DD’s birthday was an utter disaster

[bendmeoverbackwards]

It’s DD’s 19th birthday today. She’s ASD and has been out of education for a few years.

Last couple of birthdays have been disappointing to her and I know this one brought up a lot of emotion not just about birthdays but also her situation in general.

I asked her a few weeks ago if she wanted to see a particular show and a meal at a steak place. She just said no but gave no other suggestions. I then asked last week of she wanted just a meal out and where - no response. So I decided to book a local restaurant just in case as Saturday nights get busy, with the option of cancelling if she didn’t want to.

When I told her, she wasn’t happy and said she couldn’t do it now because I’d chosen it (autistic brain). I asked where else she’d like to go but didn’t get a reply. I suggested a takeaway, took hours of questions about this, she didn’t see a takeaway as a birthday celebration. She eventually decided on pizza.

I also got her a beautiful personalised cake. Last year for her 18th, I got her a nice chocolate cake with her name on but it didn’t have the same personalisation as her older sister’s 18th birthday cake (which was celebrated in lockdown so I pushed the boat out a bit). Also the board base was accidentally thrown out when there was a tiny bit of chocolate left on it. She complained about this for months. I said I would buy her an extra cake (cheapy supermarket cake) but I forgot.

Now she says she can’t have this year’s cake because of the lack of the other one and it would be in the wrong order (autistic brain again).

Choosing presents is also difficult for her so I chose a few small gifts and paid in £50 birthday money into her account. She didn’t like this either, she wanted to choose her own presents (but from past experience she takes ages to choose, months and months, so I thought I’d make it easier by giving her money).

Written down, I realise she sounds like a spoilt brat. But I didn’t do some things that I said I would eg buy her an additional cake and take her for a belated birthday meal (from last year).

The evening ended with her sobbing in the kitchen and me losing my temper 😢

You must have the patience of Job, OP - she sounds utterly insufferable - like Queenie in Blackadder. Are her siblings still living at home ?

I have to agree.

I am sorry @bendmeoverbackwards, but every time you post, there is just more and more of not great behaviour coming to light.

I feel a bit sorry for your DH, being so excluded by both of you. I have to include you here, as it sounds like you back her up when she doesn't want her dad in the conversation. All wrapped up in the guise of being her "safe space". Doesn't this affect your relationship with your DH as well?

I think the cake was just the cherry on the top of a very complex and long standing problem.

I wish there was some way to wave a magic wand and tomorrow life could just be way more harmonious. I think you know deep down it is going to take way more than that though.

I am not particularly religious, but I went to a Buddist meditation retreat a few years back when I just needed time away and time to breathe. (I too have a ND child, so I get it, I really do). One of the things that stuck with me the most is the analogy that life is a constantly moving circle. Nothing stays the same, no matter how much you want it or don't want it to. That circle is moving slowly and constantly. And you can accept that the circle is moving, or you can deny it is. If its the latter, then when it's done a full round, the full weight of that movement comes crashing down in one fell swoop.

I don't know why, but this analogy keeps popping into my head on each one of your posts. I get the impression that you want to keep your dd in that 11 year old protective bubble. You don't want to let her out because how will you protect her from rejection, heartache and any other negative emotion that comes with living life.

Can you perhaps relate to this at all?

Op that sounds so difficult. I think it's really important to recognise that sometimes we do our best and that has to be good enough even when it doesn't have the desired effect.

Could you wait a bit and then do two cakes separately to correct the 'order' for her to set you right for next year and 'catch up'? Mark them as the previous birthday and this birthday on the calendar for a visual cue.

I'm also thinking what if you created a special celebrations jar, write ideas of nice things to do on bits of paper in the jar and then when something like a birthday comes around rather than her being under pressure to decide on something, she just picks out one of the notes in the jar and you do what's on it? That way she's picked it but doesn't have to put the mental energy into thinking of something or making decisions?

I think it's important that she sees a healthcare professional and I'd be framing it as, the correct thing to do to keep our body healthy is to see the doctor at least for a yearly check up and in addition to that any time your body or mind is sick, sore or sad and we can't fix it at home or at the chemist. That way you're creating a 'rule ' around it that she might be more likely to engage with as that's very clear. I'd just be very careful of your wording on this if nuance is difficult for her to process.

We've kind of moved on from the 'pandering to DD with cake options', having realised that no amount of pandering with cake options are going to change DD's behaviour.

I've read the updates. I actually still think she should. It may at least get them to a straight edge which I think is important because really the long term goal here is getting dd engaged with services. It sounds like it could be a more complex diagnosis for ops dd and doubling down on birthday or cake isn't going to help op to move things forward if dd is just going to continue to fixate on that. I don't think this is just manipulation as some posters have suggested, to me it very much reads as possibly a previously missed dual diagnosis and lack of professional intervention. (Though I've no doubt op has done her best to encourage/advocate). I think picking her battles is really important here having worked with young people with very similar situations in the past.

DO NOT DO THIS.

If you try and get the cakes 'right' it will go on and on and on, there will be more problems, more you 'owe' her.

The normal expectation is she has one cake for her birthday, shares it, the end. If she's disappointed by it, she feels disappointed for a few days, forgets it and moves on. You are blocking her normal development if you keep trying to remove her feeling the disappointment, you need to let her work out how to deal with it in a healthy way.

The adaptation you can make to allow for her ASD is to not buy her a cake if it brings her more stress, and give her support by explaining the normal societal purpose of cakes and how to act in a socially acceptable way around them. Buy engaging in endless apology cakes and guilt about it, you are encouraging this maladaptive behaviour.

I agree with a pp, the cake malarkey has got beyond "corrections". The OP needs to draw a line under the cake and move on.

A "treat jar" might work for next birthday but DD is so reactive that no matter what she drew out she might still make a huge fuss.

I think the bigger issue here is how the OP is responding to DD fussing, and that is more important to tackle than trying to avoid the fuss in the first place. "Not reacting to fuss" seems to be the OP's biggest parenting challenge!

How do you and dad react to her swearing and being rude to him? You say lots about what she says.
Consequences would be an immediate rebuke how dare you speak to your father like that. I wouldn’t continue to speak to dd if she’s telling him to but out.
I’d also withdraw some financial support, phone and allowance are easy ones to start with. She doesn’t need a phone she’s home 99% of time. Then look at luxuries eg are you buying nice toiletries, treat food, stocking fridge when you go away and start scaling back.

What sort of dual diagnosis are you thinking? OCD, or something else?

Well this is interesting. OP, in the light of all this, what do you think you need to do about this? If you had to go away for a week to care for a sick relative or visit a friend abroad who needed your assistance and your DH was left with DD3 what do you think would happen?

It is not actually about the cake though. It is a way more complex situation.

Did you read all of OP's posts?

Actually the phone is a good idea - assuming OP and DH are paying for it, you can simply go on line and lock the SIM/account rather like a credit card. But I would also state that her allowance now needs to be earned. At 19 she can do jobs around the house. If she doesn’t do them, then she doesn’t get an allowance.

Mine have their phones paid for them for as long as they are in FT education. Legally, per the contract, they are mine. I can cancel them/report lost or stolen at any time. They have an allowance so long as they are attending school and in exchange for normal family commitments - dog sitting, keeping their rooms and bathrooms clean and tidy. My DD has PIP, and is away at college now but my nearly 18yo AuDHD DS understands the rules.

If she doesn’t like the rules then she needs to go to citizens advice and explore UC, PIP and getting on a housing list… she won’t. The path of least resistance is to rein in her behaviour, to stick the hoover over as requested and tidy her room, but you have to make it clear that these are the rules and she will lose her privileges. Younger people don’t seem to understand that rights and privileges are earned by meeting corresponding obligations [eg free speech is counterbalanced by being considerate of others and avoiding hate speech , for example). There is a social contract. It’s no different in a family setting.

Whatever you do wouldn't be right or good enough. I completely understand that your daughter is autistic but equally she's 19 and an adult. You ask for her input, and she disengages, and won't give you any feedback. You can't help someone, who refuses to help themselves or meet you half way. You're scrabbling around in the dark, trying your up most best to make your daughter's day special, and you get nothing but whinging that none of it's what she wanted!!!!

Your daughter refuses to see a medical professional, but still expects you to magic the impossible and then still isn't happy!! She has to start taking some responsibility for herself, and that means seeking professional support. Yes, I suspect there's an element of OCD there, but that's not going to improve if she doesn't seek help. What strategies could she put in place to help her? You can only do so much now your daughter is legally an adult.

Don't feel bad. You tried your best, and your daughter should be grateful for what you did do without any input from her!!

It’s very tempting to do the whole cake thing again which, I imagine, dd envisions this as TWO more cakes and in the ‘right order’. But even though I’m regretting giving the impression that this was on the cards, I’m not going to do it, it will just kick the can down the road. Better to draw a down line under it and make it clear there are no more cakes for this birthday or last years.

@Dumpspirospero I actually go away a fair bit, in fact I’m off on a city break with friends next month. And I’m away for a week in July every year (hobby related). Dd and Dh rub along ok without me there.

Quite right - I'm very glad you're not planning to re-ignite the cake binfire!

You can't make a 19 year old engage with services and attempting to pussyfoot around and manoeuvre her into it isn't likely to work.

You can't control DD, you can only control your own responses to DD. You seem to have got yourself into a spiral of guilt and trying to avoid conflict with DD and keep her happy even though her demands keep escalating, rather than accept that some conflict is inevitable with her and figuring out how and when to ride it out.

So I do think it would be really helpful for you to get professional support for yourself and for your parenting. If some of this is coming from your own past (I think you mentioned your own parents who were very unsupportive?) then individual counselling just for you could help.

I’m torn saying this OP but I really do feel for DD. But this is a very modern day “problem”.

DD doesn’t sound like she is severely autistic in which case I’d be much more understanding.

Two cakes in the right order! She’s gotten she cakes for this birthday. She turned them both down by the sounds of things.

Her sister got a cake during Covid because it was during Covid. You have offered DD3 loads of things.

Will two more cakes fix this? Or is it yet another time where DD3 is being pandered to? And what good will that do? Is it time to draw the line?

OP you are in such an awful dynamic with her. If it was a partner or parent, we would be using terms like emotional abuse, DARVO or narcissism. Ofc it’s different with an autistic child. But it’s horrid seeing you walking on eggshells, feeling guilt, overanalysing everything afterwards, trying to please her and get her approval etc.

You need to change these habits and stay strong. She needs to feel safe and that you also have boundaries. She needs to be able to respect both her parents, whilst feeling loved.

I would think about specialist family therapy, even if she doesn’t attend. You have some really entrenched and unhealthy family dynamics that need addressing asap. Whilst working around her unique needs as an autistic young adult.

No more cake discussion at all. Your guilt is painful to read about. You cannot be a doormat or emotional punchbag anymore.

This thread is nearly full. I hope you continue with a new thread.

NO MORE CAKE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!!!

Even if by some miracle the OP managed to get it right there would still be the much bigger issues to deal with (not in education or work, not engaging with Dad, not engaging with health professionals, being rude and demanding, 2 years worth of presents in bags around the house).

Plus she’s already got cake in her sock drawer upstairs! And you’d be giving her the signal that all of her tantrumming has worked, and she can continue to use this to deflect from the much bigger issues.

Dd and Dh rub along ok without me there.

Is quite telling, though, isn’t it?

Hi OP. Your daughter sounds quite depressed. I'm autistic and honestly the way you describe her life makes me quite sad. Does she have no special interests that she engages with? What did she used to be obsessed with before the diagnosis? Could you encourage her to pursue them again? You say she's reluctant to take an access course, ok, but how about a MOOC course like Coursera, FutureLearn, edX? Just to get her engaging with something again.

Yes, it does sound as if you and she are triggering each other somehow.

But having said that, I guess you are in charge of all the risky stuff, like birthdays and conversations about education, where the blow-ups are likely to happen. In which case that needs to change. Can you put Dad in the driving seat and you back him up rather than you driving the interaction and him agreeing to back you up? It sound as if he's willing to step up if you will back his approach.

Yes, I think it quite possible that there are some OCD behaviours here too.
It may not be just manipulation as some seem to think.

Not sure how best to deal with it though if she won’t see her doctor about it. I know ‘giving in’ to OCD can make it more entrenched. She does need professional help imho.

You can be badly affected by autism and accompanying MH issues even if you are cognitively able with no speech issues. Some of this cohort will never manage to live independently. I think sometimes people don’t realise that.