To think my friend was racist, rude or both?

[RicottaOtter]

I was talking to a friend this morning. This friend is very concerned about excessive immigration to the UK, and plans to vote reform at the next general election because she believes only reform have the guts to tackle the problem properly. I was listening and not saying anything when this friend suddenly said, ‘Don’t worry - you’ll be okay, because of your husband, and you’re a mother to English children…’

I was gobsmacked at first - then realised she was talking about my ethnicity (one quarter English/one quarter white South African but originally English/half East European Jewish). I’ve lived in England my entire life and as far as I’m concerned I’m as English as this friend who was talking to me - whatever my ancestry might be.

Now, remember, this friend was (I think?) trying to be nice and reassuring (‘Don’t worry, you’ll* be okay’) - but I felt quite horrified and angry to have this said to me - am I being unreasonable?

She couold be racist or someone who has lapped up populist crap.

Reform can promise the moon on a stick and say what they like to programme people into hating a perceived out-group instead of those genuinely responsible for the state of the country, because they are not in government and don't have to deliver. It would be a different story if they did gain power and reality trumped ideology. There was a Reform run council that promised to cut council tax by cutting waste within the council. When they got in, they found out there was very little waste to cut, so they couldn't go through with their tax cut. Reality >> populism.

That was your choice. But I am sure you can see why others would have hard time doimg that. Whether emotional or practical reasons.
If I had to give up mine, I wouldn't get UK one.

IRL was supposed to be exactly what it said on a tin. Old IRLs should be upheld. It has literally the world indefinite in it. New system could be 10 year visa or something.

For anyone with EUSS to get rid of that one, they would have to dismantle EU withdrawal agreement if I remember correctly, and I don't think anyone is that mental considering legislation is still being changed in places post brexit because it was such a mega undertaking.

I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt up until now, but there is no possible way any of your responses are in good faith 😖. Really???

You just googled this , like now 😳. For someone who has claimed to have become a citizen along with your family, you seem very sure and reassured ,almost like you never paid attention to the history lessons from Europe 1930's about people that were actually born in Germany going back generations.

I hope I am just being paranoid and I honestly to dog 🙏 wish you no ill will but, I can't take your reassurances seriously - no offence 😘.

How could you be friends with someone like that? Grim.

Oh, you "googled" it.

I also "googled" it. The very first link was to the Pro Publica site (an invesigative, nfp jpurnalism site). The US government doesn't actually track how many citizens are held at any one time in immigration raids so Pro Publica did its own research and estimates - through searching a range of written records from different states - that Jan-Sept 2025, at least 170 US citizens were detained by ICE, including 20 children. 50 of these arrests were because ICE "believed" the arrestees did not have citizenship. There was clear evidence of racial profiling. Many of the arrests involved violence by ICE agents, including against pregnant women and elderly men. Many of the arrestees were susequently released without any charges.

But yeah, go ahead and make the argument that "only people who fraudulently obtained citizenship" including children are arrested.

You said, "he's only going after people who obtained their citizenship fraudulently".

Mass general sweeps, racial profiling and violence used against individuals randomly picked up indicate that this is not the case. Among those arrested there might be individuals who "obtained citizenship fraudulently". But there might not. Who's to know when you use colour and appearance as the basis for arrest.

What does "obtaining citiizenship fraudulently" even mean?

And a tip - Gen AI is only a reflection of the source information used to power it. It may tell you something - it doesn't mean that something is true.

GenAI!

🤦🏻‍♀️

That's interesting, What makes a nationality?

If both my parents were white Irish and I was born in Africa as they were passing through for work, would I be African?

What about if they settled there and that was where I was brought up, would that make me African?

Would my white Irish parents refer to me as African?

Would I be happy to call myself African if I my parents impressed upon me that I was Irish and brought me up in that culture?

Would other Africans accept me as being just as African as them?

I don't think that one's nationality is just as simple as being the place where you first opened your eyes if you have no other connection to the place.

My brother and I were born to Irish parents in England and we were always told we were Irish. When my brother, aged 23, wrote on his Facebook profile that he was, "English and proud of it", it caused one unholy row.

@OneBookTooMany

Ha ha I get this as it was the same with the Polish community too.

However, I do also feel very British, especially in terms of humour, literature etc and would be a fish out of water in Poland.

I think it's perfectly possible to be happy enjoying the best of both (or more) worlds.

For a very good friend, I would spend a bit of effort trying to explain how our country's issues are caused, and why the billionaires and right wing media want people to think that it's really immigration.
Otherwise, a friend telling me they're going to vote for Reform, is no longer a friend of mine. Full stop. Ditto for those hanging England flags/union jacks over their houses, outside of sporting events/coronations.

Agreed. Your own person culture can be a mix of any number of strands I reckon. Why do we care what anyone is/identifies as anyway? If they live here having obtained legal right to do so that should be enough. And for those who are trying to get legal right to live here too, up until the point their application fails.
I don’t give a stuff how ‘British’ someone is to be honest. It’s a matter of chance where you are born and who too.

“African” is not a nationality as Africa is not a country.

If you were born in Zambia, South Africa, Cameroon etc absolutely it would be correct to say you were South African, Zambian, Cameroonian etc. (unless your parents were literally passing through maybe not - although in the USA simply being born there would make you American.)

I am surprised at that, @JHound as the Action for Race Equality webpage refers to those of African descent. Maybe you should get in touch and inform them that there is no such thing.

As to your other point-you're wrong!

It's not reffering to nationality though as you did so the pp is correct really about the use of African. Asian also isn't nationality, nor is European.

Given the leader of Reform is one of those I'm not sure how that's true.
Racism and white supremacy seems to have been normalised in the UK atm. It's all quite unpleasant.

Read this and see if it changes your view.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2025/nov/18/deeply-shocking-nigel-farage-faces-fresh-claims-of-racism-and-antisemitism-at-school

This is how it starts....

Imagine how she talks about you to other people. Oh, Ricotta's not like other immigrants. Ricottas not too bad, considering she's (insert nationality). And everyone's personal favourite. I can't be racist, as I'm Ricotta's friend.