To be fed up of hearing 'just get on with it'?

[glitterpaperchain]

This kind of 'just get on with it' RE the heat is all over Facebook. People talking about the heat in 1976 and saying 'we just got on with it' or 'we muddled through' (as if people didn't die as a result of that heatwave)

My issue is - shouldn't we as a society be aiming higher than just getting on with things and muddling through? We should be campaigning for better infrastructure, better working practices.

I just think we have all this technology, we're supposed to be a rich country, let's fight to make things better rather than just managing. What happened to the spirit of the first union workers who demanded better conditions and rights? I want to see that spirit back.

It was neither the Mail nor the Telegraph.

I'm pretty sure portable air conditioners work just as well in flats as houses. Hose out of window. Shut curtains and off you go.
Poor delivery man might have to lug it up a few flights of stairs if you don't have a lift but otherwise it's exactly the same.

@MasterBeth
I don't think you can compare them.

It can be true that the drought and heatwave of 1976 were more severe as a single period of time, while also being true that changing weather patterns are creating bigger long-term problems

Four or five really hot days are not the same as several weeks of sustained heat combined with a severe drought. In 1976, water use was restricted in parts of the country and some areas had major supply issues. Either one of those on their would have been challenging, but together... Lets ask the people of Kent about water shortages!

If we are comparing specific heatwaves, then 1976 remains the benchmark against which everything else is measured. If we are discussing broader weather patterns and long-term climate risks, then that is a whole different conversation altogether.

I really genuinely don't understand your perspective.

People died in a war, so no one can ever want to improve lives now?

"The UK is stinking" well yes that's kind of exactly my point. Why aren't we seeing collective action? This weather is just one example. As much as you try to minimise it, many people will die and be hospitalised. Babies and the elderly will suffer. What would motivate someone to ignore that, shrug their shoulders, and say 'stop moaning get on it with it'? Why would some rather do that than campaign to make that situation better?

I agree that on average it is getting hotter.
We also have portable air conditioners that are relatively cheap which we did not have in the seventies. Problem solved.

Of course you should just get on with it. We live in the easiest and most convenient of times. How easy do you want your life to be. A little resilience goes a long way. A little discomfort is actually very healthy.

That poster was correct. We can stamp our feet and mobilise all we like but the country cannot afford the transformation you think we should demand. You can however make changes to your own life and property - I’ve just replaced our plastic grass with real, am replacing our car with one with air con, and am looking at air con units for the house (just a small one we can use in the room the kids sleep in).

Why should we not continue to strive to make life better and better?

Because that’s fantasy thinking. You haven’t yet answered; who funds the billions of pounds of change you want to see?

Oh we can't afford it? Ah let's not do anything then. Shrug.

Or maybe we could work to find ways to afford things that will improve lives?

Seriously why are people so passive and so content with things when they could be better? A lack of ambition?

It's getting hotter. And will continue to get hotter. AC will keep your bedroom cool. What about everywhere else? Like... the outside?

No it isn't.

Think about when the NHS was created. How many people must have said that creating national free healthcare was fantasy thinking.

Change takes ambition. Where's that gone? It's so sad. 'Making life better would be hard so let's not do it'

After WW2 we had many different taxes which redistributed wealth. This is how we paid for the NHS, social housing, and other initiatives that truly changed people's lives. Many of those taxes no longer exist, hence the huge increase in wealth disparity.

The UK is sinking because it is broke. Actually worse than that, it is in huge amounts of debt and with interest rates much higher than they ever were before.
We have problems coming out of our ears. We don't have enough defence, we don't have enough police, our schools are not working terribly well, our A&E is embarrassing. Our welfare bill is embarrassing. We have homelessness and we have continued immigration despite the above.

We are broke and needing to fix all of the above. Pretty sure in the event the UK can turn things around and grow the economy/pay down the debt, the above will be a higher priority than giving everyone a free airconditioner.

I mean seriously order one tonight from argos, pick it up first thing tomorrow, plug it in and spend tomorrow cool and relaxed. Really don't think we need 'collective action' to do that.

Sadly I am unable to offer any such quick fixes to the rest of the UK's problems.

So by all means improve your life but do it yourself and stop expecting 'the govt' or 'society' to do it for you.

the intensity of the heat we are experiencing now is worse, the frequency of the heat events is worse and the global situation is worse than 1976.

This is indeed true and extremely worrying - which is why we ought to focus resources on improving energy efficiency and generating renewable energy…… rather than rush out and install AC everywhere and consume yet more energy.

Well you’re not wrong but on a day-to-day basis we do need to get on with life. I’ve had a classroom of teenagers refusing to pick pens up because it was too hot. It was 24 degrees! We do need to get on with it.

Ok now I'm sure you're wilfully missing the point.

The heat is one example. There are many areas of life where people have this attitude of just get on with it, muddle through.

I'm assuming from your continued suggestion of 'just buy an air conditioner' and your horror at the idea that the government actually gets involved with impacting people's lives, that you are a libertarian in favour of low-regulation capitalism?

Tbf we have no more than 10 days a year like this. The same in winter with the snow. It’s really is a waste of money to put infrastructure in place for every eventuality. If the government was to turn round now and suggest we had air con installed in all buildings etc I’d be really pissed off. We have a struggling nhs and just last week the defence secretary quit because we want spend money to protect the country in a time the world is in a very hostile state

How do you think the NHS is faring in a heatwave?

Energy is not problematic.

Fossil fuel energy is problematic.

As the nation gets hotter we will need more AC to be climate resilient. (We may need less heating.)

We need to power it with sustainable energy.

And let me guess you’re one of those posters who think taxing billionaires will give us everything we want for free?

Tbf we have no more than 10 days a year like this.

Tbf we have no more than 10 days a year like this now.

In order to make sure our economy continues to function, we have to make sure we don't lose more and more productivity to climate events.

The same way they fare in the winter.

It's not free, the billionaires will be paying 😉

Back in the forties, old people died quickly at a much younger age. There was no extended healthcare keeping them alive for years and years. The NHS was never set up to do that. It was set up to deal with a much smaller population, to treat a far smaller number of illnesses. Now we keep pre term babies alive much earlier and whilst on the surface this seems like a good thing might be contributing to the huge number of additional needs/disabled kids we now seem to have. So more costs for hospitals, more costs for schools.

Nowadays we have a top heavy society with older people outnumbering young people. So pensions are higher, NHS is a much bigger cost (and really not viable any more) and we have hardly anyone working. The youngsters that we do have seem to either be on benefits for mental health or unable to find work (per mumsnet threads).
Anyone who can retire early is doing so and others are limiting their hours to claim benefits or avoid tax thresholds.

Thus income today from the working population is down, the costs are up and the books no longer balance. Comparing now to the forties without considering all the differences is completely unhelpful.

We are just about to get an inexperienced PM who is more left leaning than KS and look at the mess he made, spending more than he 'earned'.

If we got a really great PM who was strong and had long term view (Maggie T for example) we might have a chance of turning things around.
Even then it would be a long road. There are tough decisions to be made.
The NHS needs to be at least a co-pay system. The triple locks needs abolished. Most of the welfare needs slashed. We might then have a chance to spend money in the right areas to get the economy going.

However I've drafted a letter for you.

Dear IMF
When you come in to bail out the UK please do something about the hot summers before you address everything else.
The benefits office was very uncomfortable when I went to sign on for my free money.

Yours entitled non adult

I'm genuinely not sure if you're deliberately missing my points to troll, or if you're just struggling to understand me

The NHS is different now yes it doesn't take a genius to know that, it's not necessary to write a long explanation.

What I said was, at the time it was created, it was difficult and many people would've dismissed it as 'fantasy thinking', but they did it. I'm asking, where is that ambition now? Where is the will to do the hard things? To make positive changes even if it's difficult?