To wonder why so many male migrants have committed sexual assaults:even if they are evil people, wouldn't staying in the UK be an incentive to abide by the law?

[Jane379]

I KNOW that plenty of the men who come are not evil and don't want to commit sexual assault. But clearly a number who have come are, and there's strong evidence that male migrants are disproportionately lileky to do so.

This almost surely at least partly caused by misogynistic culture in various areas meaning back home they perceived uncovered women as permissible to assault. But surely they know it's different here? That they will likely be caught? They are at least more likely to be punished here for assault.

Or are they convinced our police system will let them off?

Or they're not aware our norms are different?

Or just don't care about the consequences?

I wonder also if criminals are in a sense selected for since they may have little to tie them to their home countries, or even be escaping punishment there.

Well I haven’t faced these issues personally but if it looks like a duck etc… it’s just bloody common sense to me. Some people tie themselves up into knots so worried about being seen as racist. I think given the medieval attitudes to women in some countries- Pakistan, Afghanistan, parts of India, Sudan it’s not surprising that some young men come over here with those attitudes and attack women (who are not veiled/behind closed doors) these cultures are not compatible with Western living. Makes me mad. Women collateral damage as per usual.

And Germany still went full open borders

Due to the West's influence, primarily the US, the Shah went too far. Tehran ended up like Las Vegas by the end. The Islamic Revolution pushed things too far the other way, though, and look at Iran now.

Iran was one regime oppressing people and them a new regime came in which actually learnt how to oppress people "better" and stay in power.

I think it is showing off a lot of "only migrants" single mindedness ignoring the fact most women in UK are abused by men they know.

Men are the problem, wherever they are from. Even educating them and giving them free healthcare doesn't seem to change them, just makes them better at hiding their acts. Poverty is usually a precursor to most crime but it is usually perpetuated by men. Anywhere you get a lot of poor men will not be safe for women (and other men). I don't know why stating that would make me liberal minded, just a realistic feminist who knows it doesn't matter where men come from, they are often a threat to women.

Let's not import more men from the 3rd world.

Yes, we know that!!! But the point is that we have enough of our home grown offending men without importing groups who are MORE likely to offend against women statistically, from misogynistic societies. The two can both be true you know. It’s not complicated.

It isn't complicated but not letting anyone in fleeing from men doing male things isn't the answer either. Going further right like the Taliban and evangelicalism is only going to increase the fear and violence on the streets a la Tommy R as it did over the weekend. Why would anyone want to encourage that and keep perpetuating the fake narrative that these violent apes are helping or protecting women?

I am definitely not a Tommy R fan- hateful
man. But rubbishing people’s genuine concerns just feeds him and his followers. It’s quite telling that you seem to assume I’m a TR fan from what I’ve posted

Intimate Partner Violence is horrific and disgusting but higher in Sudan, Somalia , Afghanistan. I don't want to say it, but have you also heard of FGM.

The world bank gender portal says IPV is higher in Afghanistan than the UK.

We can’t not openly discuss the issues of a large number of young men who are here without families, from countries where all they have known is violence and who are mostly likely to hold misogynistic views towards women and views that western woman are less worthy because of the fear that racist thugs will use this argument

they are using it anyway

do you really believe if you take 100 men raised and educated here and 100 men from let’s say Afghanistan that they would hold the same opinions about women and how women should behave and what woman’s roles are in society, it’s not just about predatory men who sexually assault women it’s the views they hold about women and the place we hold in society

we are not supporting the far right but we want open and honest conversations about the impact and the safety of women and girls

Indeed. When you are accused of being a far right racist for having concerns about these issues, it is shutdown mode.
People in professional roles cannot risk being labelled a racist. It isn’t just toothless and unemployed that who are impacted or are concerned , it doesn’t mean anyone who has concerns wants to be like TR. Far from it.
What’s done is done as far as mass immigration but it needs to be stopped now, it’s out of control and costing Europe millions, so many women have already died or been sexually assaulted, it needs to stop.

Yes, I once thought that way too. Until...

Sorry, I only had time to get back to the thread tonight! Thanks for all the replies, I'll read & try & reply now.

Most women's first sexual encounter is as s child

• what?? That's terrible if so. Is it really so high? Do you have any link on this?

I agree age is definitely a factor.

Most are also coming without families. Men with families to support can obviously still be evil but have more incentive not to commit crime.

Exactly. I'm not saying all men from these cultures behave this way or think this way, just that some cultures foster mores that make it more likely.

Russia I read in the Times once has a proverb 'if he beats you, it means he loves you'. I need to research more on this, but if so, that's clearly the kind of mores which would facilitate DV!

For instance, sexual abuse is seemingly (it's hard to get data because it's generally hidden and not spoken of) highly prevalent amongst Amish communities. I would imagine that the 'traditional' lifestyle and ingrained misogyny of that sub-culture, along with its isolation from wider society, has something to do with that.

• re Amish, I actually read a book on this recently, can't remember the title but it would be a very sobering read for anyone who romanticised the Amish community. Any closed off community, especially with strong norms of male authority, is likely to foster that...

Hence why we don't need an excess of this demographic, who even if they don't commit any crimes are likely to take far more out of the system than they will ever put back.

• I think that's a bit unfair. Law abiding male migrants may be keen to work hard, and potentially advance.

Otoh I agree we cannot accept more migrants.

typical national tested IQs of many of the highest-offending origin countries is very low.

• why is this? I suspect lower IQ is at the root of a lot of this. Probably bad diet & health are is one element. Another element is generational cousin marriage, I suspect. These must be changed...but the UK has enough of its own problems.

chance of getting caught quickly is a much stronger deterrent than harshness of punishment. We do badly at this, ii) maybe they expect it to be treated as a minor crime at best, ie they don’t expect serious punishment even if caught, iii

• Also good points.

Don't just blame leftist Iranian women, many leftist men did too.

Thanks for giving your experience, that is very worrying.

I may be very inaccurate on this, but I wonder of some Muslim migrant countries have extra issues Malaysia does not due to issues like clan/honour morality. Eg. The Taliban are arguably more influenced by the Pashtun honour code of pashtunwali than by Islamic law re women.

Good point

This is disturbing. It's notable most people (including me) have been focusing on migrants from Muslim countries. But you seem to be suggesting former USSR men like Romanians are also often more dangerous ?

I wonder what the data says?

'Another person chimes in and said that's why Soviet soldiers were so feared in world war 2 and in Eastern European countries, as it was a license to rape many local women with no come backs.'

• is this person USSR? I'm partly Polish myself and my understanding is that the terrible sexual assaults by the Red Army were more due to poor army discipline, revenge on Nazis & the war environment in general. I wasn't under the impression most of the assaulters were simply doing what they had always wanted to do back in Russia. I will look into these claims.

Guy at my old worksite is of Turkish-Cypriot extraction. Back on the island and mainland- have Turks & Cypriots also been committing more SA? Again I'll check the data.

It's notable also that you're saying these men come from countries where rape is punished severely, so they're committing assaults here because they see it as softer, not because they think it's not a crime (as pps suggested re Muslim migrants potentially

Re English women being seen as sexually immoral, I think that is a belief in various places. I've heard about some in some Italian areas believing that for one, as you say it' probably a hangover from ladette culture era.