to be getting irate at friends with adult DC who do not work?

[goldenteapot]

My DC are in their mid-late 20s and all in work - but are the exception among family and friends. They have around 12 cousins - none of whom have ever worked in so much as a local pub or shop, and all live in their parents' naice houses gaming all day. Lots have one or two degrees, so are not stupid by any means! I think statistically about 50% of young adults of this age that are not working - but among my family and friends it's very much higher.

It's a similar story with friends: every adult child is depressed or anxious and/or autistic so cannot work. The assumption seems to be that the jobs market is too difficult and their children can't cope. Conversation when we meet is all about how frustrated everyone is because they can't get their DC to work or do anything around the house.

I just want to shake them all! They are providing no tough love or reasons that these children will ever work and live independently.

AIBU to be losing my patience with everyone, or am I a bit of a bitch and working life really is too tough these days for young people?

I think it's great if someone who genuinely can't work is able to go to the pub. Maintaining social and community links can only be beneficial and help towards recovery, where that's possible.

But it didn't in my case. I was turned down three times for lcwra and it was only when I shattered my leg to pieces that I got benefits and even then I had to go to tribunal - the Scottish system is better. I felt like a person rather than a number and I still get people calling me scroungers on the daily. It's tough

I have two degrees and two post grads, I worked for 30 years and on the daily I get told I'm nothing because I get disability benefits. It's been an eye opener

I actually don't go to the pub often but I agree. Why should people with disabilities be told they can't go to the pub because if they leave the house they are fit for work - that is not how it works

At this point in my life all I can cope with is watching football. Going for the odd meal with my mum and brother - and studying online. Before I was stalked I didn't have the most exciting life but I had a social life. I was fitness instructor. I got up every day without living in fear - and no one would have employed me 6 years ago when my life fell to pieces.

Well they couldn’t even if they wanted to.
I have been enjoying a series of photos recently on Instagram of young people in the 90s living in squats in London. Big melting pots of creativity, cultural melting pots where people from all over the world would live together , make art, make a life. It can’t happen now because everything is so heavily regulated .My student house was a sprawling crumbling 7bed wreck, patched up with sellotape, but nevertheless filled with people and laughter. It was cheap. We loved it. In my child’s shared house , they can’t even leave a spoon in the communal area without a formal notice from the landlord. Currently there are loads of young people up and down the country about to lose their accommodation because it doesn’t meet the minimum requirements outlined in the new regulations for landlords that shelter have campaigned for.
None of us want our children to live in unsafe accommodation, but it’s a fact that the new regs will see rents for young people hiked even further so as landlords can make the necessary improvements for energy performance and so on.
It’s just nothing like it was, even ten years ago and it’s no wonder so many are depressed, when every mechanism that supposedly protect them offers yet one more financial slap in the face.

I think the bigger issue is is that people who work don't like paying for people like me. And I have been on disability benefits 18 months and they are stopping next month

No one should be bringing up kids in a squat. No matter how much laughter there is. There have been people who died thanks to no regulations. There was a fire in a student house in Glasgow about 25 years ago. Bars on the windows. The occupants died because they could not get out

Regulations are there for a reason. Same with carbon monoxide. It changed in Scotland after a footballer called Norrie McCathie as and his gf died of carbon monoxide poisoning. My heating went faulty in a flat I lived in and I only lived because my windows were faulty and let fresh air in. No one wants to go back to days like that

Agree 100%.

And if people talk about being "depressed". You don't know what depression is. I can assure you of that.

There are people who have died because their landlords weren't regulated properly. Can you imagine what it was like for those students in Glasgow trying to get out of a window when their flat was on fire when the window was sealed shut because of metal bars some idiot of a landlord put in?

Regulation is the difference between life and death

I agree. But it’s no use any of us assuming that this generation are too precious to make the sacrifices we did, especially when it comes to living in substandard accommodation to save money, because it isn’t simply isn’t an option. The world has changed so much.

FWIW, I don't mind paying for people 'like you' at all. A good society supports the most vulnerable and those in need. People can contribute to society in other ways than through taxes (and often have contributed through taxes at some point too). The problem isn't helping people who need it, it is people who abuse the system that make people unhappy. Determining who those people are isn't straight forward though.

To be fair, I have noticed that people in the young adult populations do often have quite high expectations and expect a lot more than our generation did. I have heard a few say they aren't going to do a particular job because they don't want to. I was raised with the idea that a job is a job and you do it till you find what you do want to do (assuming you're work capable).

The person I was responding to wasn't talking about this generation. They were talking about theirs - my point was. There are regulations now that weren't there 30 years ago. I live in Scotland and it's a requirement that you have to have smoke detectors fitted whether you own or you don't. You have to have a monoxide detector too. And landlords are not allowed to put metal bars across windows - because people died

This generation didn't 't make the sacrifices. Landlords are held to a higher standard now because people died in their own homes - decades ago

If people want to hark back to the good old days. Let them Google Norrie McCathie and his gf and the kids who died in Glasgow flat because their landlord had put metal bars across the windows

BTW. I was a council tenant when my flat was full of monoxide. It should not have taken Norrie and his gf to die before councils started putting in monoxide detectors as standard

I am in a council flat now and the smoke detectors I have are state of the art. It was not like that back in the day when you had to buy your own and stick them to the ceiling

I would rather pay rent for the property I have than sit and go - back in the day I lived in a squat and it was all good. I'm safe in my flat. You can't put a price on that

I can well believe you would sadly be turned down. Which is why I'm surprised so many young people actually get benefits. Though I would wager a lot of them are simply supported by parents. But yes I think what I was trying to get at is that full-time work might be too much for some of these people. Maybe there needs to be more part-time jobs. If they're happy to only get a small wage then why not? But even that's looked down on if you're young and have no dependents, people think everyone must work full time!

I got adult disability payment too and I was treated well for once. Because when I got it for my shattered leg and I was crying down the phone about my mental health the assessor said hang on. There's more going on

It's good to hear there are still some caring supportive people working in these places. It's a scandal it took so long to be listened to though

I think the pub/restaurant thing is so ridiculous. If it's applied to the disabled it should apply to the retired too. Still able to go to the pub once every so often? No retirement for you! Keep working - why should others be forced to fund you? Able to go on holiday ever, even for just a weekend at age 80 and others are doing everything for you? You should still be at work! Nobody ever makes that argument and rightly so - it's ridiculous. My parents and most of their friends are in their mid 70s and many have health problems that don't come near to disabling them to the point of needing carers or anything but there's no way they could still hold down a full time job. They manage the odd trip to the pub or a meal out though and nobody accuses them of scrounging or "faking" so why should younger disabled people put up with it? I have 5 or 6 disabled friends, all with a mixture of conditions and the pub occasionally is perfectly manageable and good for mental health. Most of us aren't able to clean or tidy our houses or have the kind of energy limiting illnesses that can make it dangerous to invite people round as if they stay later than you're able to tolerate it can put you in danger. With things like ME/CFS, somebody overstaying their welcome can cause a crash and further disable you which is really scary (I've had this happen) so the pub or a restaurant is far safer as you can leave early if you need to and you're not forced to push beyond your energy limits. It gives you control which can keep you safe. Pretty garbled point I've made there but that's brain fog for you!

As regards some of the recent comments, I'll repeat my view that anyone who can stand or sit for hours in a pub or game all night or day are fit enough to do some kind of job. I've got a fraction of the disposable income or social life of some people who've been drawing benefits for years. People who've worked all their lives shouldn't be the worst off. The system's rotten and needs drastically overhauled.

But you didn't previously say gaming all night and day, you said 'sit and game for hours'. Not the same thing at all. Look, genuine piss-takers are indeed out there, they obviously shouldn't be able to get away with it, and I can't imagine anyone would try to argue they should. And benefits do sometimes get misallocated, and it needs addressing when that happens.

But you sound like a 'where's your wheelchair, then?' type. If you can't see someone's issues it doesn't always mean they're not there. And given the tone of your posts on this thread it's difficult to take your word for it that the situation with the young man you mentioned upthread is as straightforward as you made it sound. He does not have a good life and is very likely to die young given how you described him. I'm extremely sceptical that this is a lifestyle he's happily chosen to embrace, even if he acts like it is. Put it this way, would you want to swap with him?

If he has some degree of capacity for work he should, of course, be making an effort to find something he's able to do (and you don't actually know he isn't, incidentally). But does he genuinely sound like a happy or well-adjusted person to you? Happy people don't spend all hours indoors gaming or live off takeaways, and people this guy's size are almost never genuinely happy people. If you're taking some surface jollity and nonchalance from his manner, it's almost definitely an act/a defence shield.

I'm referring to a few people I know, in actual fact. The first boy I mentioned who games all night and sleeps all day is just one of quite a few. There's another who claims endless benefits and a free bus pass who thinks because he helps out a bit at the local church a couple of days a week doing this and that is entitled to a 'day off' towards the end of the week. A day off from what, for f#ck's sake?

If you earn even minimum wage you earn double my total income from benefits LoyalMember. My parents have to pay most of my bills so I'm able to afford food and the medications I can't get on the NHS. I don't think people in minimum wage jobs realise how lucky they are compared to many disabled people who get far less despite having costs that are far higher, and have no prospect for ever changing this.

And what kind of job is equivalent in skill and effort levels to sitting in a pub for 3 hours once every 2 to 4 weeks and lifting a drink to your mouth every so often? One that would let you call in sick at short notice 50% of the time or give you 6 weeks off every three months for operations and all the post operative treatments needed in the immediate aftermath?

All bar one of my disabled friends (who had serious schizophrenia from a young age and was in and out of psychiatric hospitals) worked our whole lives too until it became impossible - our employers either told us we couldn't meet the requirements of the jobs we were doing anymore or the DWP assessed us as being unable to work due to it being dangerous for us or others or just completely unrealistic (they don't do this unless it's pretty obvious you would be a liability in the work place and need more time off than any employer would accept).

What is someone doing in a pub that means they are fit for work? Talking, and taking swigs of drink.... maybe having a meal too. They can do that at home. The only difference is the environment.

Not as unfit and incapacitated as they claim, clearly, though.

Ok, so...

sitting and having a drink at home = unfit and incapacitated
sitting and having a drink in a pub = swinging the lead and needs to get a job

How does that make sense? I have seen people go to the pub with carers/PAs. Are they taking the piss too?

Are disabled people not allowed to leave the house and do anything nice, lest they get accused of being a fraud?

I don’t make the rules. I'm only calling it as I see it as a middle aged person, pain wracked after decades of work. I'm allowed an opinion. It's one of the few things a lot of us have got left.

Edited for spelling.

Why clearly? Why do you think we've claimed not to be able to make it to the pub ever? I talked about being able to go to the pub in my own assessment. I was awarded anyway because there was enough evidence to show I had very limited capacity for work despite my very minimal social life.

It's funny how everyone who likes to benefit bash 'knows a few people' who are supposedly living the life of Riley on benefits when there's bugger all wrong with them. You may be right about these people, but I suspect you've just chosen to make assumptions that suit your narrative.

I am right, and they're not the only ones I know. It's endemic in the whole country, and bickering about it on Mumsnet's hardly going to change anything, I'll leave things now.