to think it is acceptable to smack someone if they touch your body, even if they have dementia?

[haleey]

I visit my grandad in a care home regularly and sometimes male residents will touch women unexpectedly. I’ve had my waist touched, boobs grabbed and one man touched my privates while smiling at me. I know they are ill and confused, but honestly I think people act as though women are supposed to just tolerate it because “they can’t help it”.

Part of this for me is that I have been assaulted before, so my reflex when someone suddenly touches me unexpectedly is to hit out before I even properly think. It is an automatic panic response.

Recently one resident suddenly grabbed me and I instinctively smacked his hand away. One of the staff immediately told me off and said “he can’t help it”. I understand that dementia affects behaviour and judgement, but I found it upsetting that the focus instantly became about him rather than acknowledging that I had just been touched without consent and panicked.

I’m not talking about beating vulnerable elderly people or deliberately hurting confused residents. But I also don’t think women should be expected to quietly accept unwanted touching because the person is elderly or cognitively impaired.

So staff can assault patients as well, or just you.

Nobody’s saying that. They’re saying there are ways to avoid it happening and to tackle the situation. None of which you’re prepared to consider.

This is good advice ❤

I just made some shaksuka.

I think slapping is totally unacceptable, just move yourself away. They cannot help it, as someone said, any more than a baby could. Also YOU are in THEIR home, invading their space - don't forget that!

Literally just wants people to tell her to keep on slapping disabled people. One of the most disgusting threads I've read in ages. Makes me so sad for those in care homes.
The only saving grace is that the couple of people who actually work in such homes who have commented think that OPs behaviour is unacceptable.

This is such an excellent point. The level of misandry on this thread is something to behold. Dementia renders women just as vulnerable to these behaviours as men, but as usual on MN the fact that you’re male must mean you’re also a perv/paedophile and the dementia is only highlighting your own urges. It’s utter nonsense and the level of ignorance as to what dementia is and how it destroys different areas of the brain is shocking. It causes disinhibition and the sufferer engages in behaviour that wouldn’t even cross their minds without the disease. That posters are putting that down to male urges and deeming it worthy of a physical reaction that the sufferer won’t understand and which will cause them even more distress, is the most shocking aspect of this thread.

I wonder how many women with dementia are subjecting poor men to the same treatment?

Lots. It's a common effect of that horrible disease and it affects men and women.

oxfordhealth.nhs.uk/orka/title/treatment-of-inappropriate-sexual-behavior-in-dementia/

Yeah, we’re all stupid and you’re absolutely right to continue assaulting people instead of doing what any sane, responsible person would do, and reporting the situation to the home authorities and insisting on a private space for future visits.

I’ll tell you one thing OP. My own mum was prone to these kinds of behaviours once the dementia really took hold. The disease destroyed her and the person that she was - the mum l loved and tried to protect and support for as long as possible, was not the person the dementia transformed her into in the end. The fact that you can’t, and have no desire to understand how the disease works and the effects on the sufferer, preferring to concentrate on your own perceived ‘assaults’ at the hands of these vulnerable people, makes me very sad for you.

I watched my mum disappear in front of my eyes long before she died. I pray that you never experience that, despite your appalling lack of empathy for the sufferers and their families.

And also a failure in the duty of care for the other female residents who are likely also suffering dementia, have probably suffered sexual assault in their earlier lives and are unable to articulate their distress at this man assaulting them

No matter what way you look at this this is a failure by the care home

Failure for the female staff
Failure for the female residents
Failure for the female visitors
Failure for the male resident displaying this behaviour
Failure for his family who need him kept out of these situations

I don’t think you should be but you have to remember the people in them aren’t in their right minds. I had a women who, every single time I went to see my dad, tried to steal my bag! She had taken a liking to it. If I was standing talking to a member of staff about my dad, she would sneak up and try to remove my bag from my shoulder.

It’s difficult to deal with people with dementia.

We went to see my dad once and he was stripping off. Apparently he had been given an “edict” from the pope saying he should take all his clothes off. This was in a public corridor with a seating area.

We tried to stop him, putting back on what he had taken off etc. Reminding him it was a mixed place and there was women patients too who might be embarrassed, but there was no talking to him.

It ended up with him being locked in his room and us having to leave.

All these years later, I still picture him behind that locked door and us leaving him.

You say you reacted instinctively and I believe you.

But please don’t do it again.

They are really unwell.

Agree. But if OP chooses not to report it and follow up on action needed, what’s the solution ?

Having worked in Dementis care its a common trait
Both men and women are affected patucularly frontal lobe Dementia.

Yep. I outlined this upthread. My own mum had vascular dementia and the effects were broadly the same - disinhibition and behaviours she would have been mortified by had she been able to understand. The lack of understanding and tendency towards blame, as though people who lack capacity are still somehow responsible for, and should be punished for their actions is concerning to say the very least.

Many.

Thankfully those commenting who actually work with such patients have unanimously said OPs actions are not acceptable
But it's very concerning if the home doesn't realise the same. If I had seen this when visiting my DFIL I would have called the police. I hope someone does similar.

I'm really sorry about your mum. It's so cruel isn't it x

Yep. Agree. I find it really shocking that the emphasis on MN is on calling out misogyny but posters have no problem when it comes to out and out misandry.

Agree.

I think the home need to be made aware, and to be compelled to take proper action - at the very least their procedures and care plans for residents who pose this kind of risk needs to be reviewed and the proper safeguards put in place. But at the same time, I think OP has a responsibility where this is concerned. It’s not acceptable to experience this kind of thing on four separate occasions without reporting it and making sure that your complaint is properly addressed. I may be wrong but I do get the distinct impression that OP isn’t up for actually doing anything about it, beyond assaulting the residents she sees as responsible. From her posts it seems she’s already been warned, but doesn’t think that carries much weight. I can only hope that she’s observed in this behaviour before too long and that the home takes the appropriate action.

No one is saying that.

The visitors aren't the ones receiving funding to keep the residents safe. It's the home that have the duty of care here. If they've normalised this behaviour then it may not inspire people to report it to them. I'd also worry about what else has been normalised.

Completely agree. Responsibility lies both with the home, and with OP who is an adult with capacity and responsible for the risk she foreseeably poses to these residents.
The only parties who aren't responsible in any way are the disabled residents. Despite what some posters seem to think.

You can’t “normalise” behaviour that is actually normal when people have dementia.

Yes but you can normalise tolerating it which is what it seems like the women that work here have been expected to do.

What about the male workers with women who are sexually assaulting them?