All our children are different religions, Christmas is feeling overwhelming

[Ellipsie]

DH and I have 4 children, all now adults, all married. We are CofE Christians, our children were raised CofE Christians and Christmas for us has always been religion first.

Our eldest DD married a lovely Muslim and converted to Islam. Her 2 children are being raised Muslim.
Our youngest DD married her best friend from secondary school, he is Jewish, he leans liberal and isn’t as devout as DD1s family, but they celebrate Jewish holidays, go to synagogue for Yom Kipur/Rosh Hashanah etc. and always without fail have Shabbat dinner with his family. Their daughter is now 3 so more aware than in previous years.
Both of our DS are loosely Christian, church on Easter and Christmas only but do view Christmas as being religion first.

For our daughters they both have different approaches to Christmas.
My eldest daughter doesn’t want any presents for her children for Christmas, she has asked we celebrate them at Eid instead, which is of course understandable and absolutely fine. They will be joining us for dinner on Christmas Day though.
Our youngest daughter has a different approach where by they still celebrate Christmas “culturally”, so they do Father Christmas and have a Christmas tree etc. They also allow us to give their child a gift at Christmas.

Now our grandchildren are no longer babies I am finding it all a bit tricky to navigate. This year we have 7 grandchildren.
Our eldest DDs 2 children are now 4 and 2, our eldest son has a 3 year old and a 1 year old, our younger son has a 2 year old and a newborn and our youngest daughter has a 3 year old.

This is the first year we will be hosting Christmas with children who are aware of what’s going on. I’m terrified that as DD1 doesn’t want us give her children gifts they are going to feel awful as we will be giving the others gifts. I thought we could get around this by having our grandchildren who will get gifts come over earlier and receive them but as DD2 isn’t Christian and doesn’t do church that won’t be possible.

At the same time I’m also terrified about getting the language right, Christmas has always been religious for us, but now I’m thinking do I need to present everything as “well granny and grandad believe this, but others don’t”?

It’s got me very stressed out and I don’t want to upset or offend any of my children.

AIBU to struggle with this? Does anyone have any advice or ideas on how I can make this work?

Because it seems pretty obvious. You’ve answered your question in your post. You’re celebrating Christmas as a Christian, others are attending for family time and/or cultural reasons. Presents/disappointment etc are for the parents to handle and explain. But yes “we believe this others believe XYZ” is perfectly acceptable.

I’m Jewish and we have Xmas lunch with the family and Xmas crackers. No tree, no presents.
If you’re hosting you do it your way. I wouldn’t be offended if my DC got a Xmas present, they did from neighbours when they were young. Santa visited their primary school, son was a shepherd in the Xmas nativity etc.
i think it’s unfair for one GC not to get a present but if that’s the parents’ wish it’s up to them.

Give the presents before Christmas, it makes. Ore sense if they are young anyway if they believe Santa delivers them.

I’ve never celebrated Christmas in a Christian way, but I can’t see why anyone would be upset if you want to say a prayer before dinner, they don’t need to join in.

Converts to religions often tend to be more zealous

I agree with this. Most of the Muslims I grew up with, enjoy Christmas and celebrate many of the cultural aspects. The converts don’t tend to do this.

I completely agree with this.

Your post sounds like you’re pandering to your Muslim daughter tbh. Do you feel like you’ve got something to make up for? Were there challenges during her reverting/conversion?

You’re a Christian celebrating Christmas. You don’t have to ‘force your faith down their throats’ but you celebrate it in the way that’s important to you. What about your Christian sons? They’ve chosen the Christian faith. Why can’t they have it celebrated in all its glory?

Regarding presents, maybe the boys should bring their DC home after the church service to open presents. Then DD2 whenever they come.Your DD1 can take their presents discreetly and give them out at Eid. No it is not fine to celebrate thrm at Eid. You’re not Muslim.

Im from a family with both Muslims and Christians and some in between. At Christmas the Christians invite the others to celebrate, feed them or take food to them and give them presents. At Eid, the Muslims spread joy by giving lots of food and sometimes money/presents.

Nobody is expected to change the way they celebrate in their faith and essentially deny their faith to make others comfortable.

Your DD has a Christian grandma. It’s good for her to know what that involves. Exposure to different religions builds tolerance and understanding. Unless she’s going to be attending an Islamic school and only associate with Muslims, she’ll come across other Christians.

Right everyone this is what we are doing:

Christmas is the following for us:
on Christmas Eve we are doing a meal at 6 pm no prayers and no religion
we are going to our church at 8 pm- you are welcome to come with us or put your feet up and watch a film no pressure
on Christmas Day we would like to give everyone Christmas presents and treat everyone the same
on Christmas Day we will disappear at 9-10 for a short service at our church you are welcome to come or not.

we are also happy to celebrate with you at Eid, YK or any other festivals you celebrate. We are very happy we are in such a welcoming and inclusive family.

My best friends is Hindi I am Christian we celebrate Christmas, Easter etc and festival of light together we celebrate and support each other

I'd just do Christmas as normal.

It's Dd1's job to deal with her child's reaction to getting no presents, not yours. Just give no presents. She gets presents at Eid. Also her job to explain that different people believe different things.

Your children all know how you celebrate Christmas. If you went to celebrate Eid or Hannukah with them, would you expect them to change their traditions so as not to offend Christians? Presumably not.

If any children asked me directly what I believed I'd just tell them.

MarvelousMonsters, a great post. As another poster added, Christmas was adopted by Christians,it was a pagan winter festival..I'm not in any way religious. Brought up Christian, actually attended church till I was 15. You can't have religious discussions with small children, they don't understand. Personally, I would go for no gifts. We did this years ago, when by the time people married had kids,there was 35, it got ridiculous. No one was upset or offended,we just had a lovely day, enjoyed each others company . Christmas has turned into a ridiculous greed fest.

This is a bit dramatic.

Your DD knows what’s good for her child and had chosen to bring her round yours for Christmas, knowing what Christmas entails.

Your house, your rules

Ah that makes sense. You do sound like you’re afraid of her at some level.

DD2 doesn’t worry me as much as DD1 as she can get very upset when she feels we aren’t respecting her, where as DD2 just goes with the flow, but that has always been their personalities. Personalities are a complex mixture of nature and nurture @Ellipsie but if people are different then it's normal to respond to their preferences unless there's a strong reason not to.

What DD1 is doing is not unheard of. You are choosing to compare it to DD2's approach, which you personally prefer, but an alternative approach would be to say 'I parented my children the way I saw fit, and I respect my children's rights to make their own parenting choices, which may not be the same as each other'. Maybe you need space to think through how you feel about both your daughters and their choices to step away from your traditions.

(Respecting parental choice obviously doesn't apply if something is seriously wrong, unhealthy or harmful.)

Christmas is not a Christian festival.

https://www.history.co.uk/article/20-festive-facts-you-didnt-know-about-christmas

In some instances, due to what happens behind closed doors, people like your DD ( christian family now Muslim) feel they have to prove themselves. You might not see it but it could be happening.

I had a colleague who is devout Muslim, he has 4 children, although there is no religious aspect for them at Christmas, the children all have Christmas presents. Although I don't think Santa brings them.

It's quite simple really. I think you are making a big issue out of something small.

Either send the presents beforehand or if you really want to give the presents on Christmas day, allocate a time and let your daughter's know in advance. DD1 can either arrive late or go to the shops or for a walk with her child when you distribute gifts.

I really can't see why a Muslim who is happy to come to yours for a Christmas celebration would refuse a gift. Gift giving is highly commendable in the Muslim faith and is very big in the culture. It makes no sense religiously to refuse a gift. Maybe there's something deeper - perhaps she wants to see you as her mother respect her parental choices and respect her as a person, and not paint her as difficult, and the younger one as the easier child?

I doubt there are any Christians , apart from young children and those young in the faith, who don’t know that December 25th is not actually the day Christ was born. It’s the day chosen to celebrate his birth. Easter is hardly ever celebrated on the day Christ actually was crucified too.

This. You are coming across extremely biased against DD1. My guess is her defensiveness has a reason. It doesn't seem like you are on her side too - rather you are siding with her younger sister against her.

Don’t forget the holiday armadillo!!

You sound really thoughtful and kind and respectful of your family and their different religions.

Trust your instincts.

YABU.

You are massively overthinking. They're coming to your Christmas celebration, they'll just have to fit in. It's their kids get upset as they're excluding them from parts then that's their problem. 4yo understand they don't get presents on someone else's birthday and they'll get them for eid.

Also you could put small party favour on the table, goody bag for kids. That's pretty normal at formula events and not religious.

Why? She’s been asked to respect her daughters wishes, that works both ways.

Division is the ugliest thing about religion.

I thought that all faiths taught tolerance as one of their pillars.

with all due respect OP, your DD1 is not showing any grace for any of you.
I say this as someone who also has a DD1 who can be ‘prickly’ and at times can dictate situations.

But I feel that this would be a hill I’d personally be prepared to die on. She’s essentially disrespecting your beliefs and your traditions.

I feel a little sorry for your son in law who has obviously navigated these waters all of his life and managed to navigate them well. He’s a great role model for their children

Not in my experience. Non-faith schools in England and Wales make kids perform Christian acts (unless they are withdrawn from them by parents).

I would post gifts to the kids who can have presents. I.e. don't do a gift-giving thing on Christmas Day, but have it be about food and company.

I also don't think you need to worry too much about "this is what we believe" etc - just be you and let the parents handle those conversations, unless it comes up organically.😊

I think I wouldn't give any of the children presents on Christmas day. Bring them to their houses (obv depending on location) on Christmas Eve or Stephens Day. Or just send them home un opened in the boot of the parents car.

Ask DD1 what she has told her DC about why she will not get a present and follow that lead.

In general thought I would just hold it as a very special day that family gather to enjoy good food and each others company.

I am Catholic (more like you DS's) I will go to mass Christmas day but I can't say religion impacts the days celebrations much. It didn't in my very Catholic grandparents house either.

OP could you have a small "birthday present" you "forgot to give" on standby for your other GC?
Wrapped in birthday paper not Christmas?

That would solve GC feeling left out with new toys, means your DD1 shouldn't throw a wobbler and you can have dinner comfortably?

I would also say its your house so if you choose to drink then that's your choice. Your DD wanting to come is great but she also needs to realise that you have your religion too and hers doesn't trump because she argues.