To think "half your age plus seven" is a massive pile of nonsense?

[TransportNerd]

Mumsnet seems to take a very dim view of age gap relationships, far more so than I think the general population does. I've seen plenty of age gap relationships work just fine.

Every single time they're discussed here, though, someone wheels out the "rule" that you shouldn't date someone younger than half your age plus seven years.

People treat it like it's absolutely set in stone, and that breaking this "rule" is some sort of disgusting taboo. I've even seen someone argue it should be enshrined in law, with penalties for those who break it.

Personally, I've always thought it was complete nonsense. It was simply something in a French novel in the early 1900s. It doesn't really take anything important into account, and ignores the principle that consenting adults can do what they like.

Quite apart from anything else, why is it plus seven? Why not five, eight or ten? I'm sure it's only seven because that's a number that's had mystic significance since ancient times. Not a good basis for making laws!

Anyway:

YABU - yes, it's a rule and shouldn't be broken
YANBU - it's a big pile of nonsense and doesn't mean anything

Agreed. I am a few years younger than my DH and we met when I was 23. I think he'd be quite bemused at the idea he's a controlling abuser!

I mean it does make some sense at 40 you have no business dating someone under 27

From my perspective, relationships with a clear power imbalance are creepy. I'm sure someone is going to come on and talk about their entirely healthy 30 year age gap (and probably say some rubbish like their dh is "just young at heart" or they are "so mature for their age").

But, as a woman in my 40s, people in their 20s look like kids, not viable life partners. I've never met a man who was actively seeking a relationship with a significantly younger woman who wasn't an absolute creep who wanted power over their partner. I just don't trust it.

Didn't Les Dawson marry a much younger second wife and father a child with her in his 60s, but die when the child was a few months old? That does also rather show age gap relationships as high risk.

It is something people used to say when I was at school. I think it makes sense for younger people. It means essentially this would be the youngest acceptable partner at different ages, and they all feel about right to me.

16 = 15
18 = 16
21 = 17
25 = 19
28 = 21
35 = 24

But TBH once everyone is over about 25 I feel like adults are adults and can date whoever they want without anyone getting concerned. In law that's 16 or 18 depending on various things but you can't tell me a 40 year old pursuing a 19 year old is not a bit creepy. It completely is. I don't know whether it's off to the point that the law should get involved, but I would be really uncomfortable if my late teens/early 20s child was dating a middle aged adult.

Seven seems to work because 14 is the point where it evens out. You could use 8 if you wanted it to even out at 16 instead.

Hmm. I’m 44 and I think I’d maybe struggle not to get irritated by a 29 year old, no matter how attractive he was!

Ridiculous rule.

I am 50 and wouldn't want to date a 32 year old man. I think 10 years younger would be the max (if I were single)

I most definitely wouldn't date an 86 year old man, which is the rule the other way... That's even worse!! I probably wouldn't date over 55 to be fair, I am quite 'young' for my age, in terms of looks, lifestyle, outlook, interests, cultural references etc and have more in common with people in their 40s. My friend who is younger than me is better suited to someone older though (she says that herself, it's not me being rude about her). I didn't go to uni until I was 24, so my 'cohort' is 5-6 years younger than me, and this has kind of stayed the same throughout my life, particular as I went on to do various post grad quals, and my career has been in line with that age group.

One of the problems is, of course, that very young adults who believe themselves mature are often actually very young for their ages but have been forced to behave as adults before their time (parentified) or feel out of step with their age cohort due to different interests/ neurodiversity/ being shy or whatever and mistake this for maturity.

Meanwhile "young for their age" men are usually not youthful in the sense of a younger, emotionally stable, person but rather have some social and emotional issues.

One of my cousins needed rescuing from a string of relationships with older men, when she was in her teens and twenties. Every time they turned out to be unstable and/ or chronically unreliable after six to eighteen months, and she had stereotypically "older" interests (cooking , pets, city breaks, quiet nights in) but was quite insecure and not really"mature" emotionally at all. One guy's parents were in absolute seriousness very angry that she hadn't looked after him better on holiday, because he deliberately stopped taking necessary medication he'd been on for years as he wanted to (and did) drink alcohol - this had serious reproductions after they got back - the man was nearly 30 and she was 18! Doesn't even break the half plus seven rule, but generally anyone choosing that age gap isn't a stable, mature person looking for an equal partner.

I couldn't stand a 29 year old either (that's 4 years older than me) I'd probably have absolutely nothing in common with him, and certainly wouldn't be attracted to him.
I've only ever been attracted to people at least 15 or 16 years older than me, haven't had a boyfriend exactly my own age since I was 12, and I didn't have much choice then!

O...k...

There’s more than a few people on that thread who think that 66 year old woman seeing my 37 year old friend is totally fine. I’ve also stated there I’ve no issue with it but it did shock me.

We can all say ‘adults can date other adults regardless of age’ but a huge age gap can shock people for all sorts of reasons.

This. As a rough guideline for maximum age gaps that reduce the likelihood of age based grooming, coercive control, and power imbalances, especially for the under 30s, it works and scales well.

Can there be relationships that don't follow the rule and turn out fine? Yes. Are there relationships within the rule that aren't fine? Also yes. But as a rule of thumb, it does eliminate the factor of age based power imbalances.

I think this is spot on!

It puts my concerns about age gap relationships in words.

I'm not very convinced that balance of power necessarily lies with the older partner invariably. Youth and beauty are powerful currencies.

Mostly though, once you're 21 I don't care if you want to go out with Methuselah. You're an adult, crack on.

In my experience, around 7 times out of 10, if there's a significant (bigger than half your age plus seven) age gap, where the woman is under 25, the man most definitely has the power, and wields it. Although the woman might not always (initially) realise that. Youth and beauty are of very little substance when they come up against life experience, and the ability to manipulate someone who is actually much less mature than they think they are.

Personally, I think the rule is a good way to discuss age related power imbalances with young people, and point out that 37-year-old Greg never wants to date 18-year-old Sarah because she's so mature and special, it's because she's an easily manipulated young person who doesn't realise what Greg's wiser female peers do – that he's a creep, and a walking red flag.

My husband and I met when he was 23 and I was very nearly 19, so right on the cusp of the rule. I do think that in many other circumstances he'd have been too old for me. As it was, he'd had a couple of gap years (started uni at 20) and I went to nursing college so had been "working". I think it I'd have been doing my A levels and he'd have been a graduate, the gap would have been too big.

Of the age gap relationships I've personally known, most tend to be older women. I've not noticed a massive power imbalance, that being said I'm not including 18 year olds here, but 21 and over it's really no-one's business.

My ex was actually eight years older than me but there was definitely no power/maturity imbalance, we felt roughtly the same age.

I don't think age gap relationships should be considered acceptable tbh.
I was 18 dating a 40 year old. My current DH was the same. We both spent 10 years being abused and controlled by horrible people who couldn't get anyone their own age to stick around. We have now been together for years. Our exes both have a string of people leaving and calling them abusive. Because they're now way too old to catch teenagers.

My dad hated it. My boyfriend was his age. His friend, also his age, was dating someone my age too. That he loved. Because it's great for the older person, not great for the younger person.

People should be dating people at their own life stage, their own power level.

If you're older and targeting younger/ less powerful people, you're doing that for a reason and it does not reflect well on you.

That's not the same as 28 dating a 50 year old though. Adults can make their own minds up about who they want to be with.

I wonder if you'd feel that way if the 21 year old was your daughter. I think when you're imagining the younger party being your peer or not younger than you enough to be your child, the perspective is different to that of a parent of 21 year olds...

I must say I would prefer my children stick to partners around their own ages, though I appreciate that a mother you keep any doubts to yourself unless asked so as to be around to support and pick up the pieces (rather than being pushed away if you point out a partner is looking rather red and flag like).

Sorry I think youve misunderstood my post or ive misunderstood yours 😂
Im.not saying im NOT those things at all 😂😂

My point was that not all 20 somethings are immature and not all 40 year olds are mature

Its definitely not a "fun for now" relationship we are committed etc I think i just didnt explain myself very well in the post!

He wanted a deep connection with someone, not a ONS type person, nor a party animal, nothing in common with girls his age. Even his mum said he would end up with someone older.....so my point was is that you cant really stereotype based on a number like lots of people do

Ridiculous rule. I am 50 and wouldn't want to date a 32 year old man. I think 10 years younger would be the max (if I were single)

The rule isn't that you have to date someone half your age plus 7 😂

I think 25 is safer – it means the younger person will have been able to go to higher education, and probably have a few years in the workforce.

As I said, there are exceptions; it's a major generalisation. My DH and I are actually eight years apart, but I was a very experienced (in the worst ways) young adult who was excellent at appearing more mature, and he just happened to be a rare, wholly good egg. It worked out for us, but from what I've seen in others and myself before him, generally it's not something I'd recommend.

Half your age plus seven is just a handy way to remind oneself of the common issues with age gaps, I think.

But it would be irrelevant - it would be my adult daughter's life, not mine, and nothing I could do about it. My own mother married at that age.

I can hand on heart say that my experience with an eight year gap, the gap felt wholly irrelevant. We had issues, and eventually I broke up with him, but that was nothing to do with his age, and he wasn't at all controlling either.
But then again I wasn't drawn to him because he was older, wealthier or more mature - he was skint, immature and looked much younger than his age - he was hot though.

Same boyfriend has a brief fling with a 19 year old after we split - she pursued him relentlessly, was a bit of a psycho and freaked him out. He definitely didn't exploit or manipulate her.