To think "half your age plus seven" is a massive pile of nonsense?

[TransportNerd]

Mumsnet seems to take a very dim view of age gap relationships, far more so than I think the general population does. I've seen plenty of age gap relationships work just fine.

Every single time they're discussed here, though, someone wheels out the "rule" that you shouldn't date someone younger than half your age plus seven years.

People treat it like it's absolutely set in stone, and that breaking this "rule" is some sort of disgusting taboo. I've even seen someone argue it should be enshrined in law, with penalties for those who break it.

Personally, I've always thought it was complete nonsense. It was simply something in a French novel in the early 1900s. It doesn't really take anything important into account, and ignores the principle that consenting adults can do what they like.

Quite apart from anything else, why is it plus seven? Why not five, eight or ten? I'm sure it's only seven because that's a number that's had mystic significance since ancient times. Not a good basis for making laws!

Anyway:

YABU - yes, it's a rule and shouldn't be broken
YANBU - it's a big pile of nonsense and doesn't mean anything

Don’t be silly. A significant age gap for me is where the younger person (usually the woman) is under 23-25 and the older one is somewhere in their 30s approx. I don’t follow an equation as such, as it’s relationship-specific. But I will always hate a relationship where one is under 20 and one is over 25-30. There will be some outliers who make it till the end, but there is no denying that there is a power imbalance at the start.

Are just talking about illegal relationships here?

Almost-17 and just-turned 15 is not fine in my opinion and experience.
16 is the age of consent

Well I have not voted because I think your criteria are too extreme. It is certainly not an unbreakable rule, but neither do I think it is a complete pile of nonsense. Rather I think it is a guideline that has a certain amount of wisdom about it.

The way it is weighted means that the younger you are the closer the age gap that meets it's approval. That all makes perfect sense to me. It would frown on a 20 year old dating a 16 year old but approve (just) the 20 year old dating a 17 year old. Well one year at that age can make a big difference in maturity and the bigger the age gap and the younger the youngest person is, the more likely it could be a controlling relationship IMO.

It does allow bigger gaps the older you are and, again, that seems reasonable when both parties can be presumed to know what they are doing. I hear what some people say about big age gaps in much older couples where one might end up being a carer, but I assume the 37 year old marrying the 60 year old is not a giddy young thing who can't do basic arithmetic and has accepted this as a probability

There are people, men, who come on mumsnet to push their age gap relationships agenda. They’ve admitted it on Reddit. Some admit they’re men when telling their stories, and some pretend to be women who are in relationships with much younger men or who are considering being in one. There was a thread a while ago about a woman in her 40s who had apparently been propositioned by a man in his early 20s and that was one of those men on here pretending to push their agenda and to normalise age gap relationships. They want to normalise 50 year old women with 20 year old men, so they can be a 50 year old man with a 20 year old woman and not be called a creep.

For that reason, I never believe any of the ‘I’m a 48 year old woman fucking a 22 year old man from my gym’ type threads on here.

I don’t think ‘the rule’ matters much when people get to late twenties as they have likely had enough experience to know what they want and make their choices, but when you’re talking about late teens and early 20s, age gap relationships can be really problematic.

I am 46, so half plus 7 would be 30. I am in a relationship, but there is no way I would date someone aged 30 if I wasn’t. Completely different life stages for a start!

You will always get the anecdotes of people being 17 when they met their 35 year old partner and telling us that they’ve been happily married for 20 years and that it’s not creep at all etc.

Someone actually did say it should be the law on a recent thread!

I mean there are no rules, but as a 40 year old woman I have no desire to sleep with a 27 year old man.

No - not at all.

There is nothing illegal about a 40 year old dating a 19 year old

Yeah, some will make it to the end because they don't know any different. That's the attraction with age gap relationships where the younger party is a teen/early 20s. Anyone over 30 who chooses this set up knows exactly what they are doing.

It's not 'age-gap' relationships in general that are the problem. It's the age of the youngest party + the gap.
No, age is not just a number
No, you are not more mature than girls/guys around my age (but I know you will believe it and be appropriately flattered)
No, potential partners around my age actually do want a serious relationship( I just can't cut it or, whatever is wrong with me and steering me towards a young, moldable partner ,is clearly evident to them)

You only need that power imbalance at the start. The older partner has had many more years to perfect their game

I don’t really think of 7 years as an age gap relationship. I would say 10+ years, not that I have a problem with a 10 year gap, just that it’s my personal (arbitrary) threshold for referring to an age gap

Yeah, six years between me and DH, met when we were 26 and 32, I don't see this as even approaching an age gap relationship so I don't think 7 years is one. Sounds like there's a health gap, but that will happen to a lot of couples as they age.

That would mean, at 37, I can date a 25 year old. No thank you 🤢 I'll stick to my own age

I just did the maths (I knew this rule but for some reason hadn't before) and DH and I were just within the rule when we got together. I think that's fair to be honest - I actually think we would never had dated if I'd known his age up front because he would have been in my 'old man' box. He didn't lie or mislead at all, it's just he looked a lot younger than he was and I had become interested by the time I found out the age gap (26 and 35). To be 'against' the rule he would have had to have been 39 and I think that likely would have been too much.

Obviously it's not a firm rule, but when the age gap gets big there can be power dynamic issues, and possibly even more importantly life stage difference. That doesn't mean you can't get an unusually mature younger person - it happens - but equally I that it often works because the older person is also immature for their age. That means as the younger person matures there can be issues - if you have a 40 year old who enjoys hanging out with a 20 year old, will that work as the 20 year old matures and the 40 year old doesn't?

I look back on some things now about the way DH was living when I first met him and think 'hmmm'. It made complete sense to a 26 year old because that was how everyone I knew lived and if anything he was ahead of other people I knew. The extent to which he was a disorganized chaotic mess only came out later when I started to get my act in gear and it became apparent he didn't/couldn't. It has worked for us (20 years later) but there have definitely been challenges. Not necessarily caused by the age gap, but the age gap masked the extent of some of our differences in the early days. If I had been 35 there's no way I would have dated DH for long.

Also no one will persuade me that age gap doesn't ever matter. A 16 year old dating a 50 year old is not ok regardless of how mature each are, and the fact that it's legal. I could understand why the 16 year old might date a 50 year old, I find it disgusting of the 50 year old. There's just no way that's a meeting of minds relationship.

All of that is to say, it's a guide not a firm rule, but it absolutely is a good rule of thumb.

My ex's daughter who I am still good friends with married a 41 year old man when she was 22. They have just had a baby and seem very happy. It's obviously not what I would have chosen for her, and her own mother was incandescent, however it's all working out so far. I wouldn't recommend it though.

My exH is now with someone 11 years younger. We are still good friends and our conversation is peppered with references to music, comedy, TV shows, stuff that happened when we were young. I sometimes wonder what they talk about, But again, it's none of my business.

Well that means you think im a scam poster then 😂

If you met my DP you wouldnt think he was in his 20s.

Not everyone in their 20s is immature, wants to party, wants to sleep around, is social media obsessed, drinks, drugs etc

Not everyone in their 40s are mature, compassionate, have emotional intelligence, good work ethic etc

I have more in common with my DP than any other relationship ive been in.

You are stereotyping and assuming so much with your post

There's a difference between something "made up" by a democratically elected parliament and something made up by someone's mate in the pub 😂

I wouldn't classify this as an age gap relationship - maybe if you got together very young it would have violated the rule, but the concern then wouldn't have been aging but power dynamics/maturity.

What you're describing is something that unfortunately just can happen in any long term relationship. Sometimes one couple ends up having medical issues that mean the other's life gets impacted. I know of one couple where one person got early onset dementia in their early 50s. It wasn't an age gap relationship but you can bet that killed the other person's retirement plans. I know of others where the younger partner has had something happen which has led to very restricted mobility in their late 30s. Similarly, over the course of relationships people become disabled, have mental health issues etc. It's not all down to age, if you're talking 7 years it's obviously more likely the older partner has health issues first but it's hardly a given.

It's not a rule in the way your implying OP, it's a sort of rough guide and an attempt to quantify when people become uncomfortable. The posts you are refering to are probably hyperbole for comedy effect.

It's also not saying that anything goes if it meets the rule, obviously being a child, teacher, siblings etc is more fundamental.

I think if you surveyed a lot a people, showing them different relationships and asked which seemed fine and which seemed a bit creepy, you would probably end up with a similar formula. Obviously there are limits, kids not included and it might vary a bit for older male versus older female or same sex relationships. People will vary within that, but I'd be surprised if the population average was hugely different. What do you think it is, not your opinion, but what you think our society starts to find too big a gap?

Age difference shouldn’t really matter, but personally I wouldn’t want to go out with someone half my age plus seven, I’d have kids older than them

Said every paedophile ever….

Not saying you’re one, but you’re following that logic.

There’s a HUGE difference between a law that’s been put in place following massive consideration and review, and put into statute by Parliament…. and a rule of thumb someone dreamt up one day.

The age of consent is the former, 1/2 age + 7 is the latter.

Genuine question though (and you do you) - do you not worry that he will grow out of wanting to be with someone who isn't mature or compassionate, and doesn't have emotional intelligence or good work ethic? It seems odd that someone who is a mature 27 year old would not gravitate overtime to wanting those things in a partner.

(This assumes this isn't a 'fun for now' type relationship on both sides).

No. But it does not mean it’s right.

Great post. And I completely agree that it is the age of the younger party that is most significant.

Presumably because the age of consent, if misused as an "age over which you're available to people double and triple your age" rule, suggests that a "couple" aged 16 and 48 is fine, but a couple with an age gap of under a week, aged 15 years 364 days and 16 years and 1 day isn't fine. It's age of consent to sex not a relationship law - nobody has to jump into bed immediately.

Other countries have more complex age of consent laws which do enshrine maximum age gaps for under 18s.

Exactly!

An immature 35 year old will always be immature - does the mature 19 year old want to parent her immature 45 year old partner simultaneously with her first child when she's a mature 29 year old? If she does then what she is is perhaps not best described with the word mature.