To think that some women care more about their careers than their families and that this isn’t always a good thing?

[ThatRedBeaker]

Not trying to start a war but I’ve noticed a growing trend where some women (not all!) seem to put their career above everything, including their partner or kids. Obviously, everyone has the right to pursue success but I do wonder if there’s a point where it becomes too much. Like… is it unreasonable to think that some people might be prioritising the wrong things?

Genuinely curious what others think.

Why shouldn’t we? Men are able to do it without any judgement and in fact society expects them to do it.
fwiw I know of three mums who hav focused on their careers and their young adult children are either unemployed or in jobs that will have no career and no real progression.
the women I know who’ve kept their careers have young adult children who started on the same path.

What is right for one family and woman is different to the next and they shouldn’t be judged for having a good career and enjoying it

I think a parent should apend 15 minutes a day uninterrupted qulity time with each child. Playing a game, reading a story, going for a walk, having a chat etc. If they are not doing this for whatever reason I think it is to the detriment of the child. This is more important than lots of extra curricular activities etc. Mums and Dads can of course do this whether working full time, part time or stay at home. People have different levels of energy, ambition etc and there is no "best" setup, just what works best for each family.

What do you mean by prioritising their careers? Why is it that women seem to have to make this big choice between family vs career but men can just carry on as normal without question or judgement?

No, men's choices are not criticised. It is taken for granted that men will focus on their careers and not pull their weight at home. If they show up to do the school run occasionally they are Dad of the Year.

Sorry, but no. Men's trade offs are not more criticised than women's. Men choosing to prioritise their career and do fuck all at home or with their children is considered normal.

So let's deal with that first before we start with the oh so wide eyed faux-naive dissing of women's ambitions.

I personally don’t know any women who do this but I do know a lot of successful hard working women who put everything into their work and family.
They do both.

Do you have any examples of women who do this? Maybe you just aren’t seeing it, maybe you are only seeing one side?

I agree, OP. Work should take a backseat for awhile while children are young. Can be either parent who does this though.

Maybe people are worried about their financial future. Less people are choosing to get married. With marriage comes a lot of legal rights if you split up.

also, the idea of giving everything up for your children and husband in an essence being a housemaid, is unappealing to most people. I think previously women were chained to their husbands because private nurseries didn’t exist so they had to take a five year career break if they wanted to have kids. Possibly more, my mother-in-law had a decade off. Nowadays the picture is different.

Pretty standard for men to this (and socially accepted), but it’s only viewed as negative if a woman does it 🤷‍♀️

I prioritise my self only.

I focused on women here because there’s often an assumption that women’s career choices are always unquestionably positive or empowering, whereas men’s trade-offs are more openly criticised.

I find this is more often the other way around, where mothers are openly criticised no matter what we do, with father's trade offs discussed far more rarely and in wider culture often dismissed as worth discussing. Men putting career first is culturally the default, with men who take less intense careers to put family first treated as an oddity to put more praise on than a women gets in the same situation or meets scorn for not being more masculine.

I think culturally, from an early age, success and ambition as treated as only relating to careers - even the OP discusses pursuing success only in terms of a career even though success can come from many areas of life. Having an ambition in marriage, family, home or in other areas of life treated as nonsense or old-fashioned, with travel being an exception and often only if still connected either with a career or earned from a career - if someone seeks to travel without that, they're often treated as a leech or immature. It's no wonder that many people frame their success closest to their careers in this environment.

I also disagree that there is an assumption that women’s career choices are always unquestionably positive or empowering - it depends on if it fits into the idea what is considered empowering. Having two daughters who did well at GCSE and chose vocational routes for post-16, they were openly questioned and criticised by their school for not choosing a more 'ambitious' academic path and my older daughter does not meet much positivity years on from 'just' being a teaching assistant.

I don't think my older son has had much discussion on the 'trade offs' of pursuing engineering, even working 6+ weeks at a time at sea, he's fairly open that they drill into him and his peers on how much money they can make once they're fully qualified with little discussion on wellbeing. The view is loud and clear that the predominately male profession he's in that the money makes up for the limited time with anything else. His father and I have had those lifestyle conversations with him, but even then, it leans towards making the money until he can reach certain goals and then getting more balanced work. It's just baked in that that will be worth it in the end, even if we can't be certain on that.

I wonder OP if you can give some examples of what you mean. If a woman is working and has a family, what sort of things would you take as 'signs' that she is prioritising one over the other?

Some people still seem to think that any woman who voluntarily (as in not just because she can't afford to live otherwise) goes back to work when her kids are primary school age or below is being selfish and career-obsessed at her kids' expense. Other people, including me, are of the opinion that this is fine and not a sign of neglecting your family. I can also think of a myriad of different situations where family priorities and work priorities might be seen as conflicting in some way (eg working late because it's part of the work culture for anyone serious about promotion vs insisting on finishing at 5 every day; missing a school Christmas concert because you can't get the time off vs refusing to work in a role that wouldn't give you enough flexibility to attend, etc). People will make all sorts of judgements about all sorts of situations but I'm curious about at what point you would start to think the woman was being neglectful of family and home life?

I don't agree with you at all that critiquing men's work/life balance is more normalised now and that work is assumed to be empowering for women. Women are, in my experience, still criticised so much more for their work choices, whilst men are more likely to be assumed to have some sort of deep level of need for work that can't be satisfied by family life.

ODFOD

It doesn't have to be either/or. I worked hard at my career so that my daughter could see what was possible for women. I didn't have such a role model and I wanted something different for her.

Thankfully my husband was supportive and went part time to be there for the kids while I worked up to 98 hour weeks with studying for professional exams on top.

By prioritising career do you mean working full time/enough hours to cover mortgage, bills, child related costs? By not needing lots of benefit top ups? Many of us work hard because we have to and because don’t qualify for benefit top ups or don’t want to take when capable of working. We value our careers because it helps our mental health along with covering costs of living and keeping a roof over our child’s heads.

Seems women can’t win we either producing children we can’t afford to keep or working too much some people think we not prioritising our children. Would love to work less but as no one else going to step in financially will just keep going although my children are my priority in life

Short of maybe Erika Kirk right now, or some celebrities who clearly have nannies doing everything, I don’t know any women like this. 🤷🏻‍♀️ Dh and I have both worked hard in our careers. I got a PhD and was travelling internationally doing research when my eldest was a toddler. The outcome of that is that Dh and I now have the sort of life where neither of us has to work FT. One of us always does the school run. One or both of us is always done work by 3:30pm when dc are off school. We have our evenings and weekends free for family time. Because we put in the time to build our careers when it counted. Most of the women I know have either left work or are PT.

Well, let's see op, my career has provided a warm secure home for my happy confident child. It puts food on the table, it pays the bills, has allowed dc to take up his scholarship, and will shortly help him take the masters in engineering he wants. It sets him a good example of a decent work ethic.

Silly me, I should have stayed at home making gingerbread in a gingham pinny, and lived off the state instead. 😂😂😂

I think having a good income that means dd doesn't have to watch us stressing about turning the heating on or buying food, doing the hobbies she loves and being able to do school trips and family holidays actually is prioritising her. If she needs me I'm there but my career is important to me too

Are you serious OP? You genuinely think that a man who works long hours and doesn't see much of his family is criticised more than a woman who does the same? That is very much not the case.

Wow, you must live on a different planet to me

Where have you seen this trend? The Daily Mail? Conservative Home? From Reform Party members? MAGA fans?

Is it bad when men do this too or just women?

I work with lots of women who and mothers and work £100k -300k + per year jobs.

All of them are breaking their backs to give their kids the best they can.
I dont know a single one that isnt bothered or views their kids as a lifestyle tickbox exercise that isn't prioritised.

Do you mean you've noticed a growing trend of women working or working full time?
If so, there are doing it so they have the money required to feed and clothe their children and themselves and provide them with a good standard of living.
I know because I am one of them.
Be reassured my career is fairly low down my priority list right now 😅

We are fine thanks...

Perhaps spare more of a thought for the women who dont work and are birthing children they can it be fucked to raise.... while relying on government benefits and abusing asda workers who wont let them use the FSM vouchers issued in the summer holidays (because they cant be trusted to feed their children) to buy bags and booze 👍👍👍 rather han berate the working mothers funding it

what fucking post. 😅😅😅

Rubbish.

No, I don't think some women care more about their careers than their families.
I think some women place equal importance on their careers and financial independence. And why shouldn't they.