To refuse to be a witness against colleague??

[Pukkajones]

Christmas party, a few nights ago. At a hotel, as it was timed with a big sales meeting, so everyone staying over, 200 ish people, free bar as well as a formal dinner.
Drinking very much encouraged. Staff ages ranged from early 20s to the senior staff in their 50s. Everyone VERY merry.
One colleague, let’s call her Jenny, got a bit carried away, throwing shapes on the dance floor, too touchy feely with men and women apparently then groped one older male colleagues testicles at which point friends grabbed hold of her and steered her off up stairs to her room.
She escaped. Came back down - paralytic at this point - and flashed her boobs at a senior male colleague! In the side bar area so fewer people around me being one of them. Another colleague and I intervened and friends got her again and put her to bed, this time someone stayed with her.

Now I’m being asked to come and tell what I saw to her line manager. I’m in training for an event at the moment so it’s common knowledge that I wasn’t drinking and was sober.

I really don’t want to. She’s lovely, usually quiet and sensible, the company got her poleaxed and now want to carpet her. I’m not a bloody snitch plus - why can’t the guy she flashed at say what happened. Why do I need to be involved???

I’ve been working away since the party so have no idea what is being said in office other than the OMG, Jenny! What was she doing??? Messages. But trust me, there’s plenty of stories from that night… so she’s in good company.

YABU - snitch on her. A man doing that would be in so much trouble.

YANBU - deny seeing anything. If the company ply everyone with that much booze there’s bound to be uncouth behaviour and they probably have enough witnesses already.

Thats disgusting your laws are so unequal and ignore male rape in such a manner. It's not something to ve proud of. Its shameful.

Oh god, get a grip. Male rape? What, the woman makes him have an erection?

Pipe down with your rubbish dear.

I once ran along the street in Blackpool when I was 21 at mates hen with my tits out (nobody died). At 46 would I willing take my top off dabs a beach? Massively not!

Would I cry a co either flashed their tits? No

A lot of countries recognize it...if anything, I think the UK might be the outlier in saying "its only rape if the forced penetration is with a penis".

But, ignoring that - yes - men can be "forced to penetrate"

https://wp.lancs.ac.uk/forced-to-penetrate-cases/

Rape by its very deifinition is penetration without consent, as the penis is seen as the weapon.

What fucking planet are you on. Seriously!

The OP only saw her flash her breasts.

Stop trying to measure male and female assault as somehow equal.

Men, traditionally and by their very physical make up are stronger that women and they overpower them. Rape is a violent crime, not a sexual one.

You have completed downgraded the effects of rape perpetrated by men.

What part of that do you fail to understand? I assume all of it evidently.

You do understand that legal definitions vary according to which country you're in, right? What planet is the PP on? Planet earth, clearly, and with enough intelligence to realise that the UK isn't the only country in the world.

Fair enough.

Flashing breasts at a party, still wrong and inappropriate. I have never done this. Partly because I don't drink anymore. I used to a bit, years ago, but didn't enjoy it.

Rape is a disgusting horrific act. What this woman did wasn't as bad. But still highly inappropriate. She should get a stern talking to from HR that any repeat of this behaviour. And it's not okay for a man to assault a woman, the same way it's not okay for a woman to assault a man.

When my DS has a girl slap his behind in a club he got told by many of his peers "that he should have enjoyed it". He didn't. And still reported her and got her kicked out.

@Betterbeanon

Is it the concept of "other countries" that you're struggling with?

Or is it the idea that they don't all follow the UK's laws?

Again - many countries (as best I can tell, most countries) don't limit the offense of "rape" to only where the penetration was by penis.

Clearly, common sense is lost on you, and the law as it stands.

What does me knowing that different countries define rape differently have to do with my "common sense"?

If you're going to continue being persistently rude and and sneering towards other posters, maybe consider picking up a book from time to time. That way, you might embarrass yourself less often.

You really are grasping at straws. And you attempting to define rape completely downgrades the actual act of rape committed by men against women.

Go back to doing your dishes dear.

Ignorant, aggressive, semi-literate and misogynistic? Wow, what a prize...

When did I "attempt to define rape"?

Far from ignorant. I just choose not to engage with those who have little to nothing to offer an intelligent debate.

I haven't even been debating with you.

You were a bit rude to another poster, obviously not from the UK, who expressed surprise that "rape" can only be committed by men under UK law.

I politely explained that other countries define it in different ways, and you've been frothing and windmilling ever since.

Well this took a turn

I am disinterested in other countries' laws, whereby a lot of them already would have women's rights eroded.

I am commenting on the location of where the incident happened that the OP has posted about.

It is a grasping at straws attempt to draw in other countries' laws to try and measure male and female assault as being somehow on an equal footing. Most people are fully aware that men are stronger than women, especially the men who set out to rape.

Saudi Arabia has laws, in which they stone people to death, whereas the UK doesn't. The States implement the Death Penalty, whereby the UK/EU don't. And so what.

If somebody posted from Dubai that their country view male rape as a worst crime than female rape, I would likewise be disinterested in their take on things.

Civillised countries recognise that men violently rape women and the impact of that is nothing compared to a drunk woman exposing her breasts, which are not weapons.

Absolutely - well said.

This has to be a joke. Did you completely skip sex ed? An erection is a completely involuntary physical reaction, it has no bearing on whether he welcomes the physical contact or not.

I don’t think it’s worth you trying to over analyse this OP. You don’t have to go out of your way to report her (which I absolutely would say to do if the genders were reversed- and maybe that’s unfair but fundamentally a woman lifting her top to show her bra does not carry with it the same implied threat as an man exposing his penis). And you don’t have to feed into any gossip about her. But if called in and asked direct questions, just answer them factually. What then happens is down to company policy- it’s not on you to try and manage that. Hopefully she’ll just get a warning and it will teach her she can’t just say get legless at a Christmas party- she’s an adult and does has responsibility not to drink so much if that’s what happens when she does!

What the women didn't isn't as bad as rape. But it's still bad. Flashing a bra isn't appropriate. A one off mistake she should apologise for.

Groping men. Not okay. My son reported a girl and got her kicked out for slapping his behind.

Please stop spreading harmful myths about rape.

Erections in men and lubrication in women are involuntary physiological responses. They can occur in situations of fear, coercion, or trauma, and they do not require psychological arousal or desire.

Psychological factors can influence physical arousal in consensual situations, but they do not reliably override the body’s reflexive responses.

Women can (and many do) experience lubrication during non‑consensual sexual contact, as men similarly can with erections. Those responses are automatic bodily reactions, not indicators of willingness.

An involuntary physical response does not indicate consent.

I think we can all agree. What Op saw the woman do was a drunken mistake. She should apologise for what she did and not do it again. Touching up and groping someone when drunk is also not okay, from both sides.