Employer refusing flexibility after child’s surgery. What would you do?

[TornIn2WorkThenChild]

Hi all, I am posting here for traffic and name changed as details are outing.

I really need some straight-talking advice as I’m completely stuck and don’t know what to do for the best.

I work part-time (15 hours a week) in an early years setting. My teenage daughter has just had surgery on both knees and her recovery has been far more complicated than we were told. She currently has very limited mobility and needs help with basic things like getting up and getting to the toilet. At the moment, I’m the only person she will allow to help her.

Since September I’ve had a mix of dependent leave and sickness (including 2 weeks signed off after my own surgery). My employer has now refused any temporary flexibility and expects me to attend work as normal, come home on my lunch break to help my daughter, then go back again.

I just don’t see how that’s realistic or safe. I’m really worried about leaving her alone for long periods in her current condition, but equally I feel like I can’t refuse to go in without risking my job.

They’ve said my level of absence is the reason for refusing any adjustments.

I’ve asked for everything in writing and will be speaking to my union, but I’d really appreciate some honest opinions:

– Am I being unreasonable thinking this isn’t workable?
– Is what my employer is asking actually reasonable?
– Where do I stand legally with dependent leave in a situation like this?
– What would you do in my position?

Please be honest—I could really do with some outside perspective as I feel completely torn between my job and my daughter right now.

Can't she let her dad at least help her get to the toilet, she will be dressed in nightwear so covered up at that stage.. Could she then manage the last bit herself then get dad to help her back to bed ? How do you help her, does she need a wheelchair if she can't weight bear at all. When she was discharged did OH or re enablement or whatever they are called get involved?

It sounds like you have a very part time job where you need to be physically present during set hours, and it's not easy to find cover for you.

How would your employer cope if you made the flexible working adjustments you want? You've explained how they would benefit you, but not how they would work for your employer.

I sympathise with your DD. In an ideal world, intimate care is done by a close relative of the same sex. But sometimes, life isn't ideal. I've had to care for a relative of the opposite sex before and lift them on and off the toilet. You just have to get on with it - it's what family does.

If your DH is around and able to help, I think he's going to have to. It will be awkward for both of them, but it's better than you getting sacked for not being able to do your job.

You've been helping your DD for a while, so presumably you can help ensure the bathroom set up gives her as much dignity as possible - toilet paper, wipes and sanitary products in easy reach of the toilet, a big bin nearby, maybe a grab rail installed for stability.

I hope life gets easier for you all soon. Poor thing, your DD really does sound like she's been through a lot.

And how is a the daughter going to manage a bed pan on her own after having surgery on both knees?

Exactly.

And the nursery are prioritising the potentially 30 odd children in their care. I’m sure those parents won’t be happy to be told they the nursery can’t look after their children because they are short staffed! And please don’t say they need to pay agency staff to cover as the funding the government is dismal and many nurseries are already at risk of closure due to poor funding!

This isn’t your employers problem I’m afraid.

If you are now unable to do your job, and this has been going on for now over 8 months - I’d say the job isn’t suitable for you and you need to find alternative work.

Asking for flexibility on already part time hours on a role where you need to be there in-person - you must see why that isn’t possible / thy are unwilling to accommodate.

Of course. Certainly could hold it.

I didn’t have any choice. There was no one who could take time off to stay with me. Weeks in bed.
Even when I was recovering and could crawl to the bathroom I had to wait for the builders to have their lunch. I wasn’t crawling amongst loads of young men. 😆
Other than ask the builders for help 🫣…( which occasionally they did bring me a take away lunch in bed…

So I juggle 25hrs a week around pretty intense care for my husband who needs help with all toileting, catheterisation, very limited mobility, multiple other needs. I have a statutory approved one half day to WFH (I realise that won't work for you) but had to fight for that. I'm his only and registered carer but I also wanted and needed to work so had to be reasonable with what my employer would flex around. I appreciate yours may be a more short term situation but if you had already taken significant time off in the last few months I don't think they are being completely unreasonable here with your having a 15hr contract. I appreciate your daughter is a child but equally you will have to take account of the fact that they need you at work. I had two bereavements in the last 12 months too and to work around that and my husband I had to switch days, make hours up, to still be able to meet my commitments to everyone including my job. Its tough but at the end of the day they can only be so accommodating when a role needs to be fulfilled. Is there no other female relative that could maybe help out with the personal care while you're at work?

I am surprised at this as when I was in a similar position of being completely immobile following an operation that involved both legs, I wasn't allowed home from hospital until I could safely make it to a loo and back. Even though I asked to be discharged, they insisted that I passed their OT tests before they let me go. I know the NHS is in dire straights now, but sending a patient home in this condition doesn't sound right to me but perhaps it is different when young children are involved.

Same. After double knee surgery I wasn’t allowed to be discharged until I showed I was able to get to the loo on my own.

What a tough situation OP.

I am not sure how much more your employer can do as it’s a role where you are on site and they have ratios to think of.

Could another female relative or family friend help out?

If you quit how easily can you find another job?

The dh needs to help !!!

This with a DH issue or a DD MH issue.

It's obviously distressing and of course you want to be there for he but you Have A Job for me which you are p a i d. This is why women don't last in the workforce and end up reliant on a male.

The DD won’t accept help from anyone except mum - this isn’t a case of the DH refusing to help.

Exactly. If i was told that i couldn't go to the toilet for 4 hours i would be more likely to really need it. It wouldn't matter how much i had to drink. I also cannot concentrate on anything once i am desperate for the toilet. I couldn't even focus on my favourite book.

But in the OP's scenario of working mornings or the employer's scenario of popping home at lunchtime, DD still has to wait 3h + for her mum to get back.

She could wear TENA pants as a back up and that might well provide the security not to need them.

It isn't ideal, of course it isn't, but there's not a scenario here where OP's employer makes allowances ad infinitum.

Exactly - people seem to be missing the fact that OP's solution doesn't actually make things any better for her DD

I'm really shocked at the vote. You have to put your daughter first - what else can she do? This kind of surgery could have lifelong impact if she doesn't heal properly (if that's even possible after such surgery).

But you might have to take unpaid leave - your employer doesn't have to pay you if you've exhausted all paid options, but they should support you any way they can, such as by unpaid leave and allowing you to take your holiday now, and I would imagine they can't sack you because it might contravene equality laws around parenthood - I'm not sure, so your union should advise.

A 15 year old girl isn't going to want her dad taking her to the toilet!

If the alternative is her mum losing her job, she's potentially not going to have a choice.

The mums own suggestion has her leaving the girl for over 3 hours each morning.
If she can be left for that time then I don’t see how it’s different if op leaves her 2 x 3 hour stretches in 1 day. Op hasn’t returned to explain.
Again depends how much care needs - but if she can be sat on loo and left to it no reason why dad can’t lift her and leave room whilst she actually goes - easy clothing like a nightie or skirt, grab rails etc may assist. If mum couldn’t physically lift her then there would be no choice.

Her mum loses her job then.

Or her mum does 3 hours, goes home for lunch and then does another 3 hours, which doesn’t seem any different to me than working 3 hours then going home, but OP won’t acknowledge, for some reason

If it’s likely to be long term then mum may be better leaving work and being a carer and reapply for a job once she’s better.
Op will know if she’s likely to get another similar role easily in future. Job market locally, her qualifications and experience, whether she’s prepared to work ft etc. The staff in our village preschool have been there years for example as it’s a nice place to work, on doorstep and pt. If they left they’d be able to get another childcare job but probably a commute by car to a nearby town and a big commercial nursery with 8-6 hours etc.
It sounds like Op may be similar set up living very close to work to be able to nip back at lunch but there comes a point where if you aren’t able to do the role paid for you need to step away.

I think you know you are being unreasonable. Why should your employer help when it’s to do with your child rather than you as such and I say this with so much care that I do not want you to be angry or upset. I think you do understand. A business is a business. There are insurances you can take out for things that cover eventualities.

Adult nappy may need to be used in case, it's not nice and she may not like it but it's a temporary measure until she's more mobile.

But did you live with 2 other adults who could help you or do you live alone?

As far as the hospital is concerned DD was safe to discharge because her parents could look after her. Its not their problem that mum works and DD doesn't want dad helping. There are 2 able carers in the household.