disfunction/toxicity etc. It can be Christmas Eve or Boxing day.

This

for occasions like the surprise BBQ, if it happens again, just don't go, and don't engage with her - let DH relay the message that you are not going.
Then if DH goes without you, have an almighty flaming row when he gets back and make his life hell. Repeat the message that he has to put you first. He might choose differently next time.

Blimey.

Why don't you compromise? Drive over Christmas morning, stay Christmas night, leave Boxing Day morning. Then make sure husband knows that next year you're spending Christmas in the Maldives. You need to nip MIL's bossiness in the bud.

Gosh that's so true isn't it !

why not do that next year and maldives this?
As is often the case here, from reading the OP's other posts, the Aibu is the tip of the iceberg.

I am you but further down the line and it reallllly doesn’t get better if you don’t nip it in the bud.

If he was happy for you to not spend Christmas with your parents in NZ why is there not the same energy now for what you BOTH want?

Also….. “DH thinks we should just do whatever makes her happy.”

🚩

What about making his flipping wife happy?!

God, I have two sons and I’m going to ask my friends to shoot me if they ever catch me pulling this shit with them as grown adults.

Why blimey?

In most normal situations it may seem a bit much. But in the case where the MIL lacks boundaries and the son is enmeshed, a strong approach may be just the ticket…

Your DH and his mother are emeshed. Your husband is stuck in the FOG (fear guilt obligation). It's a result of growing up with a parent who uses emotional manipulation to guarantee compliance by creating a fear of rejection, a sense of deep obligation to keep her happy, and intense guilt when prioritising themselves or others over her.

MIL used to have zero boundaries, and my husband was stuck in the FOG. I made my husband choose therapy or divorce. He chose therapy. It took a while but he did see the issue after therapy, and has now addressed his FOG AND developed really strong boundaries.

There's also a great analogy that explains the dynamics you're both dealing with.

Don't rock the boat.

At some point in her youth, Mum/MIL gave the boat a little nudge. And look how everyone jumped to steady the boat! So she does it again, and again. Soon her family is in the habit of swaying to counteract the crazy. She moves left, they move right, balance is restored (temporarily). Life goes on. People move on to boats of their own.

The boat-rocker can't survive in a boat by herself. She's never had to face the consequences of her rocking. She'll tip over. So she finds an enabler: someone so proud of his boat-steadying skills that he secretly (or not so secretly) lives for the rocking.

The boat-rocker escalates. The boat-steadier can't manage alone, but can't let the boat tip. After all, he's the best boat-steadier ever, and that can't be true if his boat capsizes, so therefore his boat can't capsize. How can they fix the situation?

Ballast!

And the next generation of boat-steadiers is born.

A born boat-steadier doesn't know that solid ground feels like. He's so used to the constant swaying that anything else feels wrong and he'll fall over. There's a good chance the boat-rocker never taught him to swim either. He'll jump at the slightest twitch like his life depends on it, because it did .

When you're in their boat, you're expected to help steady it. When you decline, the other boat-steadiers get resentful. Look at you, just sitting there while they do all the work! They don't see that you aren't the one making the boat rock. They might not even see the life rafts available for them to get out. All they know is that the boat can't be allowed to tip, and you're not helping.

Now you and your partner get a boat of your own. With him not there, the balance of the boat changes. The remaining boat-steadiers have to work even harder.

While a rocking boat is most concerning to those inside, it does cause ripples. The nearby boats start to worry. They're getting splashed! Somebody do something!

So the flying monkeys are dispatched. Can't you and your partner see how much better it is for everyone (else) if you just get back on the boat and keep it steady? It would make their lives so much easier.

You know what would be easier? If they all just chucked the bitch overboard."

Good luck x

the phrasing on the first few posts all suggests that DH doesn't really want to go (or care) and he is just choosing mother over wife...

But what if he actually wants to go for himself? Maybe he likes his family's tradition, and would be willing to give it up if your family were here, but given they aren't, why would he spend less time with his family? Because his wife can't share a bathroom...

My family do the whole staying over at Christmas thing - its what we have always done, like your DH's family, and I am willing to give it up - for my ILs, because that is fair.. but if they weren't in the picture, and my partner said to me "Give up your tradition" so that we can spend more time on our own?

That would be a big debate. Not because I'm giving in to my family, but because it is what I want. I'm sure we would come to some compromise, just like you two eventually will.

Agree you have a DH problem and he is enmeshed with his mother. This issue is much bigger than Christmas.

We deliberately had Christmas Day on our own the first year we were married, because we knew that with DH's parents especially, following their tradition once would mean we ended up locked in that pattern forever whether we wanted it or not. It really helped.

Have you told him it was a crappy birthday?