To think long term affairs are like a form of fraud really

[paddleboardingmum]

Or a scam or something? Yet another of my friends has been cheated on (long marriage, teenage kids) in a situation where he's been in an affair for years. By doing that you're not only living a lie but really it's conning the other person isn't it? I'm not saying it should be a crime as such, just thinking about the deceit factor with this type of situation.

I think it's more complicated than that.

What if it is a sexless marriage?

Or the other party works away all the time or stops having any energy for you or stops hugging or kissing or becomes mean and selfish (perhaps because they're suffering because this life is hard).

It is shit when shit stuff happens but it's not as simple as saying send him to jail. And many women have extra marital relationships too.

That is not the subject of this thread.

It is shit when shit stuff happens but it's not as simple as saying send him to jail. And many women have extra marital relationships too.

Which nobody has said. Neither have people said it's just men who do it. As for excuses, people make a choice. Sexless marriage? they could leave or they could tell their partner what they are doing. Very different situation.

Who said anything about murder?

Are you ok?

I’d ignore this weirdo. Tangent king and completely missing the point of the thread.

Yes. Quick to say they haven't been cheated on, very keen to minimise cheating and the effects...leaves a logical conclusion.

Accountability and consequences are scary.

I'm not sure why my posts above were deleted. I don't think anyone should be punished for relationships in any way - we can only make decisions for ourselves and see what happens. I might have been cheated on and not know. I don't think it's that important.

Are you saying we should all ignore socialisation? All social rules and laws exist because of socialisation.

Experiencing something as painful 'only because we are socialised to feel that way' does nothing to diminish the disrespect and humiliation and the management of physical (health) practical, financial and ongoing issues.

Everything is socialisation. It's the way humans live. If you want to live outside of that, that is fine, but don't engage those in your ways without informing them first.

I have never in any post ever said I want adultery to be a crime, so why are suggesting I want to move to a country that prosecutes it as such?

I recognise you are unable to understand written English and respond appropriately. Also fully lacking in empathy and unable to recognise nuance.

I think it's better to have logical reactions than conditioned ones, absolutely.

Do tell, what human has had no social conditioning and can give a purely logical response to anything?

I agree that it is a slippery slope. What about 'till death us do part'. If we are able to sue for someone cheating, what about someone not cheating but deciding to leave. That is not what the other party signed up for, they commited for life so should they get compesation? What about marrying someone and the honeymoon period ends, and personalities change. Can you sue if the person becomes different to the partner you married? Or if the partner isn't as supportive as you would like them to be in sickness?

I do think it's awful. Same as any deliberate kind of romantic behaviour, like dating someone just for money, ghosting people, abandoning your partner when they need you, always thinking the grass is greener-all these things hurt more than someone stealing from you (which IS illegal). But unless we make adultery a crime, don't know what else we can do really? Social stigma used to proscribe certain behaviours, but would we want to be like that?

Thats not the only deal they sign up for though is it

You got there before i did.

I think part of the problem (a relatively minor part, but still...) is general misunderstanding of what the legal part of a wedding actually is.
There is so much talk about writing your own vows and what you vow etc when thinking about planning a wedding, that it is very easy to assume that the things you promise in front of the audience are the things that you are signing up to contractually - but actually, the legal contract created by signing the register is very narrow and doesn't cover anything like that.
So cheating very definitely feels as if it is breach of a legal contract because of all the fuss around swearing and signing a legal contract in front of everyone, but most of the ceremony is purely decorative.

It happens all the time though. Look at the King.

I know a man who had serial affairs. Casual and long term. Basically got married too young (19) this was back in 1965. Wife found out about affairs, kept forgiving him and they’d move house to get away from the ‘floosie’ (wife’s term). He never stopped. Couldn’t help himself basically. Eventually met a woman who really knocked him for six and left his wife, but not until wife found out and chucked him out. Doubt he would have left if she hadn’t found out. I think the deceit becomes addictive. And hilariously the other woman didn’t really want him to leave as a part time relationship with a frisson of danger suited her perfectly. Anyway leave he did. Moved in with other woman, had a child together and eventually married. But his children from his first marriage never spoke to him again and he made no effort to find them. Relationship with new wife floundered on the rocks of age difference and indifference and he died a lonely old man.

🤷‍♀️

Then remove the until death do us do part bit from your wedding vows.

It’s all about what you agree to. What you commit to. Those are the things to which you are held responsible. The standards to which you have agreed.

Not some “Oh we are all free and blame should not happen in relationships ” midlife crisis cobblers.

You agree to e.g. monogamy. It’s totally clear and mutually agreed often in public. You fail the agreement by cheating. Lying etc. What happens? Nothing really apart from immense pain, mental trauma and financial misery for your spouse and children.

Some posters think that being cheated on isn’t that important. That the pain you cause doesn’t matter because it’s your freedom and it’s twoo wuv. 🥰 🙄

Others think that because it’s the norm and even royals do it (like they’re a bastion of morality or something 🙄) therefore nothing can be done.
Something you both agree upon or even swear to in public becomes meaningless. No wonder people despair. Promises, fidelity and loyalty mean nothing even though one might have based their lives and their children’s lives upon these.

I agree with you OP. I wish as a people the British were better at confronting things head on, rather than taking the "none of my business" stance.

I have no respect for people that have affairs. None. And it colours my view of everything in their life - they made vows that are supposed to mean something - if the person that is supposed to mean the most to them can't even trust them, then how can I?

I know a guy who had an affair for a similar period of time. 3 children. One developed an eating disorder. Wife had a nervous breakdown.

Personally I don’t believe humans are designed for long term life partnerships. It only worked in the past because women stayed at home raising the bairns whilst the men killed the bison, worked down t’pit whatever.

We grow, change, move on, at different rates. I can count on one finger the number of my friends who are still happily married/in a long term relationship (60s).

In fact I only commented to a friend the other day what an anomaly it is (and shoots my theory up the arse rather) that some birds mate for life.

Whatever you believe in is irrelevant. It’s about what people - partnerships - agree to. And what is subsequently betrayed.

That is what is being discussed. It’s not hard.