DM has gone absolutely nuclear with me about moving away...

[YourWittyLion]

Throwaway account for obvious reasons when you read this.... also sorry in advance for the length of my post.. I'm trying not to miss details and hopefully get some none bias opinions!

Sooo where to begin!
My DH & I have been together for over 15 years and for 13 of these we've dreamed of moving down south!
We first discussed our plan with my parents 13 years ago and DM essentially guilted me out of it and made me feel terrible for even considering to leave them! (For the rest of this I'll mostly just refer to DM, as she is the main issue and my dad is a more of a bystander.)
We've revisited the idea in passing with them over the years and have been met with the same response or similar.

Anyway, fast forward to now, me and DH have 3 beautiful DS's. Life is good, but moving down south has become more and more appealing and we're now at a point that we have made a decision that we are going to do it next year... Essentially now or never, before our DS's get to old to want to move etc. We're all very excited about our plans! We have told a few very close friends and my DSis... everyone is understandably upset we're leaving, but overwhelming supportive of our plans!)

My DM admittedly has had a bit of a shit time of late. Her own mum passed away recently (complicated by a drawn out death over many months, a tricky relationship, family fallouts and my mum having childhood trauma from her abusive dad). Additionally my Dad has recently been referred due ro issues with his memory. Nothing formally diagnosed yet, but we're all fairly certain dementia may be the cause.

Me and DH made the decision about moving in late spring before all these issues were apparent. And because of this we haven't been able to tell my DM, in an attempt to try to protect her peace and give her time to process everything and also because we knew from previous responses that she wouldn't be happy about it etc.
Despite my dad's situation, he is aware of what's happening to him currently and has had multiple conversations about living the life I want and not to waste a day, as he has many regrets (not moving away being one of them). So i know that although my dad would be sad, he would be supportive of us following our dream.

Although really not ideal as my DM is still grieving and things with my dad are up in the air, we were forced to tell her about moving, because we're now at a point that we need to start making solid plans and taking steps to achieve the move and I didnt want my DM to be the last to know or to find out from someone else.
Well... we told them and my DM went nuclear!😪
She wanted to know who was going to look after dad when he got worse. I tried to explain that even if we stayed i couldn't offer the level of help she thinks I could. I'm self employed and reliant on my wage to cover our monthly expenses, so dropping work to look after my dad isn't financially possible and also my DS's who are all still very little are my priority.
She said something along the lines of "given the sacrifices she made" to bring me up .... essentially that I'm selfish.
She also threatened that she might as well kill herself and then stormed out of my house.

In all honesty I expected her to be angry and upset, but her response was so unhinged and bewildering I barely said anything and haven't since.

Since this happened she has sent a torrent of messages to my DB ranting and threatening that she & dad might as well kill themselves.
My DSis called them after they refused to reply to my distraught DB to check that they were ok given what she was messaging and DSis also got verbally abused, told that they might as well kill themselves and that she was done with us (presumably me and DSis as she challenged my DM on some of the things she was saying). It also really concerns me that shes using a threat of suicide to emotionally manipulate the situation and drawing my vulnerable dad into this way of thinking too! 💔

So this is now the point that we're at and I dont know what to do!

Just for added context, as i think its relavant, my DM has always been a tricky person (i don't know how else to describe this) and since being a mum myself and assessing my relationships with my mum, I've come to realisation that although she loves me, our relationship is mostly transactional in a sense that she doesnt really bother with me or my DS's unless she needs or wants something and we're not anywhere high on her list of priorities. A bitter pill to swallow, but something that I'm learning to accept.
I've done a lot of self exploring over the last few years to try to figure out if i'm the issue and to address my own shortcomings, but through this I've actually realised due to her upbringing, she is the perfect example of an emotionally immature parent- something she can't help or likely change.
I think in part this is the reason for the way she has responded, but its really difficult to take and I don't know where to go from here as I know I will never "win" or be "right" in her eyes.

Thanks for reading!

This was my thought, too. This does sound like it's an emotional manipulation tool, but erring on the side that its not, it sounds like the needs support with her own mental health. Wishing you all the best OP.

Like @LittleMidlander i too wonder what you mean by moving south?

are you already south but want to move to the coast? I can’t think of any other way you would potentially get more for your money and have a better quality of life

if you’re “up north” and moving down south, your house will be tiny and expensive

I say this as a confirmed southerner here, who would saw off her own limbs rather than move up north, but I wonder what your life will be like if you move. It needs to dramatically improve and not just by escaping your narc mother

(also in possession of ‘tricky’ parents myself 🤣)

It is surely the best thing for you and your kids to move away from her. If she threatens to harness herself call for help. We have a mental health crisis team here as well as the option to call 999.

You do not owe a parent anything for being brought up and provided for. They chose to bring you into the world for themselves.

You know you would never want your sons' lives and dreams curtailed for you when you are older.

I feel terrible for your dad, sister and brother but your siblings need to come to their own decisions about how to handle their relationship and contact with your Mum. This will make it more difficult for you all to support your dad but that is your Mum's doing not yours.

Your priority is the wellbeing of your own family and your own, not your parents.

Your mother sounds manipulative and immature and frankly it is a good idea to put some distance between you and her...

She’s a cracker, you lose work (and money) looking after your dad so she doesn’t have to!

Shes forced your hand really. If you stay now you will be at her beck and call until the day she dies. You’ll never be able to put your own children first.

You’re moving a few hundred miles away (assuming you mean the uk) not thousands. You might not be a day trip away but definitely a weekend visit a few times a year.

Im a southerner born and bred. I love it in the south, the weathers better. I’ve been known to moan about the drop in temperature at Oxford!

Can i ask what the draw of the south is? We are looking at swapping our very normal 4bed for a huge house with land up north…
But besides that, it’s your life to live as you see fit. Your DM will come round in time, it’s just she had a vision of how the future was going to be and you’ve swept it away. It’ll all be okay in 5 yrs, maybe 10! 😀

Talk to her about visits, it will be more quality time. She can visit and stay, I’m sure you and family will visit.
Dad might need nursing home care down the track.
I hope you enjoy your move and mum comes to accept it.

I agree with this. Op as someone who lived a four hour journey from my parents as their health declined (I had moved away long before it became a problem) who moved closer partly because of this, I think you do need to give some serious thought to how stressful it can get, for everyone, you included. That long drive on the motorway when a parent is ill, it’s really hard with young children in particular. It also means that the siblings who live closer have to take up all the slack which can understandably cause resentment.

I have been in a very similar situation to you and things I wished I had done that or am glad that I did do are as follows:

1.Stepmum kept using the threat of suicide as a way to manipulate me, until I stood up for myself. The manipulation worked many times and then one New Years Day when I was with my husbands family 250 miles away from her, she demanded I came to visit her as she was lonely (she had received many offers for NY, including from me and declined them all, so we made other plans) and used suicide as her bargaining card (again)! I had never reported these threats previously as I didn't want to waste social services or the 999 services time but when I was explaining to her GP how manipulative she was, they told me to ring and report it as a safeguarding issue when she did it again. So this NY, I rang social services and raised a safeguarding issue, they told me to ring 999 and the paramedics turned up. It was embarrassing for us both to be honest. I was initially made to feel like I had abandoned a lonely old woman and this was compounded by the fact I refused to attend for the Paramedics visit (well I couldn't, I was 250 miles away and do not drive). She told them she had no intention of committing suicide, she was just trying to get me to visit because she was lonely. So they left her at home, she was embarrassed, particularly as she had to explain to her neighbours when they came to check on her and she did not try that again for a long time. But it got her on social services radar that there were coping issues.

Its also important to note that my stepmum had a natural daughter, who she never wanted to bother as she was busy, it was always me she rang. But I worked full time too, did not drive (stepmum was 80 miles away from me) and what you need to read here is that I was easier to manipulate. You need to set boundaries and stick to them.

2. As hard and divisive as this may sound, when you talk to your Dad and he tells you to follow your dreams and why, record it and save it. You will need this to remind yourself that your Dad supported you. There were private conversations of a similar nature I had with my terminally ill father about how he wanted things to play out for me that were contrary to my step mums take on things, that my step mum and family disputed afterwards and whilst I knew what my Dad wanted for me and stood firm, I often wish I could listen to my Dad and "comfort " myself. Your parents raise you to have a life of your own, in an ideal world we all want to follow our dreams and your Dad clearly does but your Mum is clearly concerned and fixated on what happens in the future. But she wants to continue working? How old are your parents?

However, I do think you need to sit down with your siblings and discuss the future needs of your parents and how you can all support them, be it on the ground or at a distance. You have every right to follow your dreams, but have a care for the fact that the siblings who are local to your parents will bear the brunt of what sounds like a highly demanding Mother, and you need to be honest about that and offer what you can from afar.

Stick to your guns @YourWittyLion

I have a very transactional relationship with my mother and now in her 80s she is a bloody nightmare as she is so cantankerous. My father died and she played the grieving widow part to Oscar standard- they divorced over 20 years ago as my father felt trapped and unhappy.

You must focus on your own family and do what is best for them in the long run. Given you and your DH have had the southern move as a goal for sometime just crack on with it.

if you give in now it will be far worse for you in the future. You will end up being at her beck and call until she dies. My mother has driven people away with her over-inflated sense of entitlement ‘I gave birth and raised you’ so you have to do this or pay for this’. She has scared away family and friends over the past 5 years. The last set she was nasty to was the nephews ‘I helped look after you when small so you must take me out to pub restaurant for lunch/dinner every week’

Just move ….. before she grinds you down.

Go and don't look back!

Sounds like a good decision to move away from her manipulation

Down south? Australia or Surrey?
We left for other side of the world when the DC were very small. Inlaws were gutted but we didn't let it get in the way of our decision.

I don't know why pp are saying she's worried about caring for ops dad. She's been arguing against a move for 13 years, it's just given her something else to guilt op about.
It doesn't matter ops reasons for moving either she and her dh have wanted to do it for years so they've clearly considered it carefully and know it's what they want.
You need to do what's best for you and your family op. Your dm will either get over it or she won't.

You can't put your whole life on hold for other people. The time is almost never 'right' if you try to factor in everyone and everything. Your mum is manipulating you about something she already opposed anyway. Go, and don't regret anything except having a mum that doesn't wish to support you.

You've got to go. If you don't, your future is laid out for you - you'll be unpaid carer to your dad and at your mum's beck and call. It will be awful.

It's not your role to do this and your mother - clearly a giant narcissist - has no right to assume you'll be her servant.

Get away and don't look back.

Don't waste the time of over stretched emergency services to get a leg up in an argument with your mother. She's obviously wrong in her reactions and probably worried about the future but doing this is selfish to someone who may genuinely might need them.

I'm very grateful for everyone's opinions and experiences... I can appreciate both sides, so its very helpful! Thanks!

A few people have asked/ touched on some points that I haven't explained...

I holidayed in the south as a child, always
loved it and when I got with my now DH we
did the same. Its somewhere we've always
loved and been drawn too and dreamed of living there.
Its somewhere that we've always felt feels
right and we have always had a deep urge to move there. The area appeals to our loves, hobbies and life and how we
want our DS's the experience their childhood. Its a north to south move (4hour motorway drive). We're aware of living cost discrepancies and have carefully considered the good and bad and braced ourself that it might not work out. With a view that even if we go and hate it, we can move back. But we'd hate to live with the regret of never trying!

We have both always lived in the same area, and in all honesty there is nothing here, we
dont enjoy where we live, we actively try to
escape the area at any given opportunity. We essentially stay because its where we were brought up.

I didn't see or know it at the time... its only
now well into my adult life that I've had the
ability to see what my relationships are truly
like.
My DM was very controlling of me during my childhood, particularly in my teens years. I
think in her own weird way, she thought she was keeping me safe. But it really impacted my personality and how i
perceived myself and others. I was given
very little chance to learn who I was, have my own thoughts or develop my own
relationships /friendships. When I went to uni and became an adult, I think she realised
she didn't have the same grip on me, and she effectively lost all interest in me.

Since then, her interest in me and my life
seems to be closely linked to when she
needs something from me. Eg.
Her house sale hasn't gone through... we
house her for 6 weeks (twice this has
happened) but we barely have interaction
from her even though she's under our roof).

Her car has been blocked in after she has
finished a night shift. She hasn't seen or
spoken to me for 3 months , but is forced to message me for a lift home as shes 12 miles from home. I later realised I was the last
resort as my Dsis had said she couldn't do it.
She can go months weeks or months
without seeing us, speaking to us or even
asking after her DGS's. And when she does
see us there is always an air that she is annoyed by my DS's and very disinterested in them.
She doesnt treat my other DN's or DNef's like this. So it stings. Even my DS's have begun
to notice the difference and have voiced their upset about it, which makes me so sad for
them.
My Dsis in the past has mentioned the disparity to her
about how little she sees me & my DS's. She has made efforts to pop in when this has
been mentioned. But its short lived.
Whilst I think she loves my DS's, they aren't a priority on her list compared to other family.
She also has an unhealthy obsession that female children are better and os very vocal in front of us all, including her DGS's that she thinks girls are better, which again makes me so sad for them, as they will never stand a chance!

My DP's relationship has been toxic and
unhealthy for many decades in all honesty.
They should have divorced many years ago, but my DM has refused to divorce him due to it not being the done thing and her weird Catholic guilt/ morals (passed down from her own parents). Since me & my siblings have been adults we have repeatedly said they should divorce and they are both miserable in each other's company. But it has fallen on deaf ears.

My Df is a kind man and a good DF, but he has been worn down by her over the years and has never had an say.
My DM has also been very blatant in her
opinion that she only married my DF
because she was pregnant with me and due to Catholic shame. Therefore she sacrificed her life and wishes just to have me. I think in part this is also what
she means when she says shes "made
sacrifices". I was a mistake she didnt truly
want, it tied her to a man she didnt want to be with, her pregnancy with me caused alot of
Catholic shame from her own parents and I essentially catapulted her life
in a direction she regrets massively!

Comments mentioning that she is upset about losing her DH to dementia i don't think are necessarily the case. She unfortunately hates the man, resents staying with him. Over the years has been very nasty saying he never worked hard/ didnt have drive or make enough money and has actually verbalised that she is annoyed that he has "done this to her" (got dementia). She has no empathy for his situation, how he feels and honestly has no love or care for the man! He unfortunately is a hindrance to her and she resents him for it! She is open in voicing to this with him present. 😪
I honestly think she is only concerned about how the prospective diagnosis affects her!

do not hamstring your own life and that of your family for your DM.

where she lives is her choice, its not yours. full speed ahead, let her have her space and if she threatens suicide again send the ambulance.

she is an adult and suicide isn't a joke or hammer to bully your adult children into submission. It sounds like distance is the best thing for all of you.

@YourWittyLion You should have moved 13 years ago OP - don't delay any longer. A former acquaintance of mine sold up everything and bought a yacht to spend his later years sailing the world. However, he delayed his departure because his DM (also a very "tricky" character) had been living with cancer for seven years and he felt he shouldn't leave until she'd died (she made him feel that way of course). Long story short, out of the blue he was diagnosed with an aggressive cancer and died long before her, never fulfilling his dream when he'd been so close.
BTW, I LOVE @PrettyPickle 's suggestion to record and save a conversation with your Dad where he encourages you to make the move - it's a simple but incredibly thoughtful idea. 💜

Therefore she sacrificed her life and wishes just to have me.

What absolute tosh she spouts. If she didnt want you she shouldnt have had sex ffs, it isnt rocket science

And before anyone jumps on me to say "what about the man, you dont get pregnant alone", it doesnt seem like OP's dad is throwing this back at OP

You don't have to explain why you want to move. The answer is almost always 'for a better life' and that's all that matters.

She hasn't been scared for 13 years which is how long she's been manipulating op to not follow her dream. This is just another excuse for op
to do her bidding.

OMG @YourWittyLion move. Do it now. Do not set yourself on fire to keep her warm any longer. Freedom is right there if you're brave enough to grab onto it.

Speaking as someone who was also told by a parent that they weren't a wanted child.

From your OP, it was clear to those of us with experience what the dynamic was between you and your mother. I hope your most recent post helps anyone who advises being a good, kind, dutiful doormat daughter is the only right choice you can make.