To find my dysfunctional 70yr+ parents unbearable for hoarding + wittholding seeing wills?

[ByRoseSnake]

Apologies if this is the wrong place to post this - maybe I'll get some insights here. I just feel like I'm parenting my own 70+ parents at this point.

I'm tearing my hair out - and, basically, scared shitless. While I've been struggling to build an independent life and career 300+ miles away for the past 10yrs, my tiny family (who I love dearly) have pretended that time doesn't pass at all.
(For the record, there is only 3 in my family, due to family deaths and no extended family, enforced social isolation etc - so it's just my 2 parents, my older brother who is 30 + has never left home, apparently autistic but refuses to be formally diagnosed, or pull any of his own weight...)

While it's nice to pretend that time doesn't pass, I have been gently asking them for a long time about how they wish to proceed with wills, funerals, life after death, how to manage selling their house etc... This has been going on for over 6 yrs and I've had nothing from them. Apparently the wills are "none of my business", but it lives in "a draw" somewhere - according to my dad. My mum says she has no idea and sighs and just says "oh dear". They have no idea how much the house is even valued at... I'm in no way trying to dig around or pry, but should I at least know where they keep the wills, and have a basic awareness of what to do when they pass??

The main problem is that my dad is a high-functioning alcoholic, but also they are all chronic hoarders, saying for years they will "sort things out". It has only become worse. I'm talking having to make pathways of clutter just to enter certain rooms - in a 3 bedroom house. It is mostly my dad's chronic compulsive spending problem e.g. becoming obsessed with a musical instrument and spending his entire state pension on 3 different banjos that never get played again, because he decided he was interested in banjos after watching a YouTube video...
(for context: I visit home, spend 4hrs cleaning and sorting books, gadgets and crap into boxes, which my parents promise will be taken to charity shops/tip - only to visit 2 months later and it's back in the same place urrrghhh.)

I don't have complaints against people spending their own money - at whatever age - on what they enjoy, but his attitude deeply concerns me. When I earnestly asked "what would you like us (me) to do with all of this stuff when you pass? Shouldn't we be sorting out what is sentimental, of value and important now, rather than later?" He just replied - "I don't care. You can just pay to order a skip and throw it all in there. I'll be dead anyway."
:( Thanks Dad. I don't even know where family photos and documents are stored etc

Nobody else seems to have any awareness of how serious the situation is.
And my brother doesn't even know how to boil an egg, let alone help with these things - he just runs off to his room and says "that's your problem" to me... He hasn't even registered that he'll be homeless if this isn't established, once the time comes. He's been living at home for 10yrs and didn't even know what a metre reading was when I visited at Christmas. I'm definitely not becoming his replacement mummy.

But then I feel like I'll be entirely alone in the world - no family, and a huge amount of mess, memories and mental turmoil to clean up. And no idea about where and how money is going with house sale - or care homes, if that does come up.

It's keeping me up at night - while I'm just simply trying to build my own little life (while keeping the family peace!)

I'm so, so tired of feeling like I have to parent them all. I've tried so hard to talk to them rationally.
And yeah.
Scared shitless about the future AIBU for that, given circumstances?

Asking to see their wills before they die is utterly outrageous. Your Dad is correct to tell you no to that. And your incredulity that they don’t even know the value of their house is very odd indeed. Most people don’t keep getting their house valued?! They may look at what others in the street sell for but you could do that yourself if you’re so interested. Your Dad has told you to get a skip for the belongings so you have his authority to throw anything away. You would therefore order said skip after he dies and start pulling stuff out to throw in. If you find photos or other sentimental items you want to keep, don’t throw them in the skip. If you can’t be bothered doing that at all, then get a house clearing company just to throw the lot. You are being very very unreasonable.

If you've been hassling your parents over their will for SIX YEARS knowing that they don't want to discuss it with you, I suspect that you began doing this when they were in their sixties. You probably suspect that your parents are intending to leave their house to your brother so that he won't be homeless when they eventually pass on hence your preoccupation with their will and the value of their house. If you managed to see the will I suspect that you would attempt to persuade them to change it in your favour. You must be such a disappointment to them and they must dread your visits, a daughter preoccupied with their deaths, wills and the value of their home. Like the previous poster said, I think that your behaviour is outrageous!

P.S. And you have the audacity to call your parents dysfunctional!
Have you looked in the mirror lately!

Why are you so angry about things you don't know are even happening?

Suspect, as almost always happens, this poster read the first post and barged in with their opinion. No acknowledgment at all that the OP later says they complain about the state of the house so she tidies for them only for them to put it all back, or that she is mainly concerned about her lack of knowledge of the legal side and the provisions made for her brother who has autism.

I opted for yanbu and have great sympathy with a lot of what you've said.

My parents are 78, aren't hoarders, but definitely aren't planners either. I have no interest in seeing their wills, if they have them (probably not) and me and my two (fully able).sisters are not expecting any form of inheritance anyway (they have very little to leave). In their case, my mum has never taken charge of bills or finances so is utterly reliant on what my dad tells her. But my dad has proven throughout life that he's not good with finances.

Mum is physically able, whereas my dad's health is failing more - so naturally, this dynamic makes her very vulnerable should he die first. I've tried talking to them about having financial and health powers of attorney in place for one another in the first instance. We're worried about mum's memory, too. We've also tried to get them to move closer to us, so we can help out more easily as they get older. Both stick their heads in the sand.

So we now have a situation whereby dad has everything 'in his head', which mum doesn't have any access to. Me and my sisters have tried multiple times to instigate conversations with my dad (mum is much more willing and pragmatic, but doesn't have the necessary information!) He's really sensitive about ageing, so the conversations never really go anywhere.

Have you tried approaching things from a perspective of explaining to them that you feel you're in a very vulnerable, precarious situation, given that your brother will clearly need a lot of ongoing support when they're gone and you yourself are neurodivergent and struggle with anxiety? If you frame it as them leaving you and your brother vulnerable then you may have more success. And yes, getting to a point where - even if they don't divulge details - they can specify a process that will kick upon one or both of their deaths (so things like having power of attorney so each can deal with the other's finances in the event of reduced capacity or death), where that leaves your brother in terms of his welfare etc. If they don't want to divulge details to you, then they need to be able to articulate how you will gain access to this information - quickly - in the event of their deaths.

Hi again! As the OP, I see this thread has escalated again + I could drop in and fine-tune some points...

I wanted to express how constructive this thread has been in so many ways - not just in alleviating anxieties I had around this phase of life, but also excellent practical/legal advice which I was not previously educated on. It has given me a lot of confidence and information going forward - and a sense that it is OK to let some things go.

Maybe my original post and title came across in an unintended way. I feel that some posters have read it as me being a money grabber, nosy, impatient hound of a daughter.
The reality is that I have been fearing the unknown for a long time due to uncertainties and a lack of communication and financial knowledge (also inherited) from my family.

I do see that some posters have missed the discussions around ongoing MH and ND issues in our family (and the fact that my father was an abuser), which does make things more complicated.
I can reassure you that I am not perceived as a 'disappointment'. I still have a relatively healthy relationship with them all, and I'll be seeing my mum next weekend. Rather than ranting about abusive dad and finances etc, I want to take her out for lunch and ask for lots of lovely stories about her own life and what she's done :) if she feels up to it, we can chat a little bit about the hoarding situation etc, and the fact that I feel quite vulnerable in myself. (FYI my dad won't leave the house to even have a coffee lol, so inviting him isn't much an option)

The issue with my sibling is ongoing, but I appreciate that it will be stressful and possibly an ongoing issue re: where he lives, whether he can or wants to take on any caring responsibilities. We'll work it out together (possibly when crisis comes)

Luckily I have grown a thick skin and I can let certain comments slide off me, while continuing to grow as a person (and not be too preoccupied with my parents' demise)!

You sound like you have a great attitude and all the right instincts to get through this.

They are lucky to have a caring, patient and hard working daughter like you even if they don’t realise it!

Take what you have found helpful from this thread, put it in a box in your mind, and move on- and it sounds like you’ll have a lovely day with your mum.

I understand how difficult this must be .
For what it’s worth you don’t need to see their will now , but you do need to know which solicitor has a copy and hopefully know who the executors are ( sometimes it’s a solicitor)
You also will need to know or find out where their birth certificates are , their marriage certificate and ideally their national insurance numbers.
ideally you’d be PoA in the event they lose capacity to manage their own affairs.
So while you can leave their hoarding tendencies alone ( I know that’s so hard ) you will need to sort these other things out .

"I'll be seeing my mum next weekend. Rather than ranting about abusive dad and finances etc, I want to take her out for lunch and ask for lots of lovely stories about her own life and what she's done :) "

That sounds great, I hope you both have a lovely time OP.

Probably easier and cheaper to do the successive POA at the same time. Saves faffing around later especially as the remaining parent could be quitecelderly by then.

How is it going @ByRoseSnake- have you been able to switch to a different dynamic and prioritise your own emotional needs?

I have a gut feeling they have either signed the house over to your brother already or left it to him after they die. That's why they're being vague about the wills, they don't want you to know. They could also be possibly trying to avoid any future care home fees by saying your brother is disabled and needs a home. Not what you want hear though. I would put my efforts into expanding my friends set, they could stand you in good stead in future years. Don't dwell on the current issues you can't change things for now. You didn't choose your family but you can choose your friends.Maybe even go lower contact and stop letting it invade your thoughts too much. Good luck.