to think it is acceptable to smack someone if they touch your body, even if they have dementia?

[haleey]

I visit my grandad in a care home regularly and sometimes male residents will touch women unexpectedly. I’ve had my waist touched, boobs grabbed and one man touched my privates while smiling at me. I know they are ill and confused, but honestly I think people act as though women are supposed to just tolerate it because “they can’t help it”.

Part of this for me is that I have been assaulted before, so my reflex when someone suddenly touches me unexpectedly is to hit out before I even properly think. It is an automatic panic response.

Recently one resident suddenly grabbed me and I instinctively smacked his hand away. One of the staff immediately told me off and said “he can’t help it”. I understand that dementia affects behaviour and judgement, but I found it upsetting that the focus instantly became about him rather than acknowledging that I had just been touched without consent and panicked.

I’m not talking about beating vulnerable elderly people or deliberately hurting confused residents. But I also don’t think women should be expected to quietly accept unwanted touching because the person is elderly or cognitively impaired.

80% on the poll already agree anyway!

The ones who don't are a minority.

You're probably right but it all sounds pretty unbelievable the more it goes on

That is a completely different situation.

Yet you are still here.

That’s possibly because the majority of people are in the fortunate position of not having a good understanding of dementia or being regular visitors to nursing homes - so they don’t know what the reality is.

I do and I find quite extraordinary that this has happened to you 4 times. It must be an exceptionally chaotic and badly run nursing home. Have you reported the home for being so poorly managed?

I’m interested in dementia turning men into sexual predators, I’ve never heard of this side effect before… I feel sorry for the likely primarily female staff.

I do like to read other posters opinions

If you cannot control your reaction then you cannot go there. Or you need to make arrangements to meet your grandfather without coming into contact with the other residents. If you have safety concerns report these to the relevant authorities but you cannot deal with it by hitting out.

They don't turn into sexual predators, men and women with dementia and other illnesses can sometimes lose any inhibitions, their behaviour and understanding goes wrong and in the 30 years I nursed I have never been "groped" as some people like to say, I've been pinched,pushed, shouted at, spat at .

You were defending yourself.

Likewise if any child poked their finger in my eye or snatched my cheek I would swipe their hand away. Common sense.

If all recipients hit his old hand away, he might think differently.

Defending yourself is moving the hand and saying no. And no he won't think differently because of being hit.

I wonder what the ratios are for men who sexually touch/grab and women who do this. And the men who do this to females only vs to anyone indiscriminately.

You obviously know nothing about dementia.

Yeah I get swatting the hand to get it off you but it's not going to do anything to change the behaviour as it's a degenerative condition.

Unlikely for him to “think differently”. He physically cannot do that. His brain does not work like that anymore. You can’t train dementia out of someone.

A smack no, but moving their hand away with a very firm 'no thank you' absolutely is. Children must also learn these boundaries, to not teach them leaves them very vulnerable.

Children have the capacity to learn. Adults with dementia do not. In some ways it’s like dealing with a toddler who is regressing back towards being a baby.

It’s a very cruel disease and as this thread shows, one which is poorly understood.

not all older people are nice.
I don’t think you’re wrong. And controversial view but this is how these men have probably viewed women all their lives, they’re just more disinhibited now.

And a firm ‘No!’

But the person will very likely have zero short term memory, so don’t expect him to remember not to do it again.

It’s well known that people with dementia may well lose whatever inhibitions they once had as regards sexual behaviour. In a novel written in around 1900 Arnold Bennett wrote about an elderly man with ‘softening of the brain’, as they used to call it, making completely uncharacteristic sexual advances towards a servant girl.

Bennett must IMO have witnessed dementia at first hand, judging from the way he wrote about the progress of the symptoms.

Surely that only applies if they indiscriminately grab men’s butts/crotches/feel their muscles etc.

I was talking about children. I was responding to a poster talking about autistic children. I'm a special needs teacher and teaching the children about appropriate physical boundaries is something we work on very carefully. TBF as adults we do also take measures to limit the possibility of inappropriate touch while they are learning, such as considering our own positioning.

I am aware that dementia is different in that new learning is not possible.

Your view is ignorant rather than controversial.

You think people with dementia can be taught?

No, not at all. Core memories remain as in sexuality, inhibitions do not exist. It’s common for men to not recognise their own adult daughter when they’ve dementia, mistaken them for their wife or a date, it’s part of the devastation that dementia brings on a family, often the reason for NH home care.
I don’t know how a lot of people don’t understand that. The person has zero control. One of my Dsus favourite resident will wee wherever she is. She grew a on a farm, she pulls down her pants and goes, other residents can slip so you have to be on her, she’s such a lady, she’s would be mortified if she had any awareness.

Those who have mental capacity but physically unable to care for themselves are not generally kept side by side with dementia patients.