90 year old male watching naked women on tv

[BetteDavisChin]

My cousin told me that her 90yo dad watches 'Babestation' (ugh, makes me feel queasy just typing that word).
He asked her to fix his phone at the weekend and she saw he had 572 you tube videos on it, some thumbnail stills showing close ups of young women's crotches (clothed).
She was upset and said she couldn't believe that a man of his age was looking at stuff like that. She also told me (which I didn't know before) that in the 60s/70s he used to go to the pub on work lunch times and Sunday afternoons to watch strippers.
I said I agree that it's gross, but try not to judge him, but she wasn't happy with me about that and she left. She hasn't returned my text messages since then.
I am going to give her a few days to process what's happened, then try to contact her again.
But AIBU to also be grossed out by the thought of my aged uncle perving over young women?

I know there’s this perception that Mumsnet hates men, and that’s obviously bullshit. The only time I wonder whether it’s true is on threads about porn.

Highly unlikely that is a correct stat given the group think that its not supposed to be ok now, it just means people lie

Even if that is correct it means 75% do, so how does that invalidate what I said?

Why would people lie in such a milquetoast anonymous survey? Porn is entirely normalised in British society now - there's no reason to lie! If you so much as say you're against porn you get shouted down, shamed, and told all men need it. No, I doubt people are lying in that survey.

And you said: "If you have sons, they will be using it" which is just untrue. They might be using it, but there's also a chance that they never do. People always say on these threads, "Oh, your husband definitely watches it" etc, as though everyone does. So I'm just pointing out that a full quarter of men don't. Facts! Very useful.

Gross at any age, but never more so than at his age!

Its well known that people often give answers in line with social mores and expectations whether anonymous or not, its a known bias that statisticians are aware of in their research. The survey may have accounted for that but the reality is, there are a number of group thinks that people know they are 'supposed' to think and believe and that will influence study results in a survey like that and those group thinks change over time.

75% of a population doing something makes it fairly normal and standard, like it or not which is what I said.

Even on this thread is a misunderstanding of what porn is, another poster talks about it not being present until around 2000s and how did men do without it. It has always existed, go and see the paintings in Pompeii, see the classical paintings of the renaissance. The idea it only exists online is ridiculous.

My issue was with you saying, "If you have sons, they will be using it" as many people say this about sons/husbands/boyfriends in 'defence' of porn - "just give up on trying to stop them! Even your x, y, or z does it and if you think they don't, you're wrong! Every man watches it!!"

I'm sure the PP's '2000s' comment was in regard to the fact that it has only been widely available online in hardcore video at everyone's fingertips for free since the 2000s.

And video content is rather different to paintings. The average man was not sitting and staring at a renaissance painting while he wanked. (To be fair, he was probably raping his wife, which was also normalised at the time!)

The point which people “miss”-or more likely refuse to discuss because it’s too uncomfortable to think about is that online porn involves a huge number of of actual, real life women and girls and we have no way of knowing whether those women are fully consenting, protected by employment laws, well treated, well paid and adult. Or whether they are coerced, exploited, trafficked, under age and simply fodder for a big business machine. Of course porn has always existed. What did not exist before 2000 is porn’s immense capacity for harm.

Generally speaking if you have sons they'll be using it, colloqually, if it makes you more happy to have it described as 'if you have sons most of them will be using it' so be it, one doesnt give a caveat for every situation but that is the reality.

Im not sure what you mean by 'defence' of porn, whats that mean?

I dont know what you do about the reality but that is the reality. There is a level of denial on this forum that you dont tend to find in real life or on other forums, not sure why that is.

I think we know that dont we?

What I mean by 'in defence of porn' is it's a phrase trotted out by women trying to shout down other women who say porn is unacceptable, or by women trying to say that porn is great and fine.

And yes, obviously many men watch porn. Many men used to rape their wives with impunity, and it was considered their right.

Humans clearly are capable of a degree of change, or you'd be stuck at home, pregnant with your sixth child, without the vote, being legally raped by your husband. But I presume you're not. So why is it so unreasonable to think we can denormalise porn?

What won't help is just shrugging our shoulders helplessly and saying, 'well, boys will be boys, I guess'.

Oh yes! The peanuts on the card with the topless woman underneath - I’d completely forgotten about those.

Well, many posters on here don’t seem to!

Men have not been innocently looking at cave paintings for 2000 years

The number of men who have made a concerted effort to not watch porn in any medium (photos/videos), and have done so successfully for years on end, is going to be tiny.

And who manage to resist when horny.

Even if you use your preference is to use your imagination to masturbate, you need to think of someone, something. That may not be hardcore XXX content, but it will be sleaze.

The Mumsnet anti-porn absolutism is so unrealistic.

I think telling her not to judge is the issue. It's not as though she was asking you to confront him, but I don't see the harm in agreeing with her that it's gross behaviour since that's what you also seem to think. I think it's poor behaviour on his part if he's always been so open about watching strippers and porn around his daughter.

I'm sure people used to think it was unrealistic to expect men to not rape their wives with impunity - after all, men had been legally raping their wives for thousands of years! And you just expect them to stop?? Insanity!! Men need to have sex with their wives whenever they want to, and who cares what she thinks! That's the way it's been since the beginning of time!

...And yet here we are! In a world where raping your wife is illegal! And most of them don't do it! (Even if too many still do.)

I know you might hate men, but I do think they're actually capable of not being monsters.

My daughter definitely doesn’t- we share the same views on porn and objectification- we talk about it a lot.

I expect my son does use it. He knows my views but I don’t and can’t control what he chooses to do. 🤷🏼‍♀️ I just have to hope that whatever porn use he is engaged in doesn’t impact his treatment of women.

I made no comment on whether the specific women on Babestation are trafficked or tricked or coerced or drugged- I doubt it. They are being objectified though by the people watching it, aren’t they? This is my objection to it. The fact that some people are happy to be objectified doesn’t make it right 🤷🏼‍♀️

People just refuse to see the difference between a man wanking to a cave painting or a Reubens and a multi million pound global business exploiting countless women and girls. It’s bizarre.

Lots of men and women think and believe porn is acceptable. Im one of them

Like most people (as I have to say 'most' people to give the caveat it seems) I dont think exploitation is acceptable. Those are two different things, very often intertwined. One should be stopped. The other shouldnt.

And while I have no issue with porn per se, with tons of cavets of course, I also dont agree with the ease of access which involves children seeing it in a way that wasnt around years ago. However the minute any mention is made of restricting smart phones that definititely gets shouted down. You might as well lock a child/teen in a room with extreme violence, violent porn, weapons and drugs as give them unfettered access to the internet, but that it seems is ok for most parents.

This thread is about a person being called all the names under the sun, pervy, creepy, disgusting etc etc for looking at something which is no more or no less than what you get on mainstream telly these days and Ive already given my views on that.

Oh, well, there's no point talking to you, then. You're a misogynist.

If it was sixty years ago, back when the concept was still considered normal, you'd be arguing in favour of continuing legal rape in marriage, I'm sure.

It's a shame you think so little of both men and women, but that's on you.

No there is no point you talking any more, you're not making any reasoned argument at all, keep talking about something which no one here has given an opinion on (rape in marriage), not least me, you dont know my views on that but have decided you do, you then name call to make a point

On the other hand I have given reasoned, logical and rational information and nuance.

If you cant have reasoned debate there is no point in you carrying on, no.

It's called an analogy. If you can't understand that, there really is no point. Cheers. Enjoy your exploitative materials.

Many women watch porn.

Ok- if you say so. Not sure what that has to do with my comment though?

And women are usually the ones who perform female genital mutilation. Women are great at being self-hating misogynists. What's your point?