Hand on shoulder

[ThankThink]

Teen Dd takes part in a weekly activity outside of school, which is attended by a wider age range. One of the men attending, has the habit of placing his hand on the young girls shoulder when he speaks with them. So he approaches a girl and while speaking to her places one hand on her shoulder. He does this mostly with 2-3 girls not all of them. The girls are all 15.

AIBU to think this is not ok?

The girls don't like it but no one has yet said anything. I have told her to move away when it happens again but Dd worries about being impolite. I role played with her how to move away. I am so cross about this, not even my extended family would think of touching her casually for no reason.

What would you advise and how do I advise dd?

I'm not defending this behaviour at all - ex safeguarding officer in education setting - but if this man is of more mature age, it may be that NOBODY has ever pointed out to him that this behaviour is totally unacceptable in this day and age. Is the club run by a commercial business or by the school, or is it volunteer led? I'd advise you to find out who is responsible overall for the management of the provision, including the staff, and flag your concerns with them, and get a clear commitment from them as to what they will do to rectify this, and by when. In the education setting I worked in, all of our staff underwent compulsory safeguarding training. However, my own children attended many clubs and activities, some that were organised by sports businesses that had similar training requirements, but some were less formal clubs overseen by local volunteers. The local volunteers were often more mature and were very enthusiastic, but from a time when safeguarding wasn't a thing. I have on occasion pointed out issues to them, and when it's put to them in context, they are mortified and more than happy to take advice and guidance on correct behaviours around young people.
Touching young girls on the shoulder does need calling out, and as your daughter has alerted you to it, it is your responsibility to take steps to stop it. But do it in the correct way so it is managed, recorded and monitored.

This is how we are all conditioned to be ‘good girls’ and you’ve got an opportunity to help her challenge this subconscious belief that ‘good girls’ don’t make others comfortable at their own expense.

I remember in my twenties I went to the GP with a sore throat and he insisted on checking my breasts!! I had no idea what was going on but didn’t feel able to say no, or to report him afterwords do what I realised much later was not OK!

To remove his hand all she has to do is step back sideways or slightly twist her shoulder at the same time so that his hand doesn’t get a chance to slide down her front. You can practice this together.

if this is a serious organisation they will have a complaints policy. In Scouts this type of complaint bypasses the group leader and goes straight to the top of the organisation. I would absolutely raise it with whoever the DSL is. I do believe it needs to be reported, as otherwise he will simply be allowed to carry on with other girls.

He doesn't do it to everyone. He's choosing who to put his hands on. Whether consciously or unconsciously he is targeting some of the girls in this group.

I agree with pp that it would be best to help your daughter find her voice, she might need it in years to come. It's not impolite to let someone know you don't want them to touch you. I'd drop the please though, that makes it a request rather than an instruction. Don't touch, thank you, whilst nudging the hand off her shoulder, or shrugging and twisting away to the side and back. It's only a direct back step that would drop hand to breast so you either push his arm to the side as you step away or twist yourself to the side as you step back, or a combo of the two. Voice and body language together.
She doesn't have to make an excuse for it, so no elaboration, no I don't like it etc. don't touch works just fine. And if he says sorry her immediate reaction is going to be saying it's fine, which is appeasement. So the better thing here is to say thank you and then stop talking. If he still goes on about it, she should just say ok. The point is to acknowledge any apologies but not to give any indication that it's ok to do it again, so repeating the don't touch instruction is also good, but stay away from explaining herself as that is not sending the right message.
It may not be with bad intent, but the next one could be, so get working on her boundaries, her voice, and the difference between stating facts and being impolite.

The people saying just say something like "No! I do not consent for you to put your hand on my shoulder" are ridiculous. Well done if you would have had the balls to say that as a teen to an older man in a position of authority, but I certainly wouldn't, and I think most wouldn't. The girl needs advice that yes the man is wrong and yes she can say stuff like that if she feels comfortable, but she also needs tips on how to remove herself from this situation in way that doesn't feel too confrontational, eg taking a step back while turning away. And adults need to report too.

You would have to be living under a stone to be a man of 60, go to a hobby group with a teenage girls, and think it is okay to touch them.
As young girls, they know when being touched feels uncomfortable. He singles certain girls out - that’s the first thing.
He has no need to touch them. Even if he had the best of intentions he would know in 2026 his actions could look strange.
He is doing it because he can and because he gets a kick out of it, and nobody is challenging him. Because he’s not groping boobs it leaves people confused, and feeling they need to be polite.
Even without poor intentions, he needs telling. But I have a feeling he’s enjoying it.

It's less than that now; however, some will have voted in error. Others are creepy twats.

This is brilliant

These girls should not have to safeguard themselves. Every parent needs to speak to the person in charge and point out that this man must not lay his hands on any teenager - ever.
It's a power play, it's unacceptable. If the organisation has failed to act, then it's up to parents to do so. Now, not later.

I think it is excellent to encourage young girls to firmly step away from anyone who touches them in an unwelcome way. It will stand them in better stead than encouraging them to speak to the authorities (unless things escalate in some way or the person touching them turns nasty).
The first time I saw this done was at a work leaving event when the man who was leaving went around hugging everyone without asking first. One young woman took a step back and held out her hand for him to shake instead. He was nonplussed, then caught her meaning and politely shook hands. I was well impressed with her.

As a parent of a teenage daughter, I'd either be going to him directly and telling him in no uncertain terms not to lay a hand on any of the girls, shoulder or elsewhere, ever again. Or I'd go to the group leader and expressing the same sentiment (or both).

I'd travel down there and be the 'bad guy' so none of those girls have to be. I'd make clear that it's making them uncomfortable and it's not ok to lay hands on a child, no matter what the intent.

I wouldn't beat around the bush with this one.

I know a coach who was eventually imprisoned for his abuse of girls, high profile at the time, reported on the tv news, in all of the papers etc. I personally know the girls who were his accusers. I also remember a couple of conversations I had with him, and some friends and I have talked about conversations he had with them too. In hindsight, with the benefit of age and experience, he was assessing vulnerability and testing the waters, as such.
I was lucky, I had a mum like you, who had taught me how to deal with unwanted attention, who was open and honest with me. I do remember him asking about my dad and if I was close to him. Makes me shudder now.

You have probably made your DD one of the lucky ones too. The others need to be protected from him and there’s advice above of how to broach that. It needs to be taken seriously.

Is the man working/volunteering there, OP, or is he a participant?
Either way, you should speak to the group leader for sure.

A DSL is a Designated Safeguarding Lead. Anyone working with children has to have one.

More to the point - why aren't you going there to tell him it's not appropriate, or better still your husband.
Your daughter is a child, this is incredibly inappropriate and she clearly doesn't yet have the skills to deal with it, as her parents you should be stepping in.

Same here, I put up with so much as a girl and a young woman. I hate the expression "in my day" but it's relevant here because when I was young we were always taught not to rock the boat, to be nice, to be polite and even to see any male attention as flattering, or that we were "making a fuss about nothing because boys will be boys" I love to see how girls and women don't tolerate this sort of crap the way we were told to. He's a creep and it testing the water. When I look back to some of the stuff that went on when I was young it horrifies me, it is great that this girl is able to speak out and that she has been believed.

I was thinking the same thing as @Lurkingandlearning

If hand is already on shoulder she needs to raise her hand , same side , straight up on the inside of his arm and bat his hand away to the outside. (She will probably contact his wrist). If she has her phone, bag or pen in hand she can bat his arm with that.

If he is reaching out, she needs to do the same movement - it's just that it's earlier. So the batting away happens before he makes contact.
And she is batting his hand sideways away from her body so it has no chance of slipping down the front.

Stay a couple of steps out of arm length, if he still steps forward then bat arm away and again step back.

Don't know if my explanation makes more sense.

But I agree with all the PP.... please do also talk to someone.

She’s 15 Op, you need to step in & speak for her. Speak to the group leaders & I’d also be speaking to him directly.

It’s great to teach her to speak up for herself but this is happening now & you need to make it stop for her!

This is excellent. Better than what I said.

I and a friend were molested by a creepy doctor. Back in the mists of times we got holiday jobs in a local factory and all the new employees had to have medicals, this bastard doctor slipped my bra down and massaged my breasts, he did the same to my friend,(we only spoke about it to each other many years later when we were reminiscing about our young years) we were 16 years old and although your gut instinct knows this is wrong, in those days nobody would have listened and of course as a doctor he would have been believed over two teenage girls.

You need to speak to whoever runs the group to put in a complaint about this sleazy creep. Then you need to get your DD to practise moving away and becoming more assertive.

Do you think DD would benefit from doing self defence class?

H op he needs reporting to the group leader he’s vile also tell her to shrug her shoulder when he touches her and this will take his hand off her without moving I’ve had this in work places I hate it. I watched tipping point the other day and was shouting at Ben shepherd he kept touching the female contestant more than once then hugged her three time this is too much touchy feely for me. Not necessary either.

Whilst he may well be a creep obv, I wonder if it’s more that he’s ensuring they listen to him by keeping hold of them so more of a way to exert control? Wrong either way.

Would she be able to say something like "Oh, we did this in school the other day - body autonomy - we have to say "please don't physically touch me" And move to one side to disengage.

Does it matter what his motivation is?

Which is why you need to step in to deal with this.