Could Zack Polanski be any more of an obnoxious twat?

[HeadDeskHeadDesk]

Just seen him saying this:

'I am concerned about the rise in antisemitism and we know Jewish communities are saying they feel unsafe. There is a conversation to be had over whether it's a perception that they feel unsafe or whether they are actually unsafe.'

WTAF? Can you imagine if a politician said that to Muslims after a series of absolutely awful targeted attacks where people have died?

Yes, that pesky Zionist lobby has its filthy tentacles everywhere, doesn't it? Even MN isn't safe from it's baleful influence.
You know who else believes that there is a sinister cabal of Jews using their malign and powerful influence to control the world? Yes, that's right, antisemites. Replacing the word 'Jewish' with Zionist' does not magically detoxify age-old anti-semitic tropes. Perhaps give some more thought to the history of this type of racist conspiracy theory before being so willing to embrace it just because it's been given a fancy new name.
I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you are arguing in good faith. However, it is worth considering that when people say:
"Legitimate criticism of Israel is not anti-semitism."
this all sounds very reasonable but these words would have more power if they were applied to actual 'legitimate criticism'. I have seen people attempting to excuse some unquestionably anti-semitic comments as criticism of Israel, which has the effect of making the entire argument appear disingenuous.

yebba2026
I would point towards the Brexit campaign where he stood in front of a mocked up Nazi propaganda poster, showing middle eastern refugees walking in a large group, emblazoned with the words BREAKING POINT. It had nothing to do with the EU

The photograph was clearly taken on the Croatia/Slovenia border - the Guardian published almost identical photographs six months earlier with the captions:

Thousands of people are crossing the border from Croatia into Slovenia as authorities intensify their efforts to cope with Europe’s largest migration since the second world war...

The Slovenian prime minister, Miro Cerar, has said the EU will ‘start falling apart’ if it fails to take concrete action to tackle the refugee crisis within the next few weeks.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/gallery/2015/oct/26/police-escort-migrants-through-slovenia-in-pictures

Righto

Have you looked at the Guardian link? Farage's stock photograph was clearly taken at the same time, from the same location.

I have the right to criticise the ideology of Zionism without being accused of being antisemitic. On the contrary, it would be antisemitic to conflate Jews with the State of Israel. You're using some very offensive language there, perhaps you need to take a moment to remember that, even if you believe you are using it to make some sort of point.

Yes, I've tried to upload a photo to show you that I can also use google. The photo was modelled on a still taken from a Nazi propaganda video. It doesn't matter that it was taken in Europe, but I think you already know that. It's worrying that you are seeking to minimise the use of a photograph that copies the depiction of Jews being a threat to the world.

I'm going to step back for now as I am not interested in having this conversation for the 5000th time. Have a good day.

Sorry I meant to add:
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Comparison-of-the-poster-Breaking-Point-used-by-the-campaign-aimed-at-persuading-the_fig2_317704454

It's worrying that you are seeking to minimise the use of a photograph that copies the depiction of Jews being a threat to the world.

You mean like some of the Green candidates have done?

The photo was modelled on a still taken from a Nazi propaganda video

Why would the Guardian publish a photograph modelled on a still taken from a Nazi propaganda video six months before Farage did?

A spokesperson for Getty Images confirmed that the picture had been licensed from them and was taken in Slovenia in 2015 by its staff photographer Jeff Mitchell.

It doesn't matter that it was taken in Europe

Why did you say it had nothing to do with the EU then?

I am too tired to deal with wilful ignorance right now. My last message to you because you will NOT twist or manipulate my words. The poster was designed by Reform/Farage - it weaponised this image (in the way that these people will weaponize anything to their advantage) and added the words BREAKING POINT. It became a propaganda campaign which was using a picture of refugees to demonstrate why the UK should leave the EU. THAT had nothing to do with Europe.

This captured the public's imagination in the way that stuff written on the side of buses did - and in the way that the Nazis did when they wanted the world to believe that Jews were a danger to be avoided. The idea of standing in front of a poster of brown refugees to labour a point about leaving the EU was a cynical and propagandist move. If you can't or won't see that then I can't say any more to you as I am out of ways of explaining this simple concept to you, if you see everything literally.

I am interested to learn what definition of zionism you are using. Zionism, simply, is the belief that Jewish people have the right to self-determination, the right to a homeland in Israel. While not all Jews may consider themselves Zionist you will find that the vast majority do. This is not some fringe belief, it is widespread amongst Jewish communities worldwide.
I know that people who wish to have their anti-zionist but not anti-semitic cake and eat it find this fact a bit uncomfortable as it makes it harder for them to pretend that they don't have a problem with most Jews, it's just those evil zionist ones they despise because, if you have a problem with most zionists and most Jews are zionists then you, by default, have a problem with most Jews. It's why so many 'anti-zionists' are so obsessed with the Neturei Karta, a tiny Jewish sect vehemently opposed to the state of Israel, because they get to post photos of obviously orthodox Jews protesting against the existence of the state of Israel and say:
"See, these Jews are on our side, how can we be anti-semitic?"
Attempting to pretend that, instead of being a tiny group, they actually represent the majority opinions and beliefs of Jews globally. In many ways, Polanski is very much the Green party's answer to the Neturei Karta!
I personally believe you cannot legitimately consider yourself genuinely anti-racist if you place conditions on your support for members of a particular minority group or only deem them worthy to be defended from discrimination if they behave in ways you personally find acceptable.
I am a traditional Labour voter but I was dismayed when Labour MP Rupa Huq described Kwasi Kwarteng as 'superficially black'. I felt it implied that Huq was suggesting that 'real black people' all think, feel and vote the same way, with no individual free-will, and that, by daring to differ politically from her, Kwasi Kwarteng had no right to his black identity and forfeited his right to be protected from racist abuse as he had not acted as she believed a 'good black person' should. Apart from being incredibly patronising and insultingg this falls into a trap which I have seen others, who consider themselves to be good people, opposed to all forms of discrimination and on the 'right side of history fall into before, that they can only carry tolerance so far, they may be willing to call out discriminatory language and actions when aimed at their friends and allies but can also rush to excuse it when it is aimed at those they disapprove of. If one is truly opposed to all forms of prejudice one cannot, in good faith, make these sort of distinctions.

I'm a councillor and sit on the planning committee. There is often no reason that we can refuse developments even if we want to. There are regulations on planning - if we refuse outside of these it will go to appeal, the developers will win and it will cost the council large amounts of money

Ok, thanks, @catsandpolitics

Yebba* you lose multiple points when you use the term 'zionist lobby' especially equating it to being behind the rise of the righ in the UK. Only used by people who have less than nice views towards jews separate from israel, propoganda tool. israel has nothing to do with the growing people that are not left leaning ffs

The twat and his brainless followers should look into the role socialists played in the Iranian revolution and what the Islamists did to them after they had won.

Anyone who votes for him is either thick or evil.

Thank you, @Everlore for that really clear explanation.
I saw that the Jewish Greens are cautioning the leadership about their approach to Zionism. They fear it will target most Jews.
To add: they are therefore against the motion mooted that Zionism is Racism.

@catsandpolitics That hasn’t stopped lots of planning committees saying no. We just see tight budgets and cuts elsewhere. It’s about time councillors were fined. That might concentrate the mind in some cases. Even when sites get included in the local plans there are still endless arguments delaying building.

Perhaps you should educate yourself on the process. It will not stop permission being granted as it will go to appeal. And fine councillors for what exactly?

@catsandpolitics I know the process thanks! It’s about delay and councillors willfully stopping housing by lengthy delays. Appeals are far too common. It’s a nimby tactic and everyone knows it. It’s also mega expensive and DH has made a lot of money by successfully representing developers at appeals. I’m hoping Labour start to sort this out.

I’ve read pp’s post a twice now and I still don’t get why they felt the need to mention the “Zionist lobby” when talking about Farage and Reform.

99% of councillors from all sides are doing their absolute best for their residents with very little thanks and you're talking about fining them? Oh and I'm on the YIMBY side of it btw

I have been out for the afternoon and only just read your reply.

you will NOT twist or manipulate my words

I haven't twisted your words at all. You claimed that a photograph showing migrants crossing the border from Croatia into Slovenia [towards Austria] 'had nothing to do with the EU'. Now you are saying it 'had nothing to do with Europe'. What nonsense is that?

The poster was designed by Reform/Farage

Actually, the poster was designed by an ad agency based in Scotland - using a photograph sold by Getty Images taken in 2015. The almost identical photograph published by the Guardian some months earlier was taken by the same photographer - as per the credits in the Guardian link.

Your claim that the photograph was modelled on a still taken from a Nazi propaganda video is pure speculation.

Farage ... weaponised this image

Perhaps he did - however the scene in the photograph is no less real than the scenes in the Guardian report - the caption no less stark than the warning from the Slovenian prime minister - quoted in the Guardian report.

This captured the public's imagination in the way that stuff written on the side of buses did

No doubt, but the Breaking Point poster cannot be seen in isolation - the public were bombarded with multiple news stories such as these: migrants storming the Channel Tunnel over several months in the summer of 2015;

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jul/29/calais-one-dead-1500-migrants-storm-eurotunnel-terminal

Terrorist attacks in Europe - this article from July 2016;

Summer of fear: the anxious mood in Germany and France

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/29/one-eye-on-the-emergency-exit-the-anxious-mood-in-germany-and-france

Considering there are different views, it doesn't meet the 'echo chamber' you suggested.

The leader of the Green Party and many of their candidates have said some pretty awful things. Many agree with that, some think he's lovely.

I wouldn't currently vote for the party that allows antisemitic comments to stand. Obviously, sone people dont worry about hate speech 🙄