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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

This country is doomed

964 replies

HappyFace2025 · 27/02/2026 08:29

While the vote in Gorton and Denton may be described as a 'protest' vote the strength of both the Greens and Reform performance is something to worry all of us not just Labour.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
17
charliehungerford · 01/03/2026 12:44

Ohyeahitsme · 01/03/2026 00:07

Not doesn't. Where on earth will people live? Especially people moving areas for new jobs etc, people leaning uni, starting over after divorce and all the miriad of situations where buying is neither desirable or practical and where they wouldn't be eligible for social housing/ social housing takes too long to access.

Private landlords fulfil a necessary role.

Totally agree,12 million people live in private rentals. They are going to have to build or somehow acquire over five million homes.

hulahoopingtoday · 01/03/2026 18:29

charliehungerford · 01/03/2026 12:44

Totally agree,12 million people live in private rentals. They are going to have to build or somehow acquire over five million homes.

Part of the reason many people can't afford a home is due to private landlords. It makes it impossible to save up a deposit for many people. The price you pay for rent is often higher than a mortgage, giving people on a low income next to no chance. Add in all the landlords that have multiple properties, taking those away from the market and its a recipe for disaster.

Ohyeahitsme · 01/03/2026 18:36

hulahoopingtoday · 01/03/2026 18:29

Part of the reason many people can't afford a home is due to private landlords. It makes it impossible to save up a deposit for many people. The price you pay for rent is often higher than a mortgage, giving people on a low income next to no chance. Add in all the landlords that have multiple properties, taking those away from the market and its a recipe for disaster.

But that doesn't remove the need for private landlords. Buying takes time - where do people live in the interim? You move to a new city for work, how do you know what area you want to buy in? You're doing a significant renovation, where do you live? You need a deposit to buy, where do you live whilst saving up? You need to be in your job for 3+ months before you can get a mortgage, where do you live?

TheDaysAreGettingLongerAtLast · 01/03/2026 19:19

Some of us lived through the boom times created by Reagan and Thatcher which were created by deregulation and privatization. This drove inflation sky-high but drove a temporary rise in living standards and wealth for those who were already on or able to get on the property ladder. Now the elite are squeezing everyone for as much as they can get out of us on everything we buy: food prices are all up significantly, property and rental prices are off the scale, the health service is becoming more and more like the American one with people getting medically unnecessary surgeries ahead of people waiting for life-saving surgery.

All predictable and preventable but no government left or right did right by the public.

hulahoopingtoday · 01/03/2026 19:29

Ohyeahitsme · 01/03/2026 18:36

But that doesn't remove the need for private landlords. Buying takes time - where do people live in the interim? You move to a new city for work, how do you know what area you want to buy in? You're doing a significant renovation, where do you live? You need a deposit to buy, where do you live whilst saving up? You need to be in your job for 3+ months before you can get a mortgage, where do you live?

I'm not saying private landlords should entirely not exist. But there should be caps and more regulation around rents, number of properties they can own and so on.

1dayatatime · 03/03/2026 10:52

hulahoopingtoday · 01/03/2026 19:29

I'm not saying private landlords should entirely not exist. But there should be caps and more regulation around rents, number of properties they can own and so on.

Rather than price caps and government controls on rents, how about sticking to basic economics and increase the supply of housing.

Its been shown that rent controls just encourage people to stay put as long as possible, passing the rental contract through to their children.

In Eastern Europe under communism where prices on items were controlled by Government, demand was managed by the ability to queue and wait rather than the ability to afford it.

Badbadbunny · 03/03/2026 11:05

charliehungerford · 01/03/2026 12:44

Totally agree,12 million people live in private rentals. They are going to have to build or somehow acquire over five million homes.

Those homes still exist. Lots of people want to buy but can't afford to, as they're often priced out by landlords, many of whom only buy "bargain basement" properties which would otherwise be bought by people who end up having to rent.

Of course, there's always a "market" for renters, i.e. those who don't want to buy, can't afford to buy, temporarily living in a different town for work, Uni, etc., but a lot of the 12 million renting don't actually want to rent, they want to buy. Fewer landlords hoovering up all the cheaper properties will mean that more people who want to buy to live in them, will be able to do so.

hulahoopingtoday · 03/03/2026 12:50

let's not forget as well that lots of US corporations and other corporate companies are hoovering up our rental properties as investments. this kind of corporate takeover should be banned. it's not fair, it drives up rental cost, drives down available property to buy, drives up property prices in general, takes money away from the UK, and it makes me so cross!

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:21

hulahoopingtoday · 01/03/2026 19:29

I'm not saying private landlords should entirely not exist. But there should be caps and more regulation around rents, number of properties they can own and so on.

What do you think would happen if there was less landlords than now
Every landlord I know hasn’t sold any properties. They have just changed them to short term rentals.

The whole point is that with every restriction aimed at reducing the number of landlords
we have ended up with less rental properties.

The slum landlords (the ones who all these regulations were going to guard against) are thriving because they take no notice of all the rules and regulations

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:32

Badbadbunny · 03/03/2026 11:05

Those homes still exist. Lots of people want to buy but can't afford to, as they're often priced out by landlords, many of whom only buy "bargain basement" properties which would otherwise be bought by people who end up having to rent.

Of course, there's always a "market" for renters, i.e. those who don't want to buy, can't afford to buy, temporarily living in a different town for work, Uni, etc., but a lot of the 12 million renting don't actually want to rent, they want to buy. Fewer landlords hoovering up all the cheaper properties will mean that more people who want to buy to live in them, will be able to do so.

Then why don’t they buy. I don’t get this “priced out by landlords”

The price will be the going asking price.

I have seen places going for under £25,000
I know someone who bought at £10,000

Just how cheap do they need places to be.

Badbadbunny · 03/03/2026 13:37

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:32

Then why don’t they buy. I don’t get this “priced out by landlords”

The price will be the going asking price.

I have seen places going for under £25,000
I know someone who bought at £10,000

Just how cheap do they need places to be.

They don't get the chance to put in offers! The estate agents "know" the multiple landlords and give them first dibs. Multiple landlords are also often "cash buyers" (from re-mortgaging other BTLs) and that makes them attractive to sellers who don't have to wait longer and don't have the risk of a FTB not getting a mortgage or having to wait several weeks for the mortgage to come through. Lots of the cheaper end houses are also not mortgageable due to many factors, i.e. water/power cut off, no kitchen, leaking roof, unsafe, fire damaged, built over mineshafts, etc so again FTBs can't buy as they need a mortgage. See it a lot on Homes Under the Hammer - gone to auction because not mortgageable and bought in cash by a multiple landlord.

HappyFace2025 · 03/03/2026 13:40

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:32

Then why don’t they buy. I don’t get this “priced out by landlords”

The price will be the going asking price.

I have seen places going for under £25,000
I know someone who bought at £10,000

Just how cheap do they need places to be.

It rather depends on where these homes are. There is nothing in the southeast for example that costs £25k AFAIK.

OP posts:
scottishgirl69 · 03/03/2026 13:53

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:32

Then why don’t they buy. I don’t get this “priced out by landlords”

The price will be the going asking price.

I have seen places going for under £25,000
I know someone who bought at £10,000

Just how cheap do they need places to be.

I bought my flat for 7.5k and that was because I got a 70 percent discount because I was a council tenant and had been there a long time . It had to be demolished and sold and I got the market rate. (26k) I live in the West of Scotland and there probably are places in the UK that are cheaper than here but I would think in many areas a flat for 10k would need a lot of work doing to it

A two bedroomed flat that my brother bought two years ago was 100k although he paid slightly more as it was more or less furnished as the seller wanted a quick sale

Lots of people are priced out of the housing market. If I hadn't bought my council flat I wouldn't have been able to buy at all on a single person on my wage. I know lots of people who live in private rented accommodation because they can't afford to buy - even if they have good jobs

My mum bought her council house for 26k 30 years ago. Houses in her street are selling for over 100k now. This is a very ordinary row of terraced houses with two bedrooms. This is part of the issue - as the value of property goes up - some people are priced out - they can't afford to buy so they have to rent privately or get social housing

Prices are increasing year on year as well. In Glasgow a landlord can get four students in a flat for 600-1k per room - they aren't under any pressure to sell. They know people are desperate for housing.

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:56

HappyFace2025 · 03/03/2026 13:40

It rather depends on where these homes are. There is nothing in the southeast for example that costs £25k AFAIK.

Know someone in the South East who has traded their way up from a £10,000 flat in the far north. They bought did up and rented out for a while then mortgaged it and did the same again and again. Then sold all of them and bought a place in the South East

I think you are mistaken about EA only selling to landlords. They are supposed to market the property to get the best price not keep things secret and only sell to a small set of people.

Badbadbunny · 03/03/2026 14:03

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:56

Know someone in the South East who has traded their way up from a £10,000 flat in the far north. They bought did up and rented out for a while then mortgaged it and did the same again and again. Then sold all of them and bought a place in the South East

I think you are mistaken about EA only selling to landlords. They are supposed to market the property to get the best price not keep things secret and only sell to a small set of people.

They work for the seller so will do what the seller wants them to do. If they want a quick sale, then they'll want to sell to the first person who can buy quickly and without any stress/delays. I've seen plenty of houses appear on RightMove and be shown as "under offer" the same day - sometimes they even appear marked "under offer" when listed. They basically only get put on RM as an advert/marketing for the EA to fill their listings and show other potential sellers how many they sell etc.

Re the cheapest houses, they'll always need a lot of work doing, so even if a FTB can get a mortgage, they'll also need thousands to do it up as FTB's usually won't have much skills themselves and won't have a small team of tradesmen ready to come and do the work. There'll be very few homes at £10k that people can move into without doing a lot of remedial work!

HappyFace2025 · 03/03/2026 14:45

FairKoala · 03/03/2026 13:56

Know someone in the South East who has traded their way up from a £10,000 flat in the far north. They bought did up and rented out for a while then mortgaged it and did the same again and again. Then sold all of them and bought a place in the South East

I think you are mistaken about EA only selling to landlords. They are supposed to market the property to get the best price not keep things secret and only sell to a small set of people.

I never said anything about EA only selling to landlords.

OP posts:
scottishgirl69 · 03/03/2026 18:57

Someone starts with a 10k flat in the "far north" and then keeps renting out and buying and selling - some people don't have 10k to start with. Some perople don't know where their next meal is coming from far less buy a house - no matter how cheap the flat is.

The reason we have a housing crisis is because when Thatcher brought in right to buy there weren't enough council homes built to replace them

People don't always find it easy to get on the property ladder. I know several people with good jobs who can't afford to buy and are living in over priced sub standard private lets. Where their flats are needing repairs and the landlord refuse to do them

So basically someone bought a ten k flat in cash and then rented it out and with that income got a mortgage on another property and kept going? That's fine

But there are 14k people in my home town on the waiting list for council accommodation. There are 33k people who live in my home town

If it were so easy to buy a flat then why doesn't everyone?

The Snp stopped right to buy so people in Scotland can no longer buy their council homes

For a single person living on their own on an average wage - how do you buy a flat - it's practically impossible

And of course private landlords have their place - but there really should be more social housing.

I have security in my flat. I'm not sitting waiting for a landlord to sell up and make me homeless

1dayatatime · 03/03/2026 19:09

scottishgirl69 · 03/03/2026 18:57

Someone starts with a 10k flat in the "far north" and then keeps renting out and buying and selling - some people don't have 10k to start with. Some perople don't know where their next meal is coming from far less buy a house - no matter how cheap the flat is.

The reason we have a housing crisis is because when Thatcher brought in right to buy there weren't enough council homes built to replace them

People don't always find it easy to get on the property ladder. I know several people with good jobs who can't afford to buy and are living in over priced sub standard private lets. Where their flats are needing repairs and the landlord refuse to do them

So basically someone bought a ten k flat in cash and then rented it out and with that income got a mortgage on another property and kept going? That's fine

But there are 14k people in my home town on the waiting list for council accommodation. There are 33k people who live in my home town

If it were so easy to buy a flat then why doesn't everyone?

The Snp stopped right to buy so people in Scotland can no longer buy their council homes

For a single person living on their own on an average wage - how do you buy a flat - it's practically impossible

And of course private landlords have their place - but there really should be more social housing.

I have security in my flat. I'm not sitting waiting for a landlord to sell up and make me homeless

The reason we don't have enough houses is that house building has failed to keep pace with the increase in population.

It really is simple supply and demand economics.

This country is doomed
NotMyKidsThough · 03/03/2026 21:21

Teribus21 · 27/02/2026 08:48

A set of policies deliberately designed to appeal to idealistic students with limited life experience in other words. I expect Green policies will be subject to a lot more scrutiny during a general election. I am much more worried about Reform.

Feel free to show how "crackdown" after "Crackdown" and "short sharp shock" anti-drugs campaigns have stamped out organised crime cartels and the entire illegal drugs trade.
They haven't, and they never will. Make drugs legal and you cut the legs out from under criminal drug dealers. Make it ok to go and ask for help without thinking the police are going to hoof down your door at 5am and more people might actually come forward to get help with addiction. And educate everyone, from as early as possible, to get it in their heads that actually, having your teeth fall out or crapping in your own trousers or someone else's bed isn't all that cool or endearing, and yes, addictive drugs will make them addicts, and they are not the exception that proves the rule. We did it with cigarettes. We could do it with illegal drugs. Except the Daily Mail would never allow it.

NeedAnyHelpWithThatPaperBag · 04/03/2026 18:01

The decades of, in the main, guaranteed/easy money to be made from multi property ownership (for the already wealthy) as opposed to other more risky investments has also helped hollow out economies.

JustSomeWaferThinHam · 04/03/2026 19:11

I read this today. It echoes what a number of Lebanese and others are saying. It sounds worryingly familiar. Have we got a capacity to heed the warning?

Britain Is Sleepwalking Into Lebanon.

Lebanon did not fall overnight. It was once the most cosmopolitan, pluralist state in the Arab world. Beirut was the Paris of the Middle East. A functioning democracy. A free press. A Christian majority that built a nation generous enough to welcome those who came. It believed that openness would be met with openness. That tolerance would be reciprocated. That good faith was a universal language. It wasn't. It never is.

The Palestinians arrived after 1948 and in their hundreds of thousands after 1970, expelled from Jordan with their militias intact. The Lebanese state, too timid to enforce its own sovereignty, allowed armed factions to operate as a state within a state. Then Iran exported its revolution westward and Hezbollah was born, funded from Tehran, running its own hospitals, schools, courts and welfare networks. It made the Lebanese state optional for an entire community. Every accommodation encouraged the next demand. Every retreat was read as weakness, because it was.

The civil war that followed lasted fifteen years and killed 150,000 people. But the war was merely the violent expression of something that had already happened. The state had lost its monopoly on violence. Communities had retreated into armed confessional blocs. The centre had hollowed out. Lebanon was already two countries sharing a flag but not a future.

The Christians didn't lose because they were cruel. They lost because they were naive. They believed demographic generosity could be squared with political stability. They believed armed factions could be absorbed into a civic order. Power follows population. Identity hardens under pressure. Every community with a coherent creed will eventually act on its interests. The moral high ground is not a defence. In Lebanon it became a grave marker.

Now look at Britain.

Since 2018, boats have arrived on the Kent coast carrying tens of thousands of men, the overwhelming majority unvetted and undocumented, from Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Eritrea. They are housed and supported at public expense while the state performs the pantomime of processing them. Anyone who raises the subject is accused of racism before the sentence is finished. This is not immigration. It is the progressive dissolution of Britain's right to determine who enters its own territory.

The parallel institutions are already here. Sharia courts operating alongside civil law. Educational environments teaching loyalty to the Ummah rather than to Britain. Areas where policing is negotiation, investigations are quietly dropped, and the state modifies its own behaviour for fear of communal reaction. In Lebanon they called it accommodation. They kept calling it accommodation right up until the checkpoints went up.

The electoral bloc pressure is already here. Candidates selected on the basis of foreign conflicts. Representatives answering to communal leaderships rather than constituents. The institutional failure is already here. The Charity Commission investigated the Islamic Centre of England for three years. Little changed. Universities host vigils for mass murderers and hold nobody accountable. Prevent is applied selectively. Everyone knows it. Nobody says it.

Lebanon did not collapse because its enemies were strong. It collapsed because its institutions were weak. Because it confused tolerance with the abandonment of standards. Because it believed the centre would hold without anyone holding it. Britain is not Lebanon yet. But Lebanon wasn't Lebanon yet, once. It drifted. Demographics shifted. Parallel loyalties hardened. The state lost the nerve to enforce a single standard of law. Bit by bit the centre hollowed out.

We are drifting. The question is whether anyone in authority will admit it. Before the drift becomes a current too strong to swim against.

"Power follows population. Identity hardens under pressure. Every community with a coherent creed will eventually act on its interests."

Leftieinthewild · 04/03/2026 19:18

JustSomeWaferThinHam · 04/03/2026 19:11

I read this today. It echoes what a number of Lebanese and others are saying. It sounds worryingly familiar. Have we got a capacity to heed the warning?

Britain Is Sleepwalking Into Lebanon.

Lebanon did not fall overnight. It was once the most cosmopolitan, pluralist state in the Arab world. Beirut was the Paris of the Middle East. A functioning democracy. A free press. A Christian majority that built a nation generous enough to welcome those who came. It believed that openness would be met with openness. That tolerance would be reciprocated. That good faith was a universal language. It wasn't. It never is.

The Palestinians arrived after 1948 and in their hundreds of thousands after 1970, expelled from Jordan with their militias intact. The Lebanese state, too timid to enforce its own sovereignty, allowed armed factions to operate as a state within a state. Then Iran exported its revolution westward and Hezbollah was born, funded from Tehran, running its own hospitals, schools, courts and welfare networks. It made the Lebanese state optional for an entire community. Every accommodation encouraged the next demand. Every retreat was read as weakness, because it was.

The civil war that followed lasted fifteen years and killed 150,000 people. But the war was merely the violent expression of something that had already happened. The state had lost its monopoly on violence. Communities had retreated into armed confessional blocs. The centre had hollowed out. Lebanon was already two countries sharing a flag but not a future.

The Christians didn't lose because they were cruel. They lost because they were naive. They believed demographic generosity could be squared with political stability. They believed armed factions could be absorbed into a civic order. Power follows population. Identity hardens under pressure. Every community with a coherent creed will eventually act on its interests. The moral high ground is not a defence. In Lebanon it became a grave marker.

Now look at Britain.

Since 2018, boats have arrived on the Kent coast carrying tens of thousands of men, the overwhelming majority unvetted and undocumented, from Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Eritrea. They are housed and supported at public expense while the state performs the pantomime of processing them. Anyone who raises the subject is accused of racism before the sentence is finished. This is not immigration. It is the progressive dissolution of Britain's right to determine who enters its own territory.

The parallel institutions are already here. Sharia courts operating alongside civil law. Educational environments teaching loyalty to the Ummah rather than to Britain. Areas where policing is negotiation, investigations are quietly dropped, and the state modifies its own behaviour for fear of communal reaction. In Lebanon they called it accommodation. They kept calling it accommodation right up until the checkpoints went up.

The electoral bloc pressure is already here. Candidates selected on the basis of foreign conflicts. Representatives answering to communal leaderships rather than constituents. The institutional failure is already here. The Charity Commission investigated the Islamic Centre of England for three years. Little changed. Universities host vigils for mass murderers and hold nobody accountable. Prevent is applied selectively. Everyone knows it. Nobody says it.

Lebanon did not collapse because its enemies were strong. It collapsed because its institutions were weak. Because it confused tolerance with the abandonment of standards. Because it believed the centre would hold without anyone holding it. Britain is not Lebanon yet. But Lebanon wasn't Lebanon yet, once. It drifted. Demographics shifted. Parallel loyalties hardened. The state lost the nerve to enforce a single standard of law. Bit by bit the centre hollowed out.

We are drifting. The question is whether anyone in authority will admit it. Before the drift becomes a current too strong to swim against.

"Power follows population. Identity hardens under pressure. Every community with a coherent creed will eventually act on its interests."

Well thats a crap analysis. Far right propaganda at it's finest. Straight out of the MAGA playbook

Are you sure they aren't eating all the pets as well?

TheDaysAreGettingLongerAtLast · 04/03/2026 19:44

1dayatatime · 03/03/2026 10:52

Rather than price caps and government controls on rents, how about sticking to basic economics and increase the supply of housing.

Its been shown that rent controls just encourage people to stay put as long as possible, passing the rental contract through to their children.

In Eastern Europe under communism where prices on items were controlled by Government, demand was managed by the ability to queue and wait rather than the ability to afford it.

Apartments with rent control exist all around the world.
My aunt lives in one in Manhatten for the past 40 years.
Rent caps are one way to prevent landlords ripping off renters.
If it works in the Big Apple, it can work anywhere.

TheDaysAreGettingLongerAtLast · 04/03/2026 19:55

Leftieinthewild · 04/03/2026 19:18

Well thats a crap analysis. Far right propaganda at it's finest. Straight out of the MAGA playbook

Are you sure they aren't eating all the pets as well?

But far more rational and thoughtful than your reply.

Leftieinthewild · 04/03/2026 20:02

It didn't deserve rational and thoughtful. Stoking hate never does.