Is it ok for men to be in the ladies loos if they need to assist a disabled wife?

[someoneelsesshoes]

Not sure if I’m unreasonable to have felt a bit strange about this.

I went to the ladies toilets in a garden centre and there was a man standing by the sinks. I immediately went to walk out as I thought I’ve mistakenly gone into the men’s. He then said sorry and said he was waiting for his wife. He was next to a zimmer frame which I assume was his wife’s.

I felt really strange about this but went into the loo as usual. I understand maybe his wife really needed help to get on/off the loo so dismissed it. She was still in the stall when I left. But when I left the loo I checked the disabled and it was open and ready to use (though maybe it was occupied when she needed it and it was an emergency).

I haven’t come across this before so not sure if we make this concession for male carers. I know disabled people need to be supported and maybe he’s the only one who can help her.

But this does not mean it’s ok for a man to be in the ladies

Wouldn't bother me in the slightest.

Given he wasn’t in the actual cubicle with me, and was waiting to assist his disabled wife, I wouldn’t think anything of this. What is she expected to do if no disabled toilet?

If it’s the least bad option for her to use the toilet then yes it does.

There was a disabled toilet

No

It's not quite the same though is it. A disabled woman going into a male toilet walking past men peeing up against urinals isn't the same as a man standing outside the cubicle in the women's toilet.

It's not ideal but under the circumstances it's not that much to overlook.

It might be the least bad option for her but it isn’t the least bad option for the other women who need to use the ladies.

One person doesn’t trump many.

Wow.

For future reference before you make judgements:

Using the toilet facilities can be time consuming for someone with a disability. Potentially a ten minute activity. They’re also often dual purpose with baby changing facilities. Full outfit nappy changes aren’t swift tasks either. That’s quite a while to wait if it’s occupied and as they’re almost always single units you’ve got no idea how long you’ll be waiting (compared to multi stall toilets where it’s safe to assume that ‘someone’ will finish pretty soon).

Secondly - toileting urgency is a real issue, particularly for older women. So unknown waits will reasonably regularly not be feasible.

Not an extreme circumstance.

Wouldn't bother me at all. The cubicles in public loos are enclosed so he wouldn't be watching me wee.

I think this is an exception.
Unless you have a reason to think this man was not genuine I’d give him and his disabled partner a pass.

To all those women who 'don't mind' men being in the women's same-sex toilets.

Why don't you get over yourselves?

Why don't you stop obsessing over other women's choice to live within, and accept, the current law?

Why are you all so fixated on other women's needs and wants?

Why don't you reframe your views?

Needs must…….and I know my OH would have done exactly the same until I got my radar key for the disabled toilets. Having said that, he often had to come in there with me too as I couldn’t transfer independently nor could I weight bear.

Places only having one disable toilet is sometimes annoying, particularly if the loo is a baby changing facility too but I guess it’s all to do with space and money.

So it’s ok that I be traumatised and have a massive panic attack? Self harm, potentially? Soil myself?

because he’s a nice man and sure it’s fine to do because he’s only helping his wife and what does anyone else matter.

I agree.

I would have gone and waited outside until he left.

I’m disabled and use a wheelchair.

many places do not have a disabled toilet.

some like a pp mentioned have a disabled toilet but only one and it’s in either the men’s or the ladies.

if I use a disabled toilet I can usually manage on my own.

if there isn’t one I do sometimes need help (depends how bad my tremors are) and obviously if I have a female carer this is fine (mostly) although wheelchairs do not fit into standard cubicles very well and I have had to go to the loo with my carer standing between me and the rest of the room which is not really dignified.

it’s not always possible to ensure a disabled person has a carer of the same gender with them and in many cases such as elderly people it’s quite unlikely - many husbands care for wives and wives care for husbands.

most places if they have cleaners of the different sex will put up a sign on the toilets telling you so that you know.

in a situation where I need to go to the loo and there isn’t a disabled one (this is very common) we usually knock and shout first to let people know/ask if a male carer can come in.

I have seen situations where the disabled cubicle has been in the men’s which made me acutely uncomfortable.

I’m very much NOT a supporter of trans “women” using women’s spaces but I would give a male carer looking after a disabled partner a pass.

Me too. Except menopause means I can’t wait. So I’m likely to have wet myself.

So much reaching to assert men's rights to be in women's spaces.

This situation is exactly what the disabled loo is for and if the disabled was available then they should have used it.

Saying that, I know my granny (when she was alive) was very against using the disabled loo even when she needed a stick and help getting up from the toilet as she was adamant they were for people in wheelchairs and as someone not in a wheelchair she shouldn't use them. My grandad did have to go in and help her a couple of times in the general ladies loos and he really felt uncomfortable and tried to get her to use the disabled.

She did come round to the idea when ss did their care assessment and explained that she could use the disabled toilet when out and about.

Was the disabled open or was it on a radar key? If on radar key, you either need to find someone to open it (if you don't have a key) or knock and check someone is not occupying the toilet before using the key. Even then sometimes they are locked and you need to track down a staff member to open it. It can be a bit of a nightmare, especially if you have someone with poor continence needing to use the toilet urgently and using the general facilities is easier in that regard.

It wouldn't bother me, as a PP has said it's not open communal toilets, each toilet is in a stall. I would understand that this lady needed extra help.

Yes of course this is ok. A man cannot even care for his wife anymore? He explained himself as soon as you entered because he knew it was less than ideal. It's obvious if the disabled toilets were usable when needed they would have gone in there instead.

Needs must. I'm assuming the disabled toilet was in use at the time.

I take my disabled 10 year old son into the ladies if the disabled one is in use. Waiting isn't an option and it is what it is.

If only there were more disabled toilets and/or people who were genuinely disabled were the only ones who actually used them.

Toilets are either unisex or male or female.
There should be more disabled toilets.
I would have walked out as well.

Define genuinely disabled.

Difficult for them. I would have automatically felt a bit weird/confused too, but wouldn’t have minded once he explained. But yes they should use the disabled loo really, when possible. I expect they do or will soon figure it out.