Is MN feeding unhealthy attitudes towards men?

[Grtscott]

Some threads I've read this morning have helped me to realise that my thinking about men has changed since joining MN. And not in a good way.

There's an undertone that men need to do things the woman's way, or it's wrong. That men should be grateful for any sex that women are willing to give in a long term relationship, even if that peters out to no sex at all.

Men are seen to be babies who can't do anything for themselves, and need to have someone pre plan and organise their lives, but god forbid they fall into the pattern of behaviour of expecting their female partner to do these things for them, as that's what they've always done.

This thinking is observable to a greater or lesser extent across the boards.

I've also recognised where this thinking has affected the way I think about my wonderful man, and sometimes in things I've said to him or actions towards him. I need to watch this in future.

I'm concerned that the general thinking about men on this website can't be good for society if this is the way women think, and are encouraged to think by others.

If women treat men this way collectively and have low expectations around them, no wonder the bar is getting lower.

I’m not really sure why you’re surprised. This is a website for predominantly women to discuss issues relating to child-rearing and relationships. It’s naturally going to skew towards women who are fed up with men or struggling with issues to do with their partners. If you went into a site filled with predominantly men discussing their relationships with women and issues with rearing their children I’d be deeply surprised not to see a trend towards negatively stereotyping women.

It’s good you’ve recognised that regular reading is affecting you, and I hope you can carry that realisation into other areas of your life if you engage with any other social media. It all comes with a bias, and you have to be aware in order to stop it affecting you.

Recognising that there’s both an upsetting number of abusive/intentionally incompetent men out there and as well as a tendency towards a knee jerk instinct that it’s probably the man’s fault on here shouldn’t spoil your enjoyment of the website. People post loads of things here that are idiotic; they also post loads of thoughtful, kind and insightful stuff. Sometimes the same person does both. Just make sure you aren’t taking it into your own relationship and enjoy the rough with the smooth!

I am so sure of it because statistics, and the reality of profit. Men pretend to be women all over internet sex stuff. Either for kicks or money.

See Ashley Madison etc.🤷‍♀️

Oh, and I've seen it happening on Mnet.🙈

That doesn’t stop it from being a thing.

But this isn’t ALL MEN.

The women who take their time to post on here are in quite extreme situations, and are typically in quite desperate need of advice.

IME it’s not just everyday niggles, but something rotten at the heart of their relationship.

There are gazillions of normal relationships where people have no need to post on Mumsnet. You’re assuming what you read on here is the norm, but it’s actually extreme cases where the poor OP needs help.

You do realise we don't know if you are a man either..

I know the argument but I don’t see why anybody cares. Plump, older, unattractive women have smaller dating pools than slim, younger, attractive ones but I don’t see the same concern about that. Nobody is harmed by having a smaller dating pool.

Plenty of them feed into it. There are plenty of men who ridicule men for being less stereotypically masculine. And men who deem tall, broad women as “mannish”.

Because you've posted about MN, so the content of other websites is relevant.

Perhaps those other women who view their husbands more negatively because of discussions about other people's husbands should also step back from Mumsnet, as that's not a healthy attitude to have. It seems rather odd to me. Threads on here just make me value my dh more!

Concern yourself with the ever increasing number of women and girls being murdered and abused by men instead.

In the words of Margaret Atwood..

”Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.”

My views on men were formed at a very young age, via watching Mary Poppins.

”though we adore men individually, we agree that as a group they’re rather stupid”

Nothing I have personally experienced or more broadly observed has managed to convince me that the above perspective is incorrect. I know some truly lovely, caring, intelligent and all round great men. Men as a group class though? Enormously problematic.

Nope, men are doing a great job of feeding negative attitudes about men.

Don't get me started on the impact Disney had on society's view of the sexes...

It wasn't his friend though, I agree that it's a different scenario if it's one of his close friends.

Stag and hen dos usually involve lots of people that don't know each other because they bring together families and different friendship groups, the only person that will know everyone is the groom or bride.

I would be so annoyed if I went on a hen do and my husband thought I was going to cheat just because the brides cousin or random work colleague was planning to.

There's always the possibility of your partner lying to you but there has to be some trust otherwise what's the point?

It isn't only the OP, I'm actively reminding myself while reading MN of all the good guy behaviour that isn't being reported because it's just this behaving decently.

I doubt if it's just two of us.

Why do you need to actively remind yourself of the fact that many men are decent, if you interact with them often?

In honesty, it seems a little weak-minded to be so influenced by women talking about the factual statistics of men's criminality or sexism as a class, or individual women's issues with abusive or useless men, that you actually have to remind yourself that not every man is awful.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Weak minded. Would you like to add any more insults? Perhaps go a little further to proving that women can't discuss this rationally.

A society where overall men hold the power, through a variety formal and informal mechanisms.
You're correct in the uk that this isn't formalised, but it still exists and is demonstrated by all sorts of examples from the fact that men kill and hurt women at alarming rates, to women's over representation in lower status lower power occupations and in the domestic rather than public sphere. Basically, think of any instance where women get the rougher end of the deal because we are women and you'll find patriarchy at the root of it.
For men it manifests as toxic masculinity and that's the root of the problems men create for women and thenselves.
I don't 'hate men'. I don't believe that a baby born a boy is innately 'bad'. I believe that a patriarchal society takes them and shapes them into the role required of them. For many this is hugely advantageous and they are able to perform it well. Others who can't can be its victims. Others still are ruined by it and become the monsters.

Oh dear. I'm not being insulting, I was making an honest observation about the effect that Mumsnet appears to be having on you and the OP. I'm sorry if that offends you, but your reaction does seem unusually strong.

For you to be so influenced by what you read online, to the point that it threatens to override your own positive experiences in real life, and you have to actively remind yourself of the decent men out there, doesn't seem healthy or balanced.

Why do you think what you read on Mumsnet has such an influence on you?

😂🙈🤯

Can I ask you @Grtscott do you feel the same reading the newspaper, watching the news? Pages after page of men going to prison for murder, male pattern violence in wars they’ve started, violence on the streets, rape and sexual assault, one of today’s I saw was a man convicted of training his dog to do sex acts on him, a boy who murdered a 30 something year old man etc etc or is it something particularly about women speaking up about bad relationships that really triggers you?

I thought it was hilarious, I'm not offended. But if you don't think calling someone weak minded is not offensive then you might need to do some work on your interpersonal skills.

Real life is personal knowledge of one good marriage. MN is personal detail of dozens of bad ones a week. I think there are a lot of us in this forum reminding ourselves that people don't write about the good stuff.

In honesty, it seems a little weak-minded to be so influenced by women talking about the factual statistics of men's criminality or sexism as a class, or individual women's issues with abusive or useless men, that you actually have to remind yourself that not every man is awful.

Ah. I now understand @OtterlyAstounding .

You have completely and utterly missed the entire point of my thread. This paragraph makes that abundantly clear.

Go back and have a bit of a re-read. It should help.

Another post that completely misses the point of the thread...