Keir starmer is dead in the water

[Bertiebiscuit]

The UK cannot have a prime minister who gave a plum job to a man when all the time he knew that Mandelson was still close friends with an ex-con who was convicted for trafficking children for sexual abuse. Starmer is destroying the reputation of the UK, he is an embarrassment and shoukd resign, if not the Labour party should demand his resignation.

I think we need to wait and see exactly what was and wasn't known by Starmer prior to the appointment of Mandelson to the Ambassador role.

We do already know that Starmer was aware of Mandelson's continued relationship with Epstein after his initial conviction. Many will argue - with some validity - that this was in itself a bad decision and that Starmer should go on that basis. However, that particular information isn't new - it has been in the public domain for ages, so it's hard to see why Starmer could suddenly be forced out now on that fact alone. The argument to date has been that he wasn't really clear about the extent to which the relationship had continued.

However, if it emerges that he knew a lot more, or that he ignored specific advice not to appoint, then I think his position may become untenable.

YouGov did a poll today about Mandelson and 56% of people said they aren't following or aren't interested in the story.

Which was quite interesting. 5% of people weren't aware of the story at all 😳

It was only a couple of weeks ago how loads of people were saying he handled the whole Island thing well, even when not Starmer/Labour fans.

It's tiresome.

I think people are forgetting that Boris was in charge during the global covid crisis.

Had it not been that moment in time and he behaved that way... I'm guessing things would have been very different.

The powers that be had quite enough going on without electing a new prime minister.

It's interesting isn't it and backed up with what we know re Kier and women /Rosie duffield /the pink bus / no labour pm/can't define what a woman is , yet and so on it doesn't suprise me that he didn't fully realise or take on bord the huge risk of mandleson.
Because he just doesn't fully understand the entire issue.

@Meadowfinch your comment falls into the trap of ‘they’re all the same’.

It switches off from acknowledging that there are good politicians out there who have set out with good intentions to make a difference, in spite of it being a hostile and unsympathetic role to be in. It also switches off from holding people accountable for their actions. They do not all ‘lie with every breath’.

Wouldn’t it be great if the government prioritised running the country well instead of Machiavellian plotting to further their own careers.

The fact KS was attempting to withhold ocuments relating to Mandelson is enough for me to think he is in the sh*t.

Was the end of a long list of scandals.

I wonder whether they will want him to limp on long enough to carry the can for the local elections, which will be a bloodbath anyway.

I feel very badly for Keir Starmer. I still think he is a fundamentally decent, albeit flawed, man who has done the best he could with a poisoned chalice. I worry about who might come next - there isn’t anyone credible waiting in the wings that I can see - and we need someone diplomatic and measured who can wrangle Trump. But the modern public is socialised to treat politics like an episode of Love Island, or the Premier League. They want lots of drama and regular shocking defenestrations.

The government are going to have to release all the documents - this is going to get a whole lot for the prime minister if Emily Thornberry's explanation of the "vetting" process was correct.

Starmer knew Mandelson was an inveterate liar, the whole establishment knew. He knew M lived in a fantasy land, playing far above his pay grade. The security services will have made that clear. They will also have listed the number of his overseas jaunts, again way beyond his means. M was a massive and obvious risk. He was also unqualified for such a key appointment, not a professional diplomat.

He was slated with his handling of lockdown and partygate, and I slate him for the PPE scandals that followed, making his friends very wealthy.

I do wonder how it would've been with someone else too..

If international reputation is what we are worried about getting rid of Starmer would be a daft move. He’s done a huge amount to improve the UK’s reputation over the last 18 months

Absolutely, I have my problems with Starmer but he's the best of the bunch by a country mile.

Most of the media is against him and even those outlets supposedly impartial are actively promoting Reform (coughs- BBC) so it takes quite a bit of effort to see the good that Labour gov are doing, but they're doing quite a lot even if they're crap at getting the message out.

I think he gambled with Mandelson because he needed someone who'd be effective with Trump. I really hope he didn't know how tight Mandelson was with Epstein but if he didn't, I am concerned about how that reflects on the security services.

How much he knew..I don't know, but nor do I envy him the position he was in...I think it's harder to be PM of this country now than it has been at any other point in my lifetime.

We need a PM who can command respect on the world stage and that's one of the greatest priorities for the job right now. Like him or not, Starmer does and I don't see a better candidate waiting in the wings.

I think he's also ruthless, which a PM needs to be.

They want lots of drama and regular shocking defenestrations.

No they just want someone in charge who knows what the fk they are doing.

Johnson and Starmer can both have been wrong. It’s not either or. Starmer seems like a much more committed and serious person than Johnson ever was, but I find it extraordinary that he thought it was ok to appoint a man who remained friendly with a convicted paedophile. That should have been enough to disqualify Mandelson from any post, even before this latest information became available.

Still with this? Even his own MPs are going against him.

@ReprogramNeeded dreadful and we can possibly add treason to mandelson charge...selling out the country to his rich sex trafficking dodgy mates at a time of severe national and global crisis.

Theme with rich people buying this labour gov

While I cannot argue with some of that, the criminal part is the insider trading afaik and what has really set the ball in motion this time. Did Starmer know? It was some time ago.

Maybe Raab, given the spectacular success of the Afghanistan withdrawal??

He was a complete arse.

But it just wasn't the time to oust him, the situation was unprecedented.

Not a reason to resign? Starmer inadvisably appointed someone with a chequered history and known association with a paedophile, who then went on to disclose state secrets to that paedophile, and you think Starmer shouldn't be held accountable? Why didn't he listen to MI6's briefings about Mandy?

The crowd might stop baying for a rotating cast of prime ministers if only we could find one that was actually any good. Keir-no-idea flip flop Starmer (sits on the fence so much he must surely have a fence post up his bum) was elected because the country had had enough of Rishi Rich as Croesus and his Tory pals, and Rishi only got in anyway because buffoon Boris had to resign. And Boris got in on the “anyone but Corbyn”vote.
On the plus side, whilst they are utterly useless, I can’t say that any one of our motley lot of politicians are certifiably bonkers, which is more than can be said of certain other countries’ leaders at present.

But our last few PMs have been anything except honest. Or do you think KS and Boris were both honest as the day is long?

Cameron made sure his friends benefitted a lot too. I doubt Mandelson is the only one who had off-records conversations & meetings the ultra rich in recent decades. There's a deep corruption at the heart of politics which needs rooting out.

Difference is...Mandelson's been caught and has been caught with Epstein.