Is MN feeding unhealthy attitudes towards men?

[Grtscott]

Some threads I've read this morning have helped me to realise that my thinking about men has changed since joining MN. And not in a good way.

There's an undertone that men need to do things the woman's way, or it's wrong. That men should be grateful for any sex that women are willing to give in a long term relationship, even if that peters out to no sex at all.

Men are seen to be babies who can't do anything for themselves, and need to have someone pre plan and organise their lives, but god forbid they fall into the pattern of behaviour of expecting their female partner to do these things for them, as that's what they've always done.

This thinking is observable to a greater or lesser extent across the boards.

I've also recognised where this thinking has affected the way I think about my wonderful man, and sometimes in things I've said to him or actions towards him. I need to watch this in future.

I'm concerned that the general thinking about men on this website can't be good for society if this is the way women think, and are encouraged to think by others.

If women treat men this way collectively and have low expectations around them, no wonder the bar is getting lower.

I agree that MN perpetuates group hate towards men. If it was a men’s site it would have been shut down by now.

Or maybe you need to look a bit deeper at the reasons women speaking up about their experiences triggers you. There maybe is something very uncomfortable for you about confronting how other people are experiencing relationships. I have a fantastic relationship with my husband but my brother sexually abused me. So I don’t find the relationship board as triggering as you might because I integrated a long time ago that there is good and bad stuff going on all the time even very close to home. That to me appears to be the issue you are having. You are struggling badly with that cognitive dissonance and you are trying to take your discomfort out on female posters on MN. I can’t imagine you are writing to newspaper editors or the BBC to proclaim your discomfort at them contributing to how men are viewed in the world? Maybe I’m wrong and you are.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

If that's what you want to think, crack on.

And

Regarding what your brother did to you, thank you for sharing. It sounds like you've been able to accept what was done to you and move on past it with dignity. No small feat.

Really?

You are familiar with all the men's sites advocating actual violence towards women which are very much still there then?

I think either you are a liar or you don't know much about the internet.

You think my 'often' is doing the heavy lifting so you bring in 'sometimes' to take over?
You can't question the validity of an opinion using such terms then fail to provide anything more robust, such as statistical evidence to support your own argument.
As far as I'm aware there is no data on this to support either of us. So we both speak from experience, patterns observed and so on.
You may well be a woman who has not had the experience of a male colleague befriending you because he is sexually interested in you.
You may never have had a person you believed to be a good friend developing feelings. However, enough women say this has happened to them for us to know it happens.
Enough women come on here and talk of friendships that led to their husband having an affair for us to identify a pattern.
I agree we don't know for sure how prevalent it is, and of course we can't say every case follows the pattern.
My point was that in these threads my stance is usually to acknowledge there is a risk.
Other people like yourself are equally free to reassure the OP there is no risk if you like. That's the point of a range of views, surely?

But it doesn't, it isn't and it hasn't.

There may be some dodgy men’s sites in the dark recesses of the web but MN is a mainstream site.

I'm not sure how else to describe it. Easily influenced?

And you weren't talking about marriages, but rather men in general. I'm sure you know more than one man, don't you?

At any rate, yes, it does seem weak-minded to be so badly affected by women asking for support or venting about men in their lives, that you find you actively need to remind yourself they're not all like that.

Nah @Grtscott I read your original message before you edited. I’ve nothing to say to you.

You mean like Reddit where the spree killers hang out?

Don’t agree with you OP. MN merely reflects realistic experiences of women. What is wrong with that exactly on a supposedly female-orientated site? A healthy dose of realism is a much better way to approach life.

I'd be delighted for you to link me to the section of MN where there's a pile of posts advocating for violence towards men.

Please do enlighten me so I can report to the relevant authorities.

I don't expect you to have anything to say to me.

I added to my original post. Nothing taken away. Re-reading your post allowed me to see the detail, hence my edit.

I'm happy to be recorded laughing at the thrust of your post, as your interpretation of what I've said is so far off the mark from anything I've posted.

I have read the entire thread, so I'm fine, thanks.

But you've literally said that what you read on Mumsnet influences how you treat your husband, in a negative way - that's troubling.

I don't think that's the norm for most Mumsnet users, and indeed many have said it makes them either appreciate the good men in their lives more, or in some cases has helped them recognise abusive behaviour.

You express concern about the effect Mumsnet might have on women - I think in regards to discussion about men, it's mostly a valuable resource that provides sensible support and advice, as well as having vigorous and well-informed discussion about men as a class, and issues regarding sexism and patriarchy.

So no, I don't think Mumsnet is feeding unhealthy attitudes towards men for the average user. I suppose that a minority - like you - might be vulnerable to that, though.

Are you unable to take one short pithy example and extrapolate?

If you can't get the point from what I wrote, so be it. I don't feel disengaging from a discussion with a person who stoops straight to "weak minded" will be much of a loss.

If it were an issue all the low earning and short men would be single.
Its an issue only in the minds of men who are unable to get any and every woman they feel entitled to to date them, and don't see why they should have to broaden their own criteria to include women who may not be their own idea of physical perfection.
A man who is of decent character will always be of interest to women if instead of becoming embittered, bleating about how shallow women who won't date them are, they took a leaf from their own book and widened their range.

Disney and the porn industry have a lot of blame to carry between them.

Yes but the recent threads where women admit that their husbands do absolutely nothing in the house makes me seem why so many here absolutely detest men.

They should know that their experiences arent universal and it is about picking men with good character, essentially. But if your only experiences are fathers, brothers and then husbands who do nothing but use and abuse you, then your attitude isn't going to be much different to what we see.

It seems like a lot of the middle classed and particularly white British couples are living together in total resentment of each other but feel they have to stay in that toxic dyad. Of course over time that will kill any sort of kindness or compassion you have in you for anyone remotely like your enemy spouse

Oh yes, because all the men's sites overflowing with hatred towards women, including pining over wanting to beat and rape them, calling them 'foids', and advocating for 'white sharia' etc, get shut down.

Oh wait. No they don't.

Perhaps you need to explain yourself better.

Because what you wrote was that you need to 'actively remind yourself' there are good men out there, lest what you read on Mumsnet radicalises you against men.

Yes

It just makes me wonder if htry are so useless why marry them or live with them or breed with them in the first place then do nothing put up with it you have a partner problem not a man problem

Ans what does white have to do with it?

I have not used the word radicalise anywhere. I will answer you if you quote me for politeness , but this really is a discussion I see no point in engaging in with you.

ETA: Never mind, I misread your last post.

Because this site is mostly white people and this type of attitude towards men seems pervasive in middle classed white women. As a Black woman, I don't hear this spoken about like that in Black households. Either women are happier with how labour is divided, however it is divided, and/or the men do more. From my experience, the men do more than what is being described in these threads for certain.