I just wouldn’t allow my child to do that… AIBU

[Dumbo18]

2 very strong willed kids who don’t really care about consequences and can get very emotional - angry, sad, happy just big emotions really. We often find daily life can be a battle especially with the 4 year old (7 year old can be just as bad) not really looking for advice as I’ve read countless threads on the subject so have seen and tried it all but here is where I don’t know if I am being unreasonable (maybe more am I missing something) 4 year old was refusing to brush teeth at bedtime, had to be done not an option especially as she had cake for pudding. Would absolutely not do it and I could hear in my head lovely people off this site saying well I just wouldn’t have that she would have no choice etc and it got me thinking how on earth would you just not have it?? Force her mouth open- absolutely not. Refuse to read her a book- tried, no tv in the morning- tried, calmly explaining why it’s important- tried, shout- tried. She brushed them in the end so not looking for advice more just an answer on if you say I wouldn’t allow that what is it that you do? Not only with teeth brushing but daily life. I think it’s easy to say I wouldn’t allow that when you are the parent of a child who does what they are asked, responds to consequences etc.

Having one relatively strong willed child (and one who is quite compliant with "authority")....I think it takes a huge amount of patience, negotiation, tactics, boundaries, positive reinforcement, consequences, sometimes physical intervention. I wouldn't say I "just give look" or they simply respect my authority . So I think there are things we're ultimately we "just make them" or "just don't let them", but doing that is hard work, and means we pick our battles. The more compliant child, I think that's just their nature and it is easier to just use that stern voice and they'll do it.

I would have let it go, then tomorrow at lunch time given out another sweet treat to everyone that brushes their teeth without complaint. "Oh well when you brush your teeth like you're told to you can have the treats too. But until you do that no treats so that your teeth aren't getting unnecessary extra sugar". Yes child will kick off massively. Let them. When you go to brush teeth next time just remind them they might miss out on the next sweet treat.
That's what I've done with mine. Has always worked. I'm a foster carer and parent of 5 so seen a lot of kids struggle with daily routines. I find eventually by never giving in they all come around to it. In my house there's no breakfast until you are up, dressed, (showered too for the older ones). No tv or screens or games until teeth are brushed, faces washed and school bags packed etc. Strict boundaries have so far never failed me. Some things I'll negotiate on but basic hygiene isn't one of them... so far...

I got my dd an electric toothbrush when she was four. That helped a bit because she likes the feel of it and I think it’s doing more than just the manual brush (at least when it’s in her mouth).
She is six now and waiting to be assessed for adhd. It’s still a point of contention but I find it helps me to keep in mind that as frustrating as it is, they are her teeth in the end of the day. I’ve got a few more years of bugging her about it then it’s up to her. She will do them, the problem for us is that she has to be jumping/ spinning/ dancing/ running on the spot while she brushes or she will “die of boredom” and it doesn’t seem like a particularly effective way of doing it. When she was a toddler we had to play music, use a timer and still we often had to put her in a very gentle headlock 🤦‍♀️
I also have to remind myself how much I hate brushing my own teeth and how at the dentist I have to sing songs in my head to distract me from how hard it is to lie still.

But the OP has clearly tried that!

Yes I force my DS’s mouth open when he refuses and no, I don’t care what you think! He has SEN, he can be notoriously difficult about anything ‘self-care’ related I.e nail cutting, tooth brushing, hair cuts. I take him to a specialised SEN hairdresser for a 1:1 cut so other customers don’t have to listen to him scream and she’s also super patient.

For nail cutting and teeth brushing, I pin him down. What’s the alternative- long infected nails and cavities? Get a grip OP. I use the nice strawberry toothpaste and musical toothbrushes and we’ve tried toothbrushing songs and dances and everything you can imagine. He won’t see a dentist either so we’re on a waiting list for a special needs one.

Agree.

Nappy changing is a bit different.

If a child is really fighting you hammer and nails and you’re trying to brush their teeth you can really hurt them. I’m lucky as I’ve only had very brief fighting over teeth and I was able to get round it by letting them brush my teeth and that did actually show me how bloody horrible it is to have a toothbrush shoved roughly into your mouth.

But I think overall it isn’t about teeth but about compliance. And while there are strategies and suggestions none are foolproof and particularly mulish children are often quite switched on to them (both mine twigged quite quickly that the best answer to ‘do you want mummy or daddy to put you in the car?’ was ‘I don’t want either of you to put me in the car because I don’t want to go to nursery’ or as they put it NO MUMMY! NO DADDY! NO CAR!’)

DD has refused a few times to brush her teeth, everything goes off no tv, music etc, and I stood in front of her holding the toothbrush till she took it and brushed her teeth. I made it clear neither of us were moving or doing anything else till her teeth were brushed and if that meant staying there all day/night then that’s what we’d do. Then I just stayed silent and waited. She managed about 15 minutes once but every other time gave in after about 5 minutes.

My DS is ‘beautifully behaved’ until I wave a toothbrush or nail clippers in his face then forget it- he’s kicking, screaming, shouting, rolling around etc. Pretty sure it would class as neglect if I didn’t brush his teeth or cut his nails so pin him down. I hate doing it but needs must. It’s the same with medication if he needs that. Thankfully he doesn’t get sick often now so doesn’t need Calpol for temps as he did when small during winter in particular. God that was sheer hell.

Sometimes you have to pick your battles to win the war.

I think the people who say such nonsense are just making shit up in their head. Some of the stuff people say on here is just not how life is

The thread itself demonstrates that in reality pinning down and forcing is relatively rare with the majority of us that consider it an essential managing someway or other through patience, bribing, negotiating etc etc

I found setting them a challenge against the clock. Maybe not right for teeth brushing but great for putting away the toys or getting into PJs.

If you can't get a 4 yo DC to do what you ask them, god help you when you've got teenagers!

Tooth cleaning is alwaYs the kicker

we did the same: bribe, beg, threaten, coerce, anger,

i did all sorts of random stuff. The toothbrush had a name for a while and would talk to the kid 🙄

Reading this made my blood boil.
"Totally disagree. Plenty of great, boundaried parents I know have kids with autism, ADHD and learning disabilities that are beautifully behaved. This fad of ADHD being used as an excuse for children to run feral seems thankfully to be coming to an end."
Really though? I think you have no idea what it's like. I've parented a child with ASD and he's now a teenager. You absolutely pick your battles. Doesn't want to brush teeth today, no problem, try another day etc. He is now an amazing lad. God knows what he'd have been like if I'd 'forced' him through the normal parenting styles. No one NT or ND child is the same. Patience by the ton is key.

It depends on the child I think. When mine was four I would have made it into a game, but that doesn’t work for every child.
What was it that led yours to do them in the end? That would surely be a clue as to what would work?

so smug!

Like you I am blown away when other parents say "my child wouldn't get away with that" or "is make them do it" or "I'd threaten xyz until they do" because that has never worked on my son.

I might be missing something but she obviously did respond to you as she then did her teeth. At what point was that, what was the trigger?

My son was the same, I used to pin him down and brush them! Teeth brushing is non negotiable and I don't have the patience to argue with a child for half an hour. He's 8 now and he can be hard work and very hyper. He does brush his teeth on his own though now. Sometimes you have to be harsh and stick with your punishments even though it can be embarrassing in public. My son will kick off and throw things around but he does calm down later. Don't worry about other parents. My first child was really easy, it's easy to judge other parents when your kid is easy and does what their told!

Interesting how your immediate assumption is I have no experience of additional needs...
We're allowed to have differing opinions on whether it's the individual child or parent or circumstance. There's no way for any of us to be fully certain, even when on paper the experience looks the same.

Relaxed Mum here and as others said: pick your battles. Teeth being brushed is a non-negotiable. Tell your child that any more hiccups with teeth brushing will result in loss of privileges such as screen time, TV time etc.

Mean what you say and follow through.

Genuinely though, do you go nights without toothbrushing?

bless your heart.

I have a somewhat non compliant child and I would say figuring out whether consequences or incentives work better for your kid is 1. Another is what the other poster said about picking your battles and when it’s a must do, not allowing it otherwise no matter what. We had a brief issue with DC not staying in bedrooms at bedtime. I had to put a 5yo back to bed maybe 30-40 times a night for several nights without engaging. Usually once I could tell that they were really tired, I’d point out that the evening was going to end with them asleep in their own bed one way or another. There was no world where they just wouldn’t go to sleep. DC gave up after that and after a couple nights, stopped getting out of bed. DH tried bargaining, offering incentives before good behavior etc and ended in tears all around (and with me ultimately putting them in bed 30 times).

However, my DC has always been pretty good at rational conversation from a young age, so with teeth, you can tell her about the bacteria and that it’ll end up with cavities or point out that she’ll fall asleep either way so why do it the yucky way and she’ll usually change her mind if I catch her at the right point in the fight.

I’m not sure how much of it is just that she knows I mean business because I always always follow through with consequences. I do also have an excellent quiet scary voice on account of having been a lifeguard previously.