Would you/have you secretly filmed at your child's Nativity?

[Dramatic]

So our school has a policy that you aren't allowed to film/take photos at all, total blanket ban. They don't take photos or film themselves either.

My husband works away and never gets to see the plays so I secretly film them/take photos (just my child's part but there are others in the background) and I show the videos to him.

I don't put them on any social media or send them to anyone else, even Grandparents etc.

Aibu?

Covertly filming minors when you’ve been instructed not to is not a great look, OP. You’re opening yourself up to some very sinister accusations

From some of the very specific details you’ve posted, I actually think our paths may have (indirectly) crossed, @Dramaticand if I’m right your attitude does not surprise me in the slightest.

People do will know you filmed it. The school will find out, and please believe me that there are both extremely good reasons why you shouldn’t have filmed, as well as most likely consequences of your actions.

I could of course be wrong, but even if I am, it still stands that no one could be so discrete while still managing to film any footage worth watching, and it will have been spotted. For a start, phone screens light up. Staff keep a sharp eye on audiences at children’s performances, especially where there are protected children to be considered. Quite rightly so, as anyone who is willing to covertly film in a school of primary children with other people’s children in the background when they have been explicitly told not to, should have a very close eye kept on them. For lots of reasons.

Just follow the rules, I’m sure DHs rotation will allow him to watch the next colour run, or Easter bonnet parade, or whatever. Not seeing your kid in a white bed sheet and angel wings won’t scar him for life.

They will have brought the ban in because people like you were breaking the no social media rule. It’s the only reason schools are forced to do this. Some children are not allowed on SM for safeguarding purposes and when parents flout the rules, it leads to blanket bans like this.

They should be old school and offer to record it and send the video to parents with any child who isn’t allowed blurred out.

There could be any number of reasons for a blanket ban. I would imagine there are children who can’t be filmed for a variety of reasons, some of which may be serious and even put them in danger if the videos were to get out. This sounds dramatic but the rule is there to safeguard children. If all parents had given consent for the kids to be filmed and photographed then there wouldn’t be a ban.

you may only show your husband but what if he shows them to his mum, who shows them to his sister, who shows them to her friend, and so on. Also it can’t be one rule for one and a different one for everyone else.

when my dds were at school we were allowed to take photos etc when dd1 was in ks1 but there were children who couldn’t be photographed in dd2 cohort and so we weren’t allowed. That was that.

Honestly, you are just selfish. It's a shame in this world that so many people are this way. No matter what anyone says you won't accept it, can't see that you were wrong. You are the main player in the world and everyone else doesn't matter, their opinions don't matter, just you.

YABU

It is a shame the school have the policy .Perhaps others have flouted the policy in the past and so ruined it for everyone ! (my own kids' primary allowed it on the proviso it was not put on SM - due to kids in care etc )

Do the school not organise a CD of the whole thing themselves then give you the option to buy it? That's wht happened at the kids primary mine went to

You are responsible for participating in the creation of a shared culture regards rules. And that does matter, certain countries culturally have very low crime rates because there's a high level of social respect for rules and authority. People take accountability for themselves and their own contributions to that culture. That's what this is like - obviously people will ultimately make their own decisions, but if they see you taking a video then they will feel encouraged to do the same. And while YOU may know your intentions are 'good' that person may be a pedophile and intending to manipulate the images for their own use or shared use later on. If you're in any community (in this case a school community) then you are, by default, automatically jointly responsible for the culture created there. And the problem for the school is that if multiple people start doing what you are doing then there's no way to know which people are going to misuse those images or be irresponsible with them? Plus people are bound to notice you filming if they're sitting beside you.

"My child posed with the teacher at the colour run for a photo (that I took) with plenty of kids in the background. At no point did the teacher say we couldn't take the photo" I work with kids and I will know the makeup of any group. So the teacher will know if all kids there are OK for photo sharing or if they aren't. Sometimes I'm out with large groups where every parent has given consent and I don't need to worry about and other times there will be children I need to be mindful of. Often that means checking photos including the background for who's in it and possibly retaking the photo which is done subtly.

@thetaupescroller "The chances of a kidnapper breaking into my home and hacking my phone to find details of another child are very very slim" if you have instagram or Snapchat or many other similar apps then they've no need to break into your home as auto updates recently give these apps permission to access your entire camera roll. These images are then used to train their ai systems. Ai is now being used regularly for the manipulation and creation of child abuse content. So the issue is that in theory your child's image is then informing harmful content. We don't have the controls in place yet to be able to manage the tech we've created in order to safeguard so having any child's image online or via messaging apps etc is a real concern even if that child isn't a child at risk.

What specific details make you think you know me?

Do people really live in this level of insane paranoia?

No one is hacking a phone to upload a secret badly recorded clip of a random childs nativity play to social media... and IF that insane scenario ever some how happened (it won't) the chances they are friends with someone who is an abuser of the child in the background and identifies them and the school... come on.

Tin foil hats off people... we are not spies for MI5 who have such interesting secrets we are targets of covert operations.

I don't think people should break rules but making up insane scenarios invalid arguments not strengthens them.

I think it's fair enough the school have that policy though because realistically it's difficult to erase a particular child from a full video. Different for individual still images although tech is also changing with that as well - its not enough to just pop a smiley over someone's face or blur them now because the tech now exists to revert to the original image and remove the smiley or blurring. It's a minefield for schools and I think it's really important that the schools priority is to the safeguarding of pupils and ensuring that kids at risk can safely have all the same opportunities as other kids.

No, it's a dick move

It may have looked like a free for all, @Dramatic - but I am sure the staff know FAR better than you do, which children could have their safety compromised if their photo was shared on social media, and would have avoided getting them in the background.

Approach the school and talk to them about sensible alternatives - allowing parents to take photos of their children after the show, or the school taking pictures, or even getting it filmed and selling the, suitably edited, video to parents. THAT is the responsible, respectful way to deal with this - not covert filming because you shouldn’t have to obey the rules.

Haven't read all the thread but I've done it. A long, long time ago and for the reason the op wants too. To show DH who was unable to attend but would've loved to have seen it. Can't remember how but I managed to burn it to a Dvd where we probably watched a handful of times and now is stashed away in the depths of the loft.

Would I do it again? No. I couldn't be arsed tbh. It's a shame the world is so fucked up people can no longer take photos or film their children's nativities anymore. I'm glad I did it at the time because it is occasionally nice to look back on and brings back some lovely memories. But mostly it stays wherever the hell it is in the loft.

Didn't get posted on social media either.

Yes, they do - when their child’s safety could be compromised, if an abusive parent sees a video or picture and finds their location, @housethatbuiltme.

Just be grateful if you don’t have the lived experience that builds this utterly reasonable level of fear, and try to have a little imagination to understand how it must feel.

Those are the rules I’m afraid.

Put yourself in the situation of a mum with a child who has no contact with their father, for instance. Now imagine she sees someone filming the school nativity. Can you imagine how worried she might feel that her child could end up on social media? She doesn’t know that you’re only planning on showing your husband.

The rules are there for the safety of children and that comes before anything else.

Exactly this - I was a governor at a school where one family was in witness protection. Anything identifying their location could have resulted in their death.

It’s not really insane paranoia. You’d be surprised at the number of at risk kids out there. They could be hiding from an abusive parents who is on the lookout for them. Or they could be part of witness protection. Many other reasons besides.

people probably are t hacking phones no, but what if she send it to her husband and he sends it to his mum (child’s grandparent). She thinks it adorable and shows her neighbour and so on. Things can get around even if the intention is all quite innocent. Doesn’t even need to make it to social media.

I don’t have kids, can someone please explain this batshit rule for me? Why can’t parents take photos/videos of the nativity play if the school isn’t doing it?

The irony 😂

But what’s wrong with a perfectly appropriate photo of children ‘getting around’?

In newspapers there is often a close up photo of a footballer at the edge of the field whereby the fans sitting in that section are very clearly visible behind him, including children. No one thinks “what if those children are in witness protection? 😱” then, do they?

Bonkers.

Some children are not allowed contact with relatives for a variety of reasons, such as a birth parent (or maybe both parents, if they are adopted/fostered).
That person might not be allowed contact with the child or to know what school they are in.
People videoing or photographing school plays and posting it online can put those children in danger.
You’d be surprised how many children in schools are in this vulnerable situation with a parent or relative.

So for the safety of all children, schools ask that no footage be taken.

OP, do you think it would be acceptable for strangers to enter your home while you’re out, wander around without your knowledge, and then leave, just because they didn’t intend to steal or damage anything? It is a clear violation of privacy and property. Filming children without permission, after being explicitly told not to is a violation of their autonomy and privacy, regardless of your intent or whether you post it online.

If a parent wanted to find out which school a child they’re not allowed contact with goes to, do you think they would add random parent and grandparent age people on social media on the off chance they a) have a child in the same school, and b) post photos and videos of nativity plays on social media?

Dangerous parents determined to track down and do harm to a child have got to be in the absolute minority, and they’re not likely to using the social media posts of strangers to do this, but far more nefarious methods.

I understand the precautionary principle, but the no photos/videos rule seems to me to be going too far.

I was disappointed I couldn't film it and did consider doing it on the sly but didn't. Then guess what, the school posted a YOUTUBE link to the whole show..