DH holiday misery - he’s fed up with the kids

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Writing this from what should be a dream holiday.
2 kids (3&4) who are generally terrible listeners, don’t care for consequences, don’t do as they’re told unless asked a million times. I am a laid back parent probably too laid back - but I also think they’re still young. DH however is not. He believes they’re should be sitting at the table speaking politely and enjoying family dinners peacefully every night.

he’s not enjoying himself one bit, kids are over excited, dysregulated, tired, a but run down but generally having a really lovely happy time. DH is so fed up, keeps saying it’s a waste of his time and money; how it’s ridiculous they just want me all the time, keeps hurrying then up like tonight trying to get them out and he says things like ‘we’re nit fucking around’ which I think is awful. He’s taken himself off to her tonight with no good night to anyone or omoffer if any help it’s feeling like he just Hayes his life!!

are aby 3/4 year olds that well behaved and eat everything ik their plate and don’t refuse food and have nice family conversation over lunch?

I wouldn't fancy sitting at a table for two hours with a volatile man after my usual bedtime. Or ever, really.

You need to unpack all this.
There are several issues here

Most of the thread agree he cant just unilaterally blame you which is what you (understandably) seem hung up on.
It's not right and he is just taking his frustration out on you.
But by sticking on this point you are missing the more fundamental stuff.

its clear you cant all go on as you are...
You maybe weren't specific enough in you op about how relaxed you are but you plural prob need to tal ka bit more about how you actively manage the kids.

I posted already but my kids are tricky...
I say "yes" to most things with no material impact because my kids are pretty defiant.
But at 2 and 4 my kids are not
generally terrible listeners, don’t care for consequences, don’t do as they’re told unless asked a million times

Kids who are like that are being parented by parents that dont have the right tools or techniques.

Please dont see this as more criticism... see it as intended. One mother trying to help another....

Ultimately you and he arent enjoying the kids. Because honestly who enjoys asking a million times.... you need to change it up and meet in the middle a bit.
Something like how to talk so kids listen might help you both...

Separately he needs to get a grip and stop being so emotionally flabby. He also needs to stop using you as a scapegoat for everyone's everything. Not cool.
But these are 2 separate issues.

He needs to set his expectations a bit lower, these are small children, not junior work colleagues. We had lovely holidays with our dc when they were small, but we made sure they were fed and entertained first, then we could relax and enjoy our meal.We didn't have tablets then, so they had colouring books and small toys to keep them happy while we ate. If all else failed, the promise of a nice dessert would usually keep them in check for a bit. We didn't sit for hours in restaurants, when we were finished it was back to the apartment and a nice glass of wine on the balcony once they were in bed. Not very exciting granted, but at least we got to relax. At the pool we took it in turns to watch them, so each of us could have a swim or read for a bit knowing the other was 'on duty'.

I'm not sure why everyone is expecting you to do all the parenting. Your DH doesn't seem to be doing any parenting - just having a tantrum because they're not behaving. I learned early on that if I had high expectations for a day out, I would always be disappointed and I'd beat myself up because no-one had a nice time.

I imagine he's a bit like my ex, who would get so cross if our DS (then about 2) didn't walk fast enough on a day out (he was looking at everything as 2 year olds do and I didn't want to stop him). He'd walk off ahead and when he wasn't looking I'd pick DS up and run to catch up and then as I saw him turning around I'd put him back down and pretend to be walking normally. My exH was a twat too....

Is that because you undermine him when he tries to impose discipline? Are you there saying ‘Chill out! It doesn’t matter..’ etc?
Be honest.

I had a feeling you’d come back saying something like that OP which is why I’d ask how their behaviour actually was. Literally sounds like normal 3 and 4 year olds. They will not be ‘perfect’ 100% of the time. The problem is your DH expectations of that on the children and on you. I’ve since read your other posts and I feel so sorry for you taking the weight of this on yourself and feeling all this pressure and guilt. This is not you. Or the kids. This is your DH. Sending lots of love and strength

Having read the full thread which as one or two other posters have pointed out is full of the following issues

• self congratulation on having children with exemplary behaviour (I am around a lot of children other than my own in my day to day life and unless it is a British thing that children are miniature adults then I find these posts difficult to believe)

• stupendous amounts of misogyny in the assumption that this is all the OPs fault and a refusal to put any responsibility on the "D"H regarding the behaviour of his own children despite clear signs that the likelihood is that his temper and (potentially) abusive behaviour towards the mother are in fact the reason that the children misbehave and only want their mother

• apparently very few people are picking up what I and one or two others are highlighting, which is that the OP is in fact NOT dealing with "feral" children but a 3 and 4 year old getting a bit bored at dinner on holiday and that her husband's response is aggressive, swearing and slamming cutlery down.

The children's behaviour sounds normal. The husband's behaviour sounds abusive

And I am willing to bet my last Rolo that the OP is in fact afraid of her husband as opposed to "undermining him" - (I don't doubt that he has accused her of undermining her when she attempts to prevent him from swearing at her children, or crashing about creating a tense atmosphere for everyone, or storming off).

In fact I bet the OP spends a lot of time trying her very hardest to avoid anything, including her children, from setting her husband off.

And that, that will be why the children only want their mother.

Not because the "D" H is a proper old school father who knows about the importance of discipline in young children. But because he is an angry man who is regularly behaving like this, and whose moods set the tone of the day for the whole family, and once a day is "one of those days" everything that anyone does will be wrong.

And so the very best thing that the OP could do, is to leave him. Because abuse only ever gets worse.

OP I truly wish you all the best.

They cling to you because you are safe and he is an angry, aggressive, abusive arsehole that scares them.

Poor kids.

You do the majority of care despite working full time?

Sounds about right.

Lazy, selfish, abusive arsehole.

Poor you and poor kids.

You have a lot of thinking to do.

Keep notes of his tantrums and behaviour in front of the children.
It may be of use.

Ask him how he plans to improve their behaviour. He could also work on his own manners while he's at it, to make sure he's setting a good example.

dear OP: you sound fine; your kids sound fine; your DH sounds like a petulant and controlling arse. You're clearly not in a position to dump him yet. The only other recourse is to start standing up to him with some penetrating home-truths.

I am so confused. He's gone off to see his sidepiece?! What?? He sounds ridiculous, although it does sound like you are making a rod for your back (and everyone else's) by not enforcing higher expectations with the children. You've had lots of good advice about the kids so I won't add to that. But where the hell did he go, and who is "her"?? Is your holiday in the UK?

I was shocked at how so few were picking up on the husband’s aggressive and abusive behaviour. You may need to have sadly experienced it first to recognise the signs. I still cry at the thought of my abusive now ex husband taunting my two year as as he wanted to cuddle me after getting a friction burn on holiday and not wanting to continue with the activity. Words to look at that girl over there, even she is doing it send shudders through me. I bit my tongue and limped on for another year trying to placate him before I and my children had had enough. OP, your children are not the problem. Sending support.

Whenever there is the merest suggestion on here that a child isn’t behaving perfectly you can guarantee post after post after post going after the OP about boundaries and consequences, often coupled with the tremendously helpful ‘parent them.’

The main thing I'd say is, a 'dream holiday' and kids that age DO NOT go together, at all 🤣🤣

No advise OP! It’s sounds like a tough position to be in! I have an 18 month old who I did a long haul - solo patent holiday with a few months ago. I took toys for her and sticker books and stuck to her usual routine as close as possible! She still naps so that made some activities a bit harder but I took the time out to nap too! Which made it feel like a holiday! Hope hubby steps up to help and sorry you are being critiqued for your parental skills! Lots of very well behaved kids on Mumsnet!

This resonates with me. Although not as you might think.
I may have been the fun parent, partner seeming to me (and kids) a killjoy.
I think now, meet in the middle.
Kids need to be able to sit at table for a short time ( you decide when) and then they can get down and play and yous finish your meal.
They will learn to do this in no time x

It was a typo, I had had a lot of wine! He went to bed… took himself off and left me to sort the kids out

Yes my Dd was, we took her on holiday abroad from 2 1/2 and, apart from wanting to be in the pool all day long, she was fine. She sat at the table, chose what she wanted to eat and ate it. We kept her entertained with colouring books, simple games etc and we never had any problems. Distract and entertain your children, let them eat what they want, within reason ( Dd ate fruit, chips and ice cream, but it didn't matter for one week). Cut them.some slack but stick to the boundaries that matter

Oh goodness I relate so much to your post!
My kids are now 18 and 16 but when they were 3 and 5, wow, it was horrendously hard work!
However, it sounds like your DH has super unrealistic expectations of children's developmental levels and is expecting WAY too much of them! He seems to be projecting adult expectations if he expects toddlers to sit for 2 hours and chat over a meal ffs!
My exh also used to behave like your DH, especially the blaming me and insuniuating that I was lax or the kids were awful... nd tbh, that is one of the reasons he's an ex!
Im sorry you've had a shed load of judgement on this thread and assumptions about your parenting, kids of that age are lively and full of energy which can turn into unreasonableness on a sixpence! Especially when tired, out of routine, hot, excited etc.
Your dh is being a dick- sending hugs and solidarity!

I think some people think good behaviour happens by magic, it doesn't, it takes teaching, training and consistency from a very young age, and this needs to come from both parents. I feel heart sorry for you doing this alone, while Dad is upset because the good behaviour fairy missed your house with her magic dust. He needs teaching and training how to parent🙄

Ugh yes I can imagine. If I hear ‘come on’ or ‘let’s go’ one more time I’m gonna scream.

I think that's a huge (and horrible) thing to say and not helpful. I think previous posters have made great points about meeting in the middle and resetting expectations, without demonising anyone

Laid back= lazy parenting.

I think if you stay with this aggressive, controlling man, you and your children will live very unhappy lives.

He's a terrible father and an awful husband.

Please seriously consider divorcing him.

I think that’s an extremely judgmental and unhelpful comment. I’ve commented in previous posts I’m not lazy, but on holiday I’m relaxed as everybody should be on holiday. You should try it