AIBU to tell my son he made his sister feel unsafe and uncomfortable?

[Resini]

Hi all, last night for our anniversary DS and DD along with DS’s girlfriend took us out for dinner and to see a show. Afterwards DS and his girlfriend suggested we go for some more drinks, they are both members of a private members club and could take guests so suggested we go there.
DH and I don’t go out late very often and don’t enjoy drinking very much so we didn’t stay too long but DD did.
DD is only 21, she is quite young for her age, has only lived at home, where as DS is 28 and his girlfriend 25. Obviously DD can handle herself and doesn’t need her big brother looking after her but it wasn’t her normal environment either.
Today DD has told us, that both DS and his girlfriend got very drunk and both used cocaine. Now of course I’m not naive they are young adults (albeit professionals DS is a solicitor and his girlfriend works in policy research!) and I know these sort of things happen in professional circles in London.
DD ended up going back to DS’s girlfriends flat to stay the night as it got late, she missed the last train (we are out in Surrey) and didn’t want to try get a cab that far. DD told me she felt really uncomfortable as they also invited one of their friends back to stay at there’s and this friend has been flirting with DD all night, she felt he wasn’t listening to her saying she wasn’t interested and didn’t want to be stuck in the same flat. She says she told DS this and he told her she was being silly and that the friend is “docile”.
DD ended up not sleeping at all, she said she felt on edge the whole time and left very early.
She has asked me not to say anything to DS as it will make her look pathetic, but I’m really disappointed in him, both in the getting so drunk he had to “have a tactical vomit” on the side of the street, using cocaine and not taking into account his sisters safety or comfort.

AIBU to think I should send him a message explaining that he made his sister very uncomfortable and owes her an apology?
I don’t want to be overbearing but I also think the behaviour last night was out of order.

DD is 21, an adult. How do you propose OP make her go home with her parents ? And DD doesn’t want OP to say anything to her brother. That’s the dilemma.

I didn't mention the coke.
My reply said he bringing a male friend to stay over with his sister when she specifically said she didn't feel safe.

To which she gave the answer upthread. She doesn’t see her son very often, has no idea of his social life, or how often he takes cocaine. It’s nothing to do with the type of drug, it’s the habit that determines whether or not you are an addict. Occasional use of cocaine that you can take or leave with no consequences doesn’t make you an addict, or a’druggie’ any more than an occasional alcoholic drink makes you an alcoholic. Once again posters assigning labels without the faintest idea of what they mean. And that’s aside from the fact that childish name calling using insulting terminology like ‘druggie’ really isn’t helpful to anyone. It’s actually pathetic.

How are you feeling this morning @Resini?

I think you had some good advice about mentioning the safety issue with your son.
However as I said up thread if your son gets a drug conviction he cannot practice law. Look it up on the SRA website.

Has your husband pulled him up on his behaviour in the past? Mine and my husband's parents were old school, they expected respect. They also didn't expect to hear about us getting into scrapes. Our adult DC know we wouldn't have tolerated drugs. My DH once saved my son's friends life after he overdosed at party. The lad learnt a thing or two that night as did the other party goers.

Please don't push it under the carpet. And I suggest your daughter carries a spare £20 to get home.
The night time economy has lots of initiatives in place.

Full disclosure, I've worked in addiction counseling and studied law. The pressure is pretty intense in the early years but people need to grow up fast. There's a queue behind them.

Yep, l picked up on that upthread. Interestingly your comment addressed OP’s actual concern - her DD’s safety, and l think the mistake this poster made demonstrates quite nicely that the furore regarding DS’s use of cocaine has completely obliterated the original point of the thread.

I think it's reasonable to pull him up on ignoring th concerns of his younger sister in being made to sleep in the same room as a bloke she doesn't know, who has been badgering her all evening and not accepting rebuffs.

That's a lousy thing for a friend to do, nevermind a brother. It's risky and thoughtless.

suggest your daughter carries a spare £20 to get home

Oh, bless! A taxi from central London to the leafy Home Counties is more like £200 than £20. OP said her DD did have plenty of money but was less than confident about her safety with an Uber driver at 2am while clearly drunk. Thinking back to my lively London nights**, I'd say it's a reasonable concern.

She should've been able to trust her brother to give a shit.

** Hint for DD in future, @Resini, born of long experience: take a photo of the car reg before getting in. Explain to the driver that you're sending it to your mum/boyfriend/flatmate, and that this is a safety protocol you all share. Send it. Obviously, use Uber's built-in recognition as well, but it's good to show you've got back-up!

I have 2 dds in their 30s, thankfully both of them would have listened to me or dh in this situation. I would have said I wasn’t leaving them in central London with their brother (who they know is a drug user and isn’t very close to his family. The Dd said she just wanted to finish her drink so I would have insisted on waiting for her until she did.

Should add dh and I are currently on holiday with both DDs and their families. We all get on and are close so you can’t level being controlling at me.

Druggie isn't a diagnostic term. It's a colloquial term for someone who uses illegal drugs regularly, which let's be honest if he's taking it casually with his younger sister he does

Where did I say it was a diagnostic term ? Druggie isn’t a ‘colloquial term’, it’s derogatory and completely unnecessary, and has overtones of addiction. And if you actually read the OP properly he isn’t taking it with his younger sister, he’s taking it with his girlfriend. OP has said several times she no idea how often he uses it -whether it’s habitual or occasional, and in a blue moon doesn’t make you an addict or even a ‘druggie’. I’m absolutely not condoning drug use in any way shape or form, but some of the comments here are assuming that her DS is an addict, and based on the limited information OP has given (because basically she doesn’t know) that’s a stretch.

I wouldn’t dream of levelling an accusation of controlling at you. But that’s your experience. At the age of 21 OP can’t force her DD to do something she doesn’t want to do.

She sounds sheltered and pathetic. Running to mummy to complain at 21. Don't even think about interfering with your son. If I'd be him, I'd cut ties with you, should you try this. He's an adult, doing some coke and having a party, big deal. His business.

Your wimpy daughter, who sounds about 10, needs to grow up.

In answer to your AIBU OP - no I definitely wouldn’t say anything to your DS if your DD has asked you not to. I’d be encouraging her to talk to him about it though. What he did wasn’t on but I can see how in the context of everyone being a bit pissed etc, your DS knowing his friend, not really taking account of your DD being quite sheltered and of course being a man he just didn’t take her seriously. It’s a conversation she should be able to have with her brother.

Even if your DD is now happy for you to say something I’m not sure I would, the family relationships seem very complicated (also note what you say about your DD being quite happy to paint DS in a negative light in the past) and I think you seem to be doing a good job of navigating a very difficult situation and maintaining a relationship with your DS - his life seems like it has the potential to blow up (girlfriend/work/drug use/fall out with his Dad) and if I was you I’d want to make sure we stayed talking to each other. It may not of course and ime casual cocaine use is more far common than most of us realise (don’t approve at all but I just don’t think it means he’s necessarily spiralling into addiction)

Yes. Definitely read this exact post before

Sorry but your son is a total idiot.

Have some respect for your son and yourself and tell him you don't like his behavior. Tell him he's a knob, he won't like it but it's better than idling meandering through life and barely taking his drug use seriously.

You're his mother, you brought him into the world. Own it. If he doesn't speak to you for a bit at least you've done something. Whilst you're at it, tell him you don't like his girlfriend.

I hate these people who tiptoe around their children. Waste of space.

Oh yes because men in relationships melt if their precious girlfriend isn't glued to their side.

If you can't do things independently you're not adult enough to be in a relationship (or have a job, respect, etc)

Children have no responsibility for siblings.

Children do immature things like take drugs

Children get mortally drunk

Children can't be without their oh so precious girlfriend

Children hang up on their mums

Children give parents the silent treatment

Children fall out with their dads (I'm assuming your DH didn't do much wrong else you'd not be with him would you?)

Do you have adult children?
I promise none of this will change his choices and will push him away in the mean time which is far more dangerous if he has a drug problem.

It’s easy for people who have good family relationships to exclaim about how other people should deal with things.
Truth is, when relationships are hard we have to tiptoe along a fine line in order to buy time for things to improve.
DB was an absolute dick at this age, and until his wife left him. He’s been better since. I don’t blame her, but suspect they brought out the worst in each other- superficial aspirational types. He got real after she left.

Trying to keep my extended family on talking terms is a full time job. Thank god my DC, so far, appear level headed.

If he doesn't have a great relationship with either his mum(?) or his dad it's perhaps no surprise he doesn't want to see them without his gf there.

I do yes. Many a time they'd not like what I said but I was often right.

My son once stopped talking to me for a few weeks because I suggested his girlfriend was a bit not all there. He then called me saying she'd throw his phone out the window of the car after not stopping at Costa 😆

All I'm saying is that you're expecting too little of him. If he can't take a dressing down for bad behaviour, that's a reflection on you. He should be able to acknowledge drugs are bad and his sister is upset. Again, if he's not devastated he must know he can get away with bad behavior or not think much of his sister

”But what was she wearing…”

🙄

She’s 21 and would’ve been going from London to Surrey 🤣
At what age would you suggest letting your daughter continue a night out she was enjoying?
OP to go back to your original question, listen to what your daughter would like you to discuss/not discuss with her brother. Don’t get distracted (much like this thread!)
My main thought is, speak to him because DD may want or need to stay at his/ his girlfriend’s in future. Slightly tricky one as it was GF flat, but he still should have dealt with his sister’s concerns regarding the man who was there. I would also leave it a little while, especially if another night out was coming up - you could tell him you would expect him to make his sister feel comfortable and safe.

My mum operates like this, well into adulthood she felt she had the right to judge her children's choices and tell us off. In my 20s I did accept it - was conditioned to really - but as I got older and had my own children I came to really resent it, she obviously wasn’t always or even often right , not a surprise given she never really had the full picture.

I felt it showed a lack of trust and a way of exerting control. I can honestly say it never made me do anything differently- I just stopped telling her things.

Surely the question is - was your son responsible for your daughter's safety?
Yes in that she's his sister and younger than him and he clearly knows the clubs/area better. If he offered her a bed, then I also think he has a responsibility to make that bed safe.

But no in that she's 21, she made the decision to stay out without a safe way home and - if he didnt offer her a bed and she just assumed she could sleep over - she chose to stay out without arranging anywhere to stay and expected her drunk brother to solve this problem for her.

As a mum I'd be as disappointed as you and want him to behave much, much better. As an outsider, I don't think you can expect a 28 year old living away from home to be responsible for his adult sister who it sounds like he's never been close to when she chooses to go on a night out in his area