To emigrate knowing it will devastate my mum?

[tangotingo]

I’m breaking my heart over this as I know deep down I want to go but it will break my mum’s heart.

Been with my partner 4 years, we are engaged to be married next year. I’m pregnant with our first baby. I’m British, partner is from Eastern Europe and his family have settled all over the place (he has relatives in Canada, his home country, Germany and Scandinavia).

His younger sister lives in Germany and has lived there a few years now. She has a partner. They are settled in a lovely small town there which is very safe. They only work hospitality jobs there but have a lower cost of living - they live off one partner’s wage and save the rest. They are considering moving to Hamburg for more job opportunities. They are at a very similar age and life stage to us and are also expecting their first baby. There is a particular industry in Hamburg which is very big and similar to what my partner does for work in the UK, don’t want to go into more detail as it’s quite niche but we’ve seen that one particular large firm encourages foreigners to apply if they have a relevant skillset. I would struggle a bit more as my skills are administrative/customer service so I’d likely end up being a stay-at-home parent whilst learning German. My job in the UK is only a call centre role so it’s not like I’d be giving up a career, so I’m willing to do it so long as we can afford to live. Partner’s sister is confident you can live on one wage over there, and also says she knows a firm that is easy to get into without speaking German as she has helped friends from her own country get in there, so she says she could help us get in their initially if we wanted whilst we’re settling.

I feel, probably quite selfishly, that there is nothing for me in the UK. My parents had me in their 40s, I’m in my 20s now and they are in their 60s. They are full-time carers to my autistic brother who is 25 and they refuse to take any steps to prepare him for the fact that they won’t always be around. He is verbal but doesn’t work, he doesn’t even have a mobile phone as he refuses one and they just accept it. My dad is a hoarder and I hate visiting their home as it stresses me out. I have half-siblings on my dad’s who are 20 years older than me and don’t care about me despite my efforts to have a relationship (I’ve attempted to meet them on their birthdays etc to not even receive a text on mine).

I have dealt with so much anxiety over the years about how care for my parents and brother is likely to all fall on to me in the future as my parents age (my half siblings have no interest). I live an hour drive away as when I met my partner I moved to a different city to be with him. We can’t move to my parent’s city as my partner’s industry doesn’t exist there. I feel absolutely stifled by thoughts of the future. Due to my parents age and being carers they won’t be able to offer me any practical support with my baby. Since I moved an hour away 3 years they’ve visited me less than a handful of times.

Due to large age gaps with my siblings and the fact that my partner has no family in the UK, my child will have no cousins to grow up with except for kids my partner’s sister will have in Germany. I recently have been crying my eyes out as I’ve realised nobody in my family deserves to be godparents to my child, nobody gives a shit enough. We’ve already decided godparents will be partners sister and her partner.

Me and my partner are so lonely and desperate to be around people in a similar life stage. He was quite depressed his last birthday as it fell during a heatwave and he wanted to have a BBQ and realised there was just nobody to really invite so we didn’t bother. It’s getting to him now we’re having a child I think.

Our part of the UK is incredibly rough and our car was stolen a few months ago. I hate the UK rainy grey weather and get seasonal depression, I know Germany is hardly a hot country but the UK is particularly bad due to being an island and we’ve enjoyed many lovely summer BBQs and outdoor parties when visiting Germany previously. I’ve always said no to my partner when he’s suggested moving as I feel bad leaving my parents, but since becoming pregnant I’ve started to want to prioritise baby more and I feel they will be better off if we go to Germany. I only really want 1 child but feel pressure to have 2 if we stay in the UK as I feel the child will be lonely, but it’s different if they will have cousins which they will have in Germany. My, my partner, my partner’s sister and her partner will all be able to support each other.

We have the money to emigrate and get settled - £25,000 in savings. This was originally meant to be a house deposit in the UK but every time we’ve found a home we’ve had to pull out due to the house having major damp issues. Every house in our budget is awful and requires major renovation works. We’ve essentially given up.

I have decided I want to go, I know it won’t be easy to find a rental and jobs etc but I want to at least start the process even if it takes a couple of years. Due to my partner’s EU citizenship I can tag along with him to get residency. I think it’s best for me, my partner and the baby. But I know it will break my mums heart. Can anyone give any insight please? Just to add as well they won’t be able to visit me at all as they are poor, and my dad and brother refuse to travel and mum refuses to leave them.

Mum was worried when I first starting dating someone from another country and said from day 1 “please don’t emigrate.”

Am I a selfish cow?

I think she said she thought pressure from parents would be worse if still in UK, but could that not be mitigated?

I’m sure it could. I mean you can say no wherever you live. They could move hours away from where they are now.

The pipe dream would be if I could land a role which can be done fully remotely within the UK, in which I could then maybe suggest to work within Europe and remain employed by the company.

you currently work in a call centre. There are “pipe dreams” and then there are completely and wholly realistic fancies that are never remotely likely to happen.

Oh OP…. I was with you until your latest update! Malta is very high cost of living…. We are talking probably not you getting a cozy apartment but a couple of rooms! Yes of course you are not getting a house there 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️ only the very wealthy have houses there. Childcare may be free but probably not going to cover the very long hours required of hospitality- 8-8 shifts, over nights and weekends.

The tricky thing about moving to be near a family member or friend, is ghat they're their own family unit and they'll make decisions that may take them away again, as you've seen already. If you'd been 100% set on Germany and not been as open to change it to Malta, you'd have been totally let down by your SIL and BIL by them moving the goalposts and changing countries for the benefit of their family

Just he careful, what happens if they move again and you're stuck in Malta, make sure you go somewhere you can imagine a good life for your family alone, with the SIL family a lovely added bonus. People change their minds and following too much might mean you end up following too or stuck alone. Make sure you build a life outside of your SIL too.

To add my own experience witbout being too outing, I made a big move after having a baby for financial reasons, leaving behind a job I loved which wasn't high paid however in a hugely expensive cost of living area and wonderful friends who were like family. We moved on a promise of bringing up kids near a close family member with kids in a low cost of loving area, and actually they proved to be very unsociable and incredibly stressed out, we hardly see them considering how close we live to them. I've had to work hard to try to recreate a sense of community that I miss hugely, and i often think of what my child's preschool years would have been like in our child friendly albeit expensive former home, and how my friends who have children theirbage would be his friends etc, it's a thought trail I have to suppress daily. Our move is temporary thankfully, always was just going to be til nursery years but I share this because it shows that basing moves on people is shaky ground as they change, are changeable, and parenthood changes people and their priorities hugely too.

Given your recent update, I agree with PP. Uou both have jobs in the UK-why not move to another UK area where you’re less likely to feel the influence of your parents and their expectations. It looks like you are expecting your FP’s family to rescue you from your current situation and you’re going along with their schemes without thinking is it right for me? Are you sure Malta is the jobs Nirvana you think? Why not research areas on the UK where you can both make a living and build a network of mum friends?

Is it that easy to find English speaking jobs in Malta? If so, Im up for that, but am British, is it that easy?

I would love to do that

So after all that reasoning as to why Germany was all safety, green space, no language problems and work opportunity, it turns out it’s not because your SIL, who actually lives there, has found her work options limited by her lack of fluent German is not that enthused by the place and is planning to leave, and now, after a single conversation, Malta is the new place of opportunity, you’ve forgotten about Hamburg being the place for your partner’s industry, and you’re off to move to one of the smallest, most densely populated countries in the world, that even you acknowledge has problems with overdevelopment a d has a high cost of living and where you’ve only been on holiday?

OP, I’m all for people moving around internationally, but this is a bit mad. You can’t trail around the world based on your SIL’s arbitrary decisions.

it is and it isn’t… it has a great job market usually if you are specialised especially in things like software engineering and development. I worked for a tech company and there were quite a few people who moved to Malta but these were highly specialised roles. Although business language is English - you would be competing for jobs with people who speak multiple languages and have multiple highly specialised degrees. For these people it offer a great lifestyle.

if you rock up with no plan and a low paying job - you’re probably in for a bit of a shock! Hospitality and labourer workers would expect to be sharing a room between 3….

Oh!

I wouldnt even mind moving somewhere and doing call centre work (in English), Im currently in a professional managerial role in statutory public services so it wouldnt be anything like that I know

But it would be good. I have no other qualifications or skills other than what I currently do!

As you are not an EU citizen Malta would really not be open for you. Most call centres would probably want a few extra languages than English as well

With your update, this doesn't sound viable.

You're now going to move, with no jobs, to a high cost of living place because your partner's sister has abruptly changed her mind and Germany isn't for her because she's not finding work outside hospitality.

What about when Malta isn't for her? Islands always have a high cost of living, everything has to be shipped in. You don't know the local language or the education system or how childcare will work or attitudes towards immigrants. And you'll have a baby.

You really sound dependent on your partner's sister to provide family for you and you're leaving major decisions about your family to her. She's not responsible for your partner or you.

I think you'd be best off moving in the UK. Move a distance from your family and go lower contact and tell them they need to make plans for your bro because you will not be his carer, you will be having your own family.

OP is the plan for Malta going to include your partner working in his line of business/industry that he was going to Germany for? You said that the point of Germany was that he would be sought after there, is that the same for Malta?

So he might be high earning in Malta?

I think I kept asking you what the price of rentals were in Hamburg and what your income would be and you didnt answer, do you know what the cost of rentals would be in Malta and what your incomes would be there?

childcare is free for 50 hours but often oversubscribed so you may have to wait for a space. You both need to have a job to access it. Ideally you need to apply when your pregnant and in work. You are being idealistic to think you will just be able to magic up a place

those i knew who knew who emigrated there missed out on kindergarten places - again very over subscribed and ended up paying private. I don’t know their salaries but UK equivalent was prob £80 each so £160 total. This gave them a comfortable but small apartment and kids in private school.

Malta is a great option for many but it is not the land of milk and honey

I’m able to get the same rights as my partner through EU family reunification

We want to raise our family outside the UK.

I’ve been offered a promotion to a leadership role.

I’m not vulnerable in the slightest. How dare you diagnose me over Mumsnet. I’ve worked abroad and travelled Europe alone for years. I undertook a degree whilst also maintaining a full-time job in care in evenings and weekends. You do not know me at all. Malta has been somewhere we’ve also considered a while, I did say earlier in the thread that it was another option for us.

And now you are trying to imply that I’m having some sort of pre-natal mental health crisis. That is an utterly outrageous thing to suggest when you have no basis for doing so. I’ve gone through surgeries and IVF to have this baby and have remained mentally sound throughout. I can assure you, I am absolutely fine.

Perhaps the reason I have felt the need to repeat myself in this thread, is due to people missing key points of information, in that myself and my partner have always desired to leave the UK to raise our family, have provisionally planned it since our relationship became seriously 4 years ago, and have now decided to officially do so. I’ve corrected many assumptions throughout the whole thread - such as the fact that I got pregnant accidentally, am being groomed by my partner, that I earn minimum wage, that my partner doesn’t want to marry me to ensure he can control me in the new country and that I plan to use SIL as an “emotional support animal”. People on this thread have been reaching to the fucking moon.

@tangotingo there are tax implications for working remotely in another country to your employer

Not necessarily if you are in a country which has a Double Taxation Agreement. Though I appreciate it would still be difficult for the UK employer.

But you're basing your decisions on the presence or absence of another person in a particular location, who is, understandably, making her own decisions about relocation based on her own priorities.

Isn't it giving you any pause that you'd managed to turn German, specifically Hamburg, in your head into the perfect place to bring up a child and offering you and your partner in particular the perfect job opportunities, especially for his specific industry, but that your SIL and her partner, already living in Germany, with some German and considerably more knowledge of the country, are leaving because of limited opportunities? And that now you've discarded Germany entirely on the strength of a single conversation, and a tiny, expensive, overdeveloped island with a high cost of living is now your plan? What happened to your partner's industry being key to wherever you move to?

Not wanting to live in the UK isn't enough to make good decisions about where to move to.

I get that you feel the need to leave the UK because of your family situation and you're probably right about it. Just be wise and make a well thought out decision as well.

Not wanting to live in the UK is valid, OP, it's how you're deciding on where to live instead that is the issue.

My partner’s industry is massive in Malta, hence why we’ve been eyeing it up for years.

We’d need to both work in order to be comfortable there long-term, hence why we have significant savings which we will be taking.

My partner can apply from outside the country due to his EU status, I’d need to register residency first before having the right to work and arrange childcare. So there’s inevitably going to be a period of only one income.