To tell my sister I don’t want to see her anymore if she doesn’t discipline my nephew for biting me?

[IGrewUpInTheFallOut]

My sister is a single mum to two children - my nephew, who is 14, and my niece, who is 13. My nephew has autism and her husband left when he realised how tough things would be.

I’ve just got back from a weekend of babysitting for her which has been a bit of a nightmare. My nephew used to be quite violent and angry, but my sister put him into kickboxing when he was 7 and he’s flourished, and it has really helped him regulate himself.

When I arrived yesterday, she warned me that he was quite overstimulated and that I just needed to follow the basic routine (get him to bed at a reasonable hour). I left him to his own devices until I went into his room at about 10:30 and asked him to put his iPad down and go to sleep.

He immediately grabbed hold of me and bit my arm, it must have been about twenty seconds before he let go. He was screaming at me to leave his room by that point, so I did, and went downstairs. I told my sister when she got home today, and she said she would have a word with him.

I’ve just got home and seen how bad it is (I’ve attached a picture). I sent it to her and asked how she had dealt with it and she said she asked him, but he said he felt overwhelmed and didn’t want to go to sleep, so he lashed out. She says that in her mind, that’s the end of it and she won’t be pushing it further as he can’t help feeling overwhelmed.

I’ve said in that instance I don’t feel comfortable being around him again and I won’t attend family Christmas. Now she and my mum are telling me that I’m selfish and I will ruin the Christmas period for everyone if I don’t come.

AIBU to draw this line in the sand?

So you left him to his own devices and at 10.30 expected him to just stop what he was doing, with no warning and go to bed?

Whilst he shouldn't have bitten you, you were warned he was dysregulated so I'm not sure you handled it in the best way

Maybe discuss with your sister how to proceed in the future?

Or maybe the sister should have explained what to do before going out and leaving the OP with a son who has a propensity to violence?

I asked him what he wanted to do. Me and my niece settled down to watch wicked and I asked him (multiple times) if he wanted to join us. He said no, he wanted to sit in his room on his iPad. I said okay, I’d come and see him before bed. When I went to see him, I knocked, I chatted with him and then said that it was bedtime. I didn’t take it off him at any point.

At 10.30 he had no warning he should go to bed? He can read a clock, he knew full well it was bedtime!

Fair enough. Odd to ask the aibu question, then, if you're going to argue about it when people say you are.

Some really unkind responses here, what is wrong with this place? Just click on 'see all' to get the full picture before laying into posters, or is that too much effort?
You were bitten by a 14 year old who, reading all your posts, seems to be perfectly able to regulate himself. This is demonstrated by the fact that the bite wasn't worse! He's also being taught kickboxing, which would make me worry about what he might do on another occasion.
I agree that you shouldn't demand punishment, and you've already decided that. Personally, I would not want to be alone with him again. Babysitting would be out. I wouldn't even discuss this attack any more, just be ready if your sister asks you to sit again and be firm in saying no. Family Christmas maybe not, I'd go to that and not make any drama about it. However, if he were to get violent there I'd pack up my stuff and go home. Leave sister to it.

What is she being unreasonable about?

Please stop defending yourself to these nasty, bullying midwits.

Everyone - and I do mean absolutely everyone - knows you did nothing at all to deserve being assaulted, let alone bitten by anyone.

They don't care about the right thing, they have to find a way to excuse the inexcusable and blame you, due to something amiss in them, or in their lives.

I hope you are feeling a bit better, and do stay away from the male who is stronger than you and assaulted you in such a horrible way, and his apologists who don't care how you feel, if that is your choice.

I'm horrified by some of the responses on this thread, and struggling to understand them. I've read some OPs recently lamenting how unsupportive (to put it mildly) some posters are nowadays, but hadn't really seen it before this.

MN only works by taking OPs at face value. We all know there could be exaggeration, even lies, but in the absence of any really big tells, you just respond to what you see. And there's nothing here I've read that suggests OP isn't telling the truth as she experienced it.

Based on that, we have: very high-functioning (mainstream school, long-term martial art training) boy, larger & substantially stronger, sustained physical attack, mother with no intention to impose a consequence.

To read posts like some of those above in this context is mind-blowing.

OP, I think there are a few things going on here, maybe? Some tiger mothers. Increased awareness of autism alongside substantial misunderstanding of it, particular as a spectrum from low- to high- functioning. Soft parenting trends. Inbuilt misogyny. Strong feelings around Christmas (and people's own experiences of disrupted family Xmas). Plus some people just out for a fight or power trip. It's a perfect storm. Then, with all of the above going on, you also have some well-meaning posters skimming a long thread and not reading closely, and/or jumping on the attack bandwagon. Social media at its very best.

Based on what you wrote, this isn't you, and you should put yourself first. But I think putting yourself first here actually includes thinking very seriously about whether you want to "cancel" Christmas. What will you get from this in the long-term? Would it be better to go, rather than risk creating (undeserved) bad feeling that will hurt you more in the future?

Go, and you have the unambiguous moral highground whichever way anyone looks at it, making setting future terms and conditions re. your nephew much easier, and future family gatherings with it.

Maybe set some T&Cs that are in your control, discretely, with the other adults eg. you won't be alone with the nephew, if you feel uncomfortable you'll quietly go for a walk etc.

OP is NBU

You said that it’s ableist to insist that the fact/ reality that this child is autistic is entirely irrelevant to the situation.

@Thatsalineallright responded that It is in fact irrelevant whether OP’s attacker had autism or not, OP is still entitled to feel shocked and upset and that Yes, when it comes to potential punishments for the nephew, him being autistic is very relevant and should be taken into account.

You ignored her full post and quoted her as saying ‘It is in fact irrelevant whether her attacker had autism or not’.

How can you not see that you cynically misrepresented what she said?

It's not reasonable at all. How do you know what is "apparent to everyone"?
Speaking for myself (as one always should) it's certainly not "apparent" to me, i disagree with your interpretations entirely.

For Goodness’ sake, it’s apparent because your selective quoting is up there for everyone to see!

You’re basically saying we should ignore what you’re doing.

Accurate quoting is your friend, puppy!

Your safety and wellbeing is important and is valued.

I don't know the child in question but with some neurodivergent children, there is absolutely no point "punishing" the unacceptable behaviour because they don't have the capacity to make rational decisions when they are in the midst of whatever overwhelming circumstances caused them to lash out.

You have every right to keep yourself safe, you have every right to refuse to babysit again because you don't want to be bitten and your sister can't guarantee that won't happen again.

You are being unreasonable to therefore refuse to join the family Christmas. You go, you celebrate, you spend time with your family, you make sure that you are never in a situation where you are the only responsible adult around the child who might hurt you.

I’m not sure why it would take 24 hours for you to get a chance to look at your arm. It’s always there isn’t it 😂

Not getting at you, just confused!

OP.

Stop justifying yourself. Two thirds of posters agree with you.

A good proportion of those who disagree, who think you are unreasonable, will be a mixture of: men, shit stirrers, contrarians, those who always get the wrong end of the stick and a few who are genuinely misguided. They all sing one or two variations of the same tune:

He has an excuse for this and should not be blamed

or

You wound him up, didn't handle him correctly

Don't engage with them, let them be below your notice.

You are only the latest in a long line of women who have suffered male violence through the ages, who then found themselves being asked to look carefully to see if they encouraged the violence or ask themselves if they are exaggerating their injuries.

Stay away from your sister and your mum. They are not your friends. have Christmas with your DP and well done for taking your safety seriously.

It sounds like he needs both of those to self regulate; taking them away won’t help him.

You can’t discipline a ND child in the same way as a NT child.

Why would she want to spend time with her family when they've been horrible to her? Her sister and mum have dismissed her feelings, called her selfish for not wanting to babysit again, and in general have shown her zero consideration. Why spend Xmas with people like that when she could spend it with her partner instead?

What would you do then?

I'd add to my list of what's going on above, in the light of PP, strong feelings around the word "punishment" (soft parenting, increased recognition of neurodivergence) and there being a big difference between that and "consequences".

"Punishment" and "consequence" can be used synonymously, and maybe the latter's more appropriate here - I sincerely hope that PPs saying there's no point in "punishment" at least accept the need for "consequences".

This teen is four years from adulthood, and, from what OP's written about him, most certainly not one who will be living in care his whole life. He's moving towards some kind of job and (probably) full legal accountability, in a context of regular, unsupervised contact with an infinity of unpredictably behaved strangers - including women and children far weaker than him, and males far stronger.

If your sister wants to do what's best for him, that means maximising his ability to function in society. This is to protect not just others but him himself from the punishments/consequences he'll face for not doing this (from ostracisation to violence to the law) in just a few years time.

Comments like "there's no point" (in by implication taking any action as a result of this, from the myriad of interventions the sister could make) frighten me more than his behaviour. And I recognise it's this attitude, and its potential consequences, that's frightening you, OP - particularly in this hurtful, personal context.

Look I'm a mom with kids with autism so I know the drill.
He shouldn't be on an ipad until right before he's due to go to sleep. That should have been taken off him a bit earlier.
What should have been done was he got a countdown. He should have been told at 9:30 - ok you have one more hr on the ipad ok? At 10 I would have said you have 30 mins left on the ipad is that ok? And at 10:30 I would have said ok your time is up on the ipad, is that ok? I would give amble warnings and make sure I have agreement from them all the way through.
You are not going to win a physical or verbal argument with a 14yr old of any sex so you need their agreement and compliance for anything you are doing. If they refuse or react badly then any repercussions may need to be down the line when they have calmed down enough to take it in and accept the situation.

I do not think it's ok he bit you and if you do not want to babysit again then that is completely understandable.
I think refusing to join them for Christmas is over the top.
Your sisters life is pretty hard let me tell you. She needs family support.

It does not really sound like you are afraid of her son but more that you are not happy with her parenting and that is a separate issue.
Boycotting family Christmas is not the correct mature response here in my opinion. Feel free to tell her you are not happy to babysit or be alone with him again but bringing the entire family into this argument is uncalled for and that is essentially what you are doing.

I can't believe sone of the posts on this thread, there are a lot of nasty people on here.
I don't blame you for feeling shaken and scared. You are entirely justified in distancing yourself from this violent child.
Go and enjoy Christmas with your partner.

Its pointless to punish autistic child next day etc they have moved on from that event, they often lack feeling of empathy if it hurt you and remorse,dont see it as an issue.

imo continue as usual with family events but dont do babysitting,to avoid future issues and bad feelings

What do you do if after countdowns the child says at 10:30 its not ok for ipad time to end and has a meltdown?

I was thinking this; what happens if the child does not agree when you repeatedly ask them if this is ok?

Take their iPad off them, and deal with the meltdown.

I also don’t ask our son if it’s okay that he comes off his iPad, because he just is, if he’s told to.

But that’s the job of their parent, not a babysitter.

I’d expect someone who shouldn’t be facing that risk to leave him on his iPad, rather than face the consequences of his behaviour.

Well I understand why you're upset @IGrewUpInTheFallOut , you travelled for 5 hours to do your DSis a favour, her DS bit you and now your DSis hasn't apologised and is angry because you refuse to babysit in future. Unless your DSis has schooled you in his meltdown triggers and you ignored that I can see why you now feel unsafe, as her DS gets older and stronger another time he could hurt you more badly.
Your DSis accepts your DM won't babysit for fear of being hurt, why is that acceptable but you're getting flack for saying the same