All our children are different religions, Christmas is feeling overwhelming

[Ellipsie]

DH and I have 4 children, all now adults, all married. We are CofE Christians, our children were raised CofE Christians and Christmas for us has always been religion first.

Our eldest DD married a lovely Muslim and converted to Islam. Her 2 children are being raised Muslim.
Our youngest DD married her best friend from secondary school, he is Jewish, he leans liberal and isn’t as devout as DD1s family, but they celebrate Jewish holidays, go to synagogue for Yom Kipur/Rosh Hashanah etc. and always without fail have Shabbat dinner with his family. Their daughter is now 3 so more aware than in previous years.
Both of our DS are loosely Christian, church on Easter and Christmas only but do view Christmas as being religion first.

For our daughters they both have different approaches to Christmas.
My eldest daughter doesn’t want any presents for her children for Christmas, she has asked we celebrate them at Eid instead, which is of course understandable and absolutely fine. They will be joining us for dinner on Christmas Day though.
Our youngest daughter has a different approach where by they still celebrate Christmas “culturally”, so they do Father Christmas and have a Christmas tree etc. They also allow us to give their child a gift at Christmas.

Now our grandchildren are no longer babies I am finding it all a bit tricky to navigate. This year we have 7 grandchildren.
Our eldest DDs 2 children are now 4 and 2, our eldest son has a 3 year old and a 1 year old, our younger son has a 2 year old and a newborn and our youngest daughter has a 3 year old.

This is the first year we will be hosting Christmas with children who are aware of what’s going on. I’m terrified that as DD1 doesn’t want us give her children gifts they are going to feel awful as we will be giving the others gifts. I thought we could get around this by having our grandchildren who will get gifts come over earlier and receive them but as DD2 isn’t Christian and doesn’t do church that won’t be possible.

At the same time I’m also terrified about getting the language right, Christmas has always been religious for us, but now I’m thinking do I need to present everything as “well granny and grandad believe this, but others don’t”?

It’s got me very stressed out and I don’t want to upset or offend any of my children.

AIBU to struggle with this? Does anyone have any advice or ideas on how I can make this work?

The faith bit is straightforward. You are Christians, you observe the day in exactly the same way you always did. Your grandchildren are growing up in a multi-faith world and being included in your religious practice is a lovely way of showing them the differences but underlining that they will always be welcome and included by your religious community if they respect if. If you went to DD1’s at Eid, you wouldn’t expect her in-laws to caveat everything. Same applies.

The gifts are trickier. I would ask all your children in a group chat what they think the best approach is, because you are happy to respect DD1’s wishes but don’t want to upset her children.

This is really sad. No wonder you're tying yourself in knots. Easy for me to say but I really don't think you should be giving in to DD1 for an easy life. Compromise on the presents for sure, they're the secular bit, important to kids but not to adults. Don't compromise on your traditional celebrations though. And I say that as an atheist! I wouldn't dream of going to the home of someone who is a Christian on Christmas day and demanding they don't do anything relating to their religion.

There’s nothing worse than religious fanatics who have converted! If DD1 spoils for a fight you have to stand your ground that it’s a family day. Surely anyone can drop prayers and religious overtones when guests are there? Do it privately. Give presents to other dc earlier.

I think your DD needs to stick up and make it clear her children have Christian relatives who will be giving gifts to the children. Could you phrase it as a new year gift?

My XH is Muslim but ds still celebrates Christmas with me and my family. He would be devastated if he didn’t receive gifts while his other family members and half brother did. We also celebrate Eid with him.

I think your dd1 is doing this deliberately tbh, to cause trouble or a row.
If she finds any other religions customs and traditions so abhorrent why is she coming on Christmas day at all ?
It's glaringly obvious she wants to make trouble.
I get wanting them all together OP...I love having my girls and their partners all home for Christmas.
I'd be blunt and ask DD1 why exactly she wants to come, given she wouldn't attend her brothers weddings for example because she wouldn't go into a church.
One solution for the present issue is buy something that is for "all" the grandchildren collectively that stays at your house, such as a playhouse in the garden or swing set or trampoline.
Or a huge wooden train set ...or big box of LEGO.
Something that they can all use.

The present thing is just unreasonable and cruel of your dd1...she knows her little daughter won't really understand and will be upset at not getting a present...she's doing it on purpose to derail your Christmas.

Gosh your daughter sounds like hard work. Does she think her child will suddenly convert to Christianity by receiving a gift?!

If I was invited to celebrate Eid with friends and was kindly given a gift I’d be grateful at the gesture. In our old house our Muslim neighbours would often bring food round on Eid and I think that’s really kind and generous. I’ve been to church services and listened to prayers even though I’m not Christian myself. I don’t find it hard to accept that others will do their own thing in their own homes.

I think she’s teaching her daughter intolerance.

Is DD1 likely to turn up and announce there can be no mention of Christmas and impose her beliefs on everyone else, thereby spoiling the day for everyone else? If so I’d also suggest she skips it.

Agree. I know you want to spendcthe dsy with all your children but your DD1s bad behaviour is going to ruin Christmas for everyone. If her husband is telling her to pack it in then its nothing to do with religion ( or her being coerced) and everything to do with your DD being deliberately difficult. I bet your other children are dreading her coming round too. She needs to be put in her place and learn the consequences of her actions instead of having everyone pander to her.

You sounds honestly lovely but I think you are trying to hard. If DD1 is that bothered about her child NOT celebrating Christmas, then she should be opting NOT to be taking her to Christian household on Christmas Day. That's disrespectful. However, if you don't want to rock that boat, could you ask other DDs to come slightly earlier or stay slightly later to do presents without DD1?

whatsapp to the lot;
hi, we don’t want anyone to be upset but we are planning on praying before we eat and going to church. (And whatever other religious bits you might do) typically Christmas/hannukah/eid al fitir involve gift giving to children. To that end each grandchild will get 1 gift each that represents their own religious beliefs. Please respect our choices as much as I am trying to respect yours.
private WhatsApp to DD1;
I understand you said no gifts, but I have looked into the religious Muslim festivals and Eid al Fitir allows children to receive one gift. I know that it ends at a similar time to Christmas, so therefore I thought it would be nice for DGD/DGS to receive their Eid Al Fitir gift from us on the day we see them to avoid upset. I’m sorry but it is against my religion to allow a child to go without on a day that is all about giving.

I think it's very strange of dd1 to want to join Christmas celebrations but not the gift part!! I think they should have skipped this year.

Do also be aware that any stories around Father Christmas are likely to be challenged by DD1's children as they grow up.

I think chill. Grandparents are religious so do it X way. It’s up to parents to explain things. My husband and I are atheist and celebrate Christmas… there’s never been any need for religious talk over the period so you could try doing that.

As the two oldest children are a similar age, I want to suggest buying something to leave at your house. Something creative and collaborative that can live in a tub and come out when they are around, like stickle bricks, brio, marble run etc. That way if there's an upset child. 'oooh look what we have for everyone to play with today!'. Not wrapped, obviously, just something you know everyone will enjoy that they can look forward to playing with when at your house.. Bubbles! Bubbles are always good for in the garden.
I would also get something crafty to do - biscuits and icing pens, some colouring things.

With some creativity you can make all the grandchildren feel included.

Fascinating how this is a meeting point of religious intolerance between the three Abrahamic faiths.
And sad really, as we see examples of such severe conflict all over the world.

For me- and probablty the majority in the UK religion plays no part in christmas, but as you yourself are religious then maybe that's not an option.

Your language is very telling. Why are you “terrified”? Do your children bully you?

it’s Christmas in your house and you do it your way. DD1 sounds a) like a cow if she’s going to sit and watch her DC excluded from presents and b) stupid if she thinks getting a present will stop her child being Muslim. Standouts like one of those tedious converts who are more rigidly religious that everyone born into the faith.

I think you have to be firm, OP. You are Christian and presumably British and you want to celebrate Christmas in your own tradition. That includes the giving of gifts. If your DD objects she shouldn’t come. But if she does she must expect to respect the traditions of your household as you would hers.

What about having some new toys/colouring books/crayons just ‘at’ your house (these can be charity shop / open so definitely not a present) That way, when you’re exchanging presents with the rest of the family, you can say to DD’s children “Why don’t you have a look in that cupboard, Grandma has got some new toys for you to play with at her house”. If you can’t indulge, distract!

Why is your religion / traditions / culture .. being sent to the bottom of the pile ? She wants you to celebrate Eid, but she won’t offer you the same in return?

She does realise that Jesus is recognised in Islam? That he’s seen as very special, his miraculous Virgin birth and miraculous abilities are both recognised in the Quoran .. Mary is also venerated. He was one of the great prophets / messengers is Islam …if that birth isn’t worth celebrating, I don’t know what is.

Apart from that, a vast majority of Muslims understand that Christmas is a big deal over here, and are not offended by any of it .. most of the Muslims I know are fine to go along with the cultural side of things.

After reading this I think your daughter is ridiculous. I work in a christian school with lots of Muslims who come to collective worship, attend church services with children. And I have been with Christian children to mosques and temples. If she's that strict she shouldn't be coming and it's not fair on her daughter. I'm not sure which option you should choose but I absolutely don't think you should let your little granddaughter sit and watch present opening just becUse your daughter is a bit of a bully.

Instead of bowing down to everyone else, it sounds to me they should also show some respect for your traditions.

This. Because you're Christian you're disrespecting your own traditions.

If you went to your DDs or her inlaws for Eid and they got you a gift to include you, would you be offended? I doubt it.

On the other hand, maybe this is a good opportunity to make Christmas less about presents and "stuff".

‘Terrified’ seems a bit strong. Even 4 year olds can understand that people believe different things.

I think - speaking as a Jew married to a Russian orthodox person living in a Christian country - you need to just find a way through, albeit with the difficulty of DD1 thrown in.

What is everyone happy with? A shared meal, some time together, maybe simple games/crafts and family TV? A walk? Do that. Give one set of GC a present for Hanukkah, the other a present for Eid (at the appropriate times), and spend some of the present money on games or activities that they can all do together at yours. At those sort of ages I'd say a bubble machine, disco ball or marble run, Twister type of thing.

Don’t do this, it could all go wrong g.

I would speak to both your DD and ask how they want to do the present giving. It’s up to DD1 then if her child is upset.

I am Muslim but love Christmas and always give my kids Christmas presents. I just see it as a cultural thing and fun.

do you think you could keep a few presents aside and present them to your grandchildren as ‘New Year gifts’ but give them on the day? That’s what my religious mum does…

but I see it as the parents’ job to sort out not yours. You sound lovely!