To not want to punish DD during my custody time?

[MummaDelly]

Ex and I have been separated 3 years, DD is just about to turn 7. Custody is 50:50.

DD is overall a lovely child, always great school reports, great feedback from friends families and after school clubs etc. She likes rules and routines and tends to question things and wants to learn and understand.

For me she is great, obviously has the odd issue but doesn’t really tantrum. Can usually talk it through and she listens to reason. I have a chore chart and behaviour chart for her which she loves.

Recently my ex has reported DD has been naughty for him, will talk back or completley
ignore him sometimes. I spoke to her about this and she didn’t really have an answer for why she behaved like that and denied some of his claims. I know how he parents and it is different to me, he changes his mind a lot and on one day a certain behaviour will be funny to him but the next he gets frustrated by it. He will have loads of patience and ask multiple times for her to tidy her room but get annoyed if she leaves her shoes beside the shoe rack.

I offered to chat over the phone about how we can handle this together which he didn’t really seem keen on, I sent him photos of our chore charts etc and offered to print the same for him. I also said we could chat to DD together but again he didn’t really jump at this idea. I think he is a bit defensive of his parenting.

This weekend he had her the whole time and called my on Sunday to say that he had missed his mums birthday thing because DD had refused to get dressed out of her PJs, so they had to stay at home because “I’m not going to wrestle her into clothes, she’s not a baby”…

Next weekend I have plans with my friends, their children and my DD and exH said he had told DD she wasn’t going to go. I said to him that it’s not reasonable to punish her a week later and that I’ve already bought tickets etc and that I hadn’t experienced any of this bad behaviour. He also said that he is not going to renew her gymnastics club for after Easter if she doesn’t start behaving better but that seems really severe to me.

I don’t know how to help or advise him. Maybe I do need to be stricter…? It’s hard because I don’t see this bad behaviour

She’s 6, she’s behaving very much as 6 year old do. Being a parent is to teach them that some behaviour is unacceptable. Sulking for a duration of someone else’s party is a selfish act, of course she doesn’t know that, but she never will if it’s not addressed and dealt with. This was a great time to teach her. If you don’t teach them at this age they’re going to learn in a much more unpleasant way. If she sulks at every thing that doesn’t go her way, she’ll find herself isolated and wondering just why people aren’t taking her feelings seriously

I agree... I would have been mortified too and still would.

But clearly by the time they arrived at the party she wasn't regulated enough.to.enjoy that party and that has consequences for other people.

I really think the issue here is that the 2 homes are polar opposites. Mum's house is very much feelings and pandering (that OP is conveying as "compromise") whereas Dads house is a bit more authorities and do what I say and do it now. Neither is right or wrong but a blend would be much better for the child.

At 6, she can understand consequences and will very quickly learn how to play there parents off against eachother.

This. I think you need to step right back and let him parent the way he wants to. You have offered suggestions and ideas and he has rebuffed them.

The more responsibility you take for managing DD on his time, the less he takes. You DD needs to learn how things work in her two homes, after all she does that fine between home and school ( I assume ).

Most dads dont keep up 50;50 in the long term, you need to be prepared that he might start having her less and less.,

Only agree to punish/inact consequences instantly.

I think this is the advice for training dogs, isn't it?

It's not reasonable for you to have to impose punishments during your time for an incident that you weren't present for or affected by like this. Nor is it reasonable for him to unilaterally decide to remove educational or developmental opportunities like gymnastics from her as punishment - he can impose consequences in his own time and by removing treats and optional extras, not things that are genuinely beneficial to her.

However it there are a few things that are possible that aren't clear yet -

• is it possible that she had got dressed but exDH was mistaken that she was still in PJs? Tbh a lot of times I look at 7yos girls around town and they look like they are in PJs to me but it's just a style of clothing I am not used to
• is it possible that she is acting-out more with DH because the 50:50 split is stressful to her? 50:50 works for some families but if it's not working for her then exDH and you need to rethink.

You sound incredibly apologetic for your ex. Someone who never apologises ever and can't see where they're wrong is not a shining example of a decent human being to me.
And I know, so so many of them are like this. I would not underestimate his potential to be very immature and controlling during his parenting time tbh.

You are expected to fix this, is that a pattern with him. Very childish.

Is it possible to move away from 50)50 and more towards 70/30 with you. I feel very sorry for kids in this 50/50 situation. I don't believe it's in their best interests. But I know how hard it might be to change that.

Cancelling gym sounds pathetic because it's a positive, healthy, regulating activity. Choosing to cancel that sounds like an adult tantrum.

Missing his mum's day over PJs - no that doesn't add up to me. Put her in the car in the PJs, offer a reward for going and not moaning. Anything. It all sounds juvenile.

Id personally encourage him not to cancel gym and explain it will help regulate her mood and behaviour because of the exercise and opportunity to achieve done so he will possibly shoot himself in the foot.

Offer instead to talk about it with daughter and let her understand how important the birthday was and it's was not ok to be so difficult. I'd try understand exactly what's going on underneath all this. She'd probably rather be with you and maybe a part of you can't face hearing that. I understand this myself, it's very difficult and upsetting as a mum 💐.

You’re very adamant that your way is right and that ex is wrong, without considering that a lot of people have come up with the same conclusion that you and your ex need to meet in the middle here. The person suffering (not enjoying her friend’s party, not going to her gran’s party, having gymnastics cancelled) is your daughter.

This dynamic is really common even in households where the parents are together. Good cop (often mum) communicates and placates, whilst bad cop (often dad) is authoritative and frustrating. But whilst they can be balanced under one roof, that’s not happening here.

You need to talk to your ex again and come up with strategies that work for all of you.

It’s tempting to be good cop and enjoy feeling like your daughter loves you more and you get on with her better, but that’s not what’s best for her.

He sounds like a big baby himself tbqh, he really missed his mothers birthday party because he couldn't get his 7 year old to put her clothes on? Come on! He needs to be the adult here. And I absolutely would not be changing my plans because he said so!

I feel like I’m going against the grain here OP but I only ever worried about the behavior of my dc post divorce while under my care. My ex was unreasonable and intolerable and he created alot of problems for himself. His household while well financed was chaotic starting with marrying a woman with 5 children by 3 different marriages and trying to blend these families almost
immediately.
If your ex wanted 50/50 then he needs to parent 50/50 as will you. No way would I impose any restrictions on my plans on my time because of anything he says.
both my dc where eventually told by a counselor ( that he selected for them and paid for they didn’t go to counseling in my time) that the problems originated with their dad. Interestingly our marriage counselor told me the same. It could be what he interprets as not listening or not behaving as originating with him and his poor communication/ parenting
he can cancel the gymnastics if it’s his time and his dime but he’s going to find this type of punishment will be remembered and resented as dd becomes older.

my ex always took away the Nintendo game boy which I bought and paid for during my time. Sent DS home without it. Still
annoys me and DS

I think that in the same situation I'd have taken DD to one side and told her firmly that her sulking was more upsetting for the birthday girl than her forgetting the present and she needed to buck up or we would leave. There's a time and place for feeling all your feelings and sometimes we have to paste a smile on and get on with it. Sulking through a birthday party isn't being sensitive to someone else's feelings, it's main character energy. She is only 6 but it's a good time to learn not everything is about her.

this. It sounds like he knows he is failing at parenting and won't admit it. I wonder if your daughter says things like "at Mums I do it this way" or "Why can't I do it the way I do at Mum's" Its also possible that she doesn't trust his words because she is missing the stability there. So when he says things like "it'll be fine you can give it at school" she doesn't feel reassured because she doesn't believe it.

All these people advising he should have 'put her in the car' PJs and all

I can imagine the thread - exH manhandled our daughter and put her physically in the car, she was upset and didnt want to get dressed and he just took her to a party in front of everyone in her PJs - should I restrict access

MN - never let him see her again, he is controlling and abusive.

I think this just underlines how difficult 50/50 parenting is and how damaging it can be for young children, especially when parents have very different parenting styles. Two different households, two different sets of expectations and the child is supposed to manoeuvre their way through it. In your shoes OP, the person I'd be very firm with is your Ex. You need to make him understand that unless you work together on this, your daughter will be the one to suffer.
You both need to make her transition between your two homes as seamless as possible so that in effect, she is living the same life in two different places. Your current arrangement might suit the two adults involved, but it doesn't suit the child whose needs should be of paramount importance.

In times of desperation I have resorted to rewards / possibly what you'd call bribery. And I have physically put my son under my arm like an ironing board to get out of a situation where it was going to blow. Desperate measures....

I would have forced in car and forced a top over PJs if the other stuff didn't work. But I appreciate i'd probably be accused of abuse. It's a difficult dynamic in these situations unfortunately.

Cancelling a sports club is a really bad punishment. Take away screen time or something! That's just awful.

And no he shouldnt say to her she can't do stuff on your weekends.

Hecan't impose punishments in your time. It must be very difficult for children whose parents have this 50/50 custody arrangement. I don't think it's a good idea.

Really? I think most of MN would say, "Fair enough, next time, she'll probably get dressed."

I agree she shouldn’t have sulked through the party as that was unkind to the party child. I do think he could have avoided the sulk with a little kindness, which would have been better than punishing after the event.

I agree!

Unless the behaviour is catastrophic one punishment is enough he could have handled the situation at the time ive literally removed my child in his underwear and put him in the car that was the first and last time he refused to leave the house (he is 17 now so says no all the time but nicely like he still thinks I might be able to pick him up and drag him out 🫢)

His mishandling of the situation is not yours to punish

What on earth did his mum say?

I wouldn't engage in his issue. No, thank you.

Yep, I didnt say in my post that I dont approve of that, I would do exactly the same

But it would be portrayed on here, if the father did it, as abuse, I can guarantee it.

And you would be right people would absolutely support this action at 6 years old now if it was a 16 year old im not sure they would

I find this view irritating no-one is going to disagree with a proportional response if he threw her in the car refused her cake didnt take her party clothes took away her tv time said no to chocolate until Christmas and expected you to punish on top maybe MAYBE you will get people saying he is abusive

I get that, but that doesn’t mean her actions aren’t also going to upset someone. She’s a little kid so I’m not blaming her. But she did affect the atmosphere of the party & your response is to validate it and I don’t agree. I’d have explained fo her that her mood is making others feel bad. if she’s so in tune with other people’s feelings then this wouldn’t be hard for her to grasp. It irrelevant how close you are to the family. To take birthday kid away from enjoying their own party to comfort the feelings of your child is not fair. That’s not teaching her to be sensitive, it’s teaching her people need to be sensitive towards her
feeling foremost. She’s not a brat she’s 6. It’s an incident that’s neither here or there but couple it up with the refusal get dressed to celebrate someone else’s birthday does beg a question if she’s as sensitive as you think she is. I think you pander and she likes that, dad doesn’t and she plays up to get the same level off him. I think you both need to come in the middle. She doesn’t need every little feeling validated. She doesn’t need a big song and dance made by others to make sure she doesn’t sulk. He needs chill out and realise she’s a little kid. Have a conversation, impose consequences and then move on. It feels like he’s letting every incident snowball. He doesn’t want to give her the same level autonomy you do. I’m probably much closer to you in raising my kids. However, I’m very much a carrot and stick approach. They got rewarded for doing things & very much got punished for not doing. Homework, if done would get a reward. Homework not done got privileges taken away