Ex wife still has husband’s surname

[ByCyanPlayer]

Am I wrong to be peeved that my husband’s ex-wife still uses his surname, despite them being divorced 28 years and they were only married for 2 years? They share a son who is 30 but I fail to see why she can’t go back to her maiden name, plus she isn’t the type to be bothered about her and her son having the same surname.

I have an interest in sociology and a desire to improve opportunities for our daughters, granddaughters and beyond.

I’m yet to see anyone give a good reason that this practice continues. What is driving it? Can’t be practicality because that would apply equally to men. Unlikely it’s only women with all of the ugly/difficult names.

It stems from misogyny, and I believe it hampers opportunities for women in many ways (missing the point of feminism being just one of them).

So come on, what great benefits come to the women that change their names such that it should continue as standard practice?

Your interest in sociology has come across as quite high handed and patronising to any woman who has commented on this thread & not shared your view.

We all have free will and free choice. I am not so stupid as to not see & understand that the practice of changing your name to your husband's has a misogynistic background.
I fully expect my own daughters won't make that choice if they do decide to marry one day. They may decide to never marry at all.

However, I did change my name when I married over twenty years ago and I am happy with that choice. I also wasn't given away nor did I wear white but changing my name was something I wanted to do & I went into it with my eyes open, knowing it was a practice routed in mysoginistic tradition. My choice.

I am also happy that I have decided not to change it back when the marriage ended.

I don't have to justify that choice to you or anyone else nor do I have to be criticised by you for it.

You didn't invent feminism and you aren't the only person in the world who understands it.

I’m yet to see anyone give a good reason that this practice continues.

And you have yet to show a good reason why it shouldn't beyond a weird sense of grievance against marriage and a determination to tell other women who are perfectly happy with their choices that they are wrong.

Being known by my husband's name has never hampered opportunities for me and if I have missed the point of your brand of feminism, I'll live with it.

You have tried very hard to tell us we're doing it all wrong and we should be more like you, but you must realise by now you are failing miserably.

You will never convince people who are happy with their life and their choices that they are unhappy.

You also don’t speak for everyone. My posts have multiple
”thanks” etc.

None so blind as those that won’t see.

I’m married myself, so no grievance against that.

I honestly don’t understand how apparently intelligent women think this is a completely innocuous choice - the fact that it is only women expected to even consider doing it is surely a clear sign that it’s not aligned with feminism.

I’m not only suggesting that women probably shouldn’t do it, I’m suggesting that the expectation/consideration of changing name on marriage should apply equally to men. You know, like childcare and caring roles and domestic jobs and buying birthday presents and all the other things that don’t require a vagina to do them that women end up doing.

<bangs head on wall>

Neither of us speak for everyone.

That's the point! Thanks for understanding it at last.

None so blind as those that won’t see.

Could equally apply to you.

I’m married myself, so no grievance against that.

But you didn't really want to be married. A civil partnership would have been preferable.

I honestly don’t understand how apparently intelligent women...

Which is a problem with your understanding, not that of (apparently) intelligent women.

<bangs head on wall>

I suggest you stop doing that, it's not good for your brain.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/mar/07/women-stop-changing-your-name-when-married

That's desperate.

Having failed to convince anyone that you are right and everyone who disagrees is wrong, implied we are stupid or thick for refusing to do as we are told (by you), you think some daft bat in the Grauniad is going to succeed where you have failed.

Seriously, you are on a hiding to nothing...

You didn't invent feminism and you aren't the only person in the world who understands it.

I know someone like this in real life. Alqays quick to tell other women why their choices are wrong and anti-feminist, whilst failing to see that forcing her rules on them is also wrong. For example she goes by Ms Double-Baralled name, and thinks anyone who uses Miss/Mrs and didn't double barrel is wrong. Interestingly her DH didnt double barrel, and the DC have his name.

Of course choices aren't made in a vacuum, and the tradition of names is routed in the patriarchy, but that doesn't make her choice the only correct one.

Call yourself “the current Mrs Player”

A Guardian article from 2013? 😂

Wow, getting the big guns out now!

I was going to post a 200+ page peer reviewed article but thought you’d whinge about it being too highbrow for you.

Seems not much has changed in the intervening period. Still a plethora of women arguing they are being feminists whilst kowtowing to the patriarchy. Shame.

What you cannot seem to accept is that two things can exist at the same time.

That a woman could understand the patriarchy and the history of patriarchal traditions but make a calculated, informed decision to take the same name as their husband.

That doesn't make that choice any less of a choice than yours, neither is it something for that woman to be ashamed of or to be criticised for.

It's a choice. Made for all manner of reasons which are personal to that woman.

Women now have choices over things like this which is something to be celebrated. But it is still a free choice.

You've actively avoided my point about women seemingly being unphased by this still being seen as only a “choice” for women whilst other previously female expectations have shifted.

I do consider that female name changing on marriage is harmful to women generally. No choice exists in a vacuum.

I was married to my ex husband for 8 years and we had three wonderful children. In the beginning he would passively aggressively send any parcels he’d ordered for the children (Covid) with my maiden name on. I called him out on this and to him that it’s my name now too as I want to share a surname with our children until they’re of age.
He remarried 3 years ago and I know it drives his new wife crazy with rage but he tells her straight as he understands now I’ve told him why.
Im due to get married next year and have always said that all legal documents will be double barrelled but day to day I will be Mrs second husbands name

How is it harmful? Genuinely interested in that one

I kept my previous married name as I wanted the same name as DC then the longer it was left the more of a pain it was to change it back. I was strong, independent and still me. I kept the name until I remarried. I took my husbands name as I like us being Mr&Mrs X. I am still me, I can take care of myself. Definitely no harm done to me at all.

Interesting thread with quite a few affirmations that women don't have to justify their choices to anyone. No, you absolutely don't. Yet this thread seems to be full of people falling over themselves to do precisely that, and it's often from the position of those who do discard their name that any women who question patriarchal 'norms' are derided as 'bitter'.

It's there, in black-and-white, upthread and it's extremely misogynistic.

@AmIHumanOrAmIAYeti has posted nothing offensive or deserving of the vitriol she's attracted on this thread. She's also quite right that this would only be a truly 'free' choice if men were making it with the same frequency as women. They're not.

I'm less interested in whether women choose to retain their own names on marriage than the conditions under which those decisions are made and why this is often seen as the default choice. But we all have autonomy over our own names. A woman's family name doesn't belong to her father, and it doesn't belong to her husband. It's hers.

How is it harmful? Genuinely interested in that one

It is only harmful in HumanYeti's mind, because she wants to believe it is.

She hates marriage and deeply resents women who are happy with choices she dislikes.

She has got a chip the size of a meteorite on her shoulder about happily married women. She wants us to emasculate our husbands so we can all be as miserable and resentful as she is.

Despite claiming to be a feminist, she clearly looks down on women and believes she is morally and intellectually superior despite a complete lack of evidence in her posts to support such a belief.

Often done without any thought unfortunately and pressure to do so

How can I dislike marriage when I have been married for almost half my life?! 🤣

She wants us to emasculate our husbands so we can all be as miserable and resentful as she is.

You’ve just given yourself away. Equal expectations of men and women are apparently emasculating for men. They must have the power and the bloodline and therefore we should give up our own identities to theirs. Be proud of being allowed to be married to them and identify such through our names and titles. We must brand our children similarly.

To retain any sense of individual identity is emasculating to them.

Do you live in a cave, perchance?

Quite. It’s utterly depressing. At least some of us can see it.

I think it’s a slippery slope to other more damaging elements of our societal set up. I think, based on those I know (and whose stories are shared on here) that women who change their names are also more likely to believe that women should be primary caregiver to children and by default, household chores. They will likely want lower paid roles and less responsibility at work that allow part time working, and also lower opportunity, pension etc. Meanwhile the men continue unhindered by such annoyances as sick children or grocery shopping. Women become subsumed by domesticity and assume it is what they are best at. They become boring with few interests and there are other shiny and exciting women to be distracted by.

It is so much easier for men to walk away when they feel little responsibility - look how many women dance around unreliable fathers who want contact with their kids on their own terms. Who have been absolutely shafted by long stints of part time working or SAHM. And to add insult to injury, they gave their children a name that ties hers too.

My employer gives 6 months full paid paternity pay (mirrors maternity) - which is almost always taken. Less than 1% of men go part time afterwards compared to more than 75% of women. Because the overall expectation is men provide and women care. How we change this is by women demanding that men do differently.

But you can see on this thread how it is those of us actively seek/demand change are denigrated by the patriarchy-gripped women bleating about “choice”.

Not one benefit has been cited for women changing their names rather than men. Interesting lack of evidence there.

Well said