To find my dysfunctional 70yr+ parents unbearable for hoarding + wittholding seeing wills?

[ByRoseSnake]

Apologies if this is the wrong place to post this - maybe I'll get some insights here. I just feel like I'm parenting my own 70+ parents at this point.

I'm tearing my hair out - and, basically, scared shitless. While I've been struggling to build an independent life and career 300+ miles away for the past 10yrs, my tiny family (who I love dearly) have pretended that time doesn't pass at all.
(For the record, there is only 3 in my family, due to family deaths and no extended family, enforced social isolation etc - so it's just my 2 parents, my older brother who is 30 + has never left home, apparently autistic but refuses to be formally diagnosed, or pull any of his own weight...)

While it's nice to pretend that time doesn't pass, I have been gently asking them for a long time about how they wish to proceed with wills, funerals, life after death, how to manage selling their house etc... This has been going on for over 6 yrs and I've had nothing from them. Apparently the wills are "none of my business", but it lives in "a draw" somewhere - according to my dad. My mum says she has no idea and sighs and just says "oh dear". They have no idea how much the house is even valued at... I'm in no way trying to dig around or pry, but should I at least know where they keep the wills, and have a basic awareness of what to do when they pass??

The main problem is that my dad is a high-functioning alcoholic, but also they are all chronic hoarders, saying for years they will "sort things out". It has only become worse. I'm talking having to make pathways of clutter just to enter certain rooms - in a 3 bedroom house. It is mostly my dad's chronic compulsive spending problem e.g. becoming obsessed with a musical instrument and spending his entire state pension on 3 different banjos that never get played again, because he decided he was interested in banjos after watching a YouTube video...
(for context: I visit home, spend 4hrs cleaning and sorting books, gadgets and crap into boxes, which my parents promise will be taken to charity shops/tip - only to visit 2 months later and it's back in the same place urrrghhh.)

I don't have complaints against people spending their own money - at whatever age - on what they enjoy, but his attitude deeply concerns me. When I earnestly asked "what would you like us (me) to do with all of this stuff when you pass? Shouldn't we be sorting out what is sentimental, of value and important now, rather than later?" He just replied - "I don't care. You can just pay to order a skip and throw it all in there. I'll be dead anyway."
:( Thanks Dad. I don't even know where family photos and documents are stored etc

Nobody else seems to have any awareness of how serious the situation is.
And my brother doesn't even know how to boil an egg, let alone help with these things - he just runs off to his room and says "that's your problem" to me... He hasn't even registered that he'll be homeless if this isn't established, once the time comes. He's been living at home for 10yrs and didn't even know what a metre reading was when I visited at Christmas. I'm definitely not becoming his replacement mummy.

But then I feel like I'll be entirely alone in the world - no family, and a huge amount of mess, memories and mental turmoil to clean up. And no idea about where and how money is going with house sale - or care homes, if that does come up.

It's keeping me up at night - while I'm just simply trying to build my own little life (while keeping the family peace!)

I'm so, so tired of feeling like I have to parent them all. I've tried so hard to talk to them rationally.
And yeah.
Scared shitless about the future AIBU for that, given circumstances?

You say you’ve been while but you sound absolutely exhausting. Leave your parents alone. They’re in their 70s not their 90s no one wants to think about death all the time and you’re creating problems. why would your brother be homeless? you say you love your parents show them love - you are lucky they haven’t banned you from the house.

Stop panicking about what happens when they die - I am 71 and not planning my own death yet! Get on with living - enjoy their company- and stop worrying over what you can't control.

Nobody else seems to have any awareness of how serious the situation is.

or now one really cares and is just getting on with living their lives. You sound like you are stuck, bored and just focussed way too much on your parents.

As for their will, I doubt we are talking a big estate here!

Where there’s a will… there’s an inheritance obsessed relative impatiently waiting in the wings!

You don’t have a partner, children, friends or a job - do you @ByRoseSnake ?

Whilst that is undoubtedly people’s prerogative, we should be clear that choosing to leave stress and a mess and loads of work for other people to clean up after you have died is deeply selfish, and not something that a society should encourage.

I understand that sometimes people die suddenly, and of course circumstances change. But the culture of secrecy and taboo around the practicalities of death and dying is profoundly dysfunctional.

By the time anyone gets to their mid seventies they have had more than enough time to contemplate their mortality.

While they need to sort it out I don’t think you’re able to see their side of it, it’s obviously too huge for them to deal with and they’re putting it off because they can’t deal with it. It’s their mortality and you’re saying ‘come on sort it all out plus sort out the mess your house has become’. That’s a huge thing!

My parents are like this. DM died last year and we all just dealt with it. They refused to talk about death and funerals. And it's just three of us left now. Why would you want to know what's in their wills?

Sounds like they’re leaving leaving everything to your brother

That's what I thought after I'd read the opening post

I suspect they haven’t equally shared things hence not showing the wills to you.

Get some good counselling to help you let this go.
Perhaps speak to social services to see what would happen to your brother if left suddenly alone

im 70 and hope for another 10 years anyway

its likely they will deteriorate at diffent times healthwise, carers will come in, cleaners, meals on wheels - it’s unlikely things will continue like this and gradual changes may be made - but it doesn’t have to be you making them. Step back.

What you described as being a worry for you ,was my actual situation
Mum refused to discuss,had a fall took to hospital and never returned home ,she got diagnosed with dementia and I had to take over finding her a secure rest home
We lived 5 hours apart
I had her entire house to sort out ,from food in the fridge to clothes in washing machine..to a full loft and garage,to stopping all bills ..BT were horrendous and insisted they couldn't stop the direct debit without her say so , despite me explaining she was in hospital with dementia and a broken shoulder..water company also horrendous.
I had an entire house to sort .clean and get ready for sale ,while dealing with solicitors and estate agents and trying to find a secure rest home for her ..and jumping to the demands of consultants in the hospital who had no understanding of the fact I lived 5 hours away with 4 school age DC ,and I couldn't just drop everything and drive up for meetings .
Absolute nightmare..and that was with me having POA ...that is your first port of call op ..you must get POA in place asap

The funeral and wills are relatively straightforward. If they have wills their lawyer will pipe up. If they don't there are rules that will determine how the estate is spilt between you and your brother. (IANAL but he could be classed as a dependent and get more potentially).

The hard stuff is what happens when their health starts to fail. Who will care for them? Is the house suitable for people with reduced mobility or for carers to come in? What happens if one of them dies or is hospitalised?

If you were going to focus your efforts,. perhaps think about convincing them to do a power of attorney. At least then when the time comes you would be able to make decisions for them and access their funds.

Yes that's what I thought. Daughter has become successfully independent and Son not fully functional. Its understandable. The op may have been made executor though - which I hope is an honour they will appreciate.

You need to talk to them at least about making you powers of attorney on the grounds that they will need a responsible adult if they end up in hospital. Start there.

OP I think this is a you problem. Your need to control them - they don’t want to be controlled by you so let them be. When they die, their intentions will hopefully be clear from the will, if the house is to be sold, you’ll have a choice to either go through stuff yourself or hire a company to house clear. There is always this task when someone passes, you can’t expect them to plan for death the way you want them to. Worry about your own little family and your own struggles and let them worry about theirs.

You don’t need to see their wills prior to death, they don’t need their house valued, they don’t need to sort their stuff out prior to death. You’re over focusing on things that actually don’t need to happen.

I frequently see pp on here ask this or say you’re not entitled to an inheritance or to know what’s in the will, but ime, it’s fairly normal to expect to be mentioned or to think you might get something or to at least know the situation. Strikes me as very faux naive to ask why she wants to know.

If her dp have made a will, it’s useful to know who the executor is, what the logistics are. Presumably the executor won’t be her db. In her position, I’d want to know what provision has been made for her db.

However, the OP saying she’s been left with the ‘whole load’ isn’t true. It’s unlikely that both parents will die together so one will be left to deal, then she’ll probably have to find the will/get a solicitor involved to sort out probate. Until then, it can just be ignored, not much she can or should do.

Clueless comment.

An honour? Or more unpaid mental load taken from her (unasked,) to be given for her brother’s benefit.
I would use Burden or Entitlement.

But he is telling you what he wants? He’s told you that everything can be thrown away. And their wills are none of your business. Again, he’s told you that he doesn’t want to share their contents with you.

You sound exhausted and clearly you care about them all. But if your older brother is 30plus it sounds like you’re still in your 20s. You need to go away and live your own life and try to stop worrying about them. Focus on yourself and take care.

I guess you dont have anyone with a spectrum disorder whom you deeply love and feel responsible for.

As others have mentioned LPA..legal power of attorney is more pressing than a will.
Age UK have great info. I printed it out and let my parents read in their own time. I'd likely approach it from point of, if something happens to them eg hospital admission etc then the bills need to keep being paid or your brother wont have a home.

This sounds really hard. My mum is not a hoarder and is normally sensible and pragmatic but she wont discuss things like this either. Or at least she will start to, I'll carry on the conversation and she will shut it down. Facing your own mortality is just too much for people especially late in life. You can't control them just your reaction to them. If its really difficult for you then might be worth considering therapy just to help you come to terms with it.

Is it worth talking to your brother? Just knowing where the will is (or what solicitor your dad used) would be helpful and as he lives there it might be easier fir him to have that conversation- it took my brother days to find my dads and it was really stressful. Good luck - you sound like a really caring daughter.

I'd say leave them to it unless you are expected to help when the inevitable crisis comes. In that case I think you do have a right to have these conversations. But you'll get nowhere. My parents refused to plan for that time when they would need help, the inevitable health crisis happened and we had to drop everything to try to help. We would always want to help but my parents could have made things much easier by some decent forward planning. I will not put that burden on my children. As adults , we should absolutely plan for old age, health decline, health crisis, etc. It's selfish to expect people to help but refuse to forward plan. I'm sorry you're going through this. Detach now, let your brother and parents know you won't help when they get sick. See if that jolts them into reality.