Husband constant white lies, what to do?

[Teanandtoast]

My husband has a history of telling lies. These have ranged from saying he drives to saying he'd been to new Zealand when he hadn't to more recently tiny white lies which are seemingly pointless. Other than this, we are happy and get on well. We have 3 kids and are about to move house.

Yesterday i had a cup of tea, and asked where he's put the biscuits. (We'd had a pack in the car) He said I ate one, but the other was smashed and I had to bin it. I could tell it was a lie, so asked multiple times about it, and after a while he said yeah I ate them both.

We were driving, and his driving was erratic and fast, in a 30 the '30' light flashed on, and I said what speed are you doing? He said 36, it 100% wasn't it was faster, I asked him and I said I know you're not telling the truth, I then said I could see the speed, he said. Yeah it was 38.

He will say something to kids eg I'll ask mum to text them, and I said no you can text, then it's I didn't say that etc and he'll lie about what he's said to the kids. So we end up arguing as I'm trying to work out what the hell is going on.

These seem like small little lies, but it's constant the 3 examples I've provided were the 3 I worked out were lies just yesterday.

we've been together 14 years. I am absolutely sick of it. I don't get it. I don't understand why can't just say the truth rather than a half truth.

I feel like he gaslights me about it as he will say things like, why are you even asking? Or why would I lie about something like that? Etc then eventually say yes I lied. We've done couples counselling years ago. I feel like I'm going crazy as I can't trust the simplest thing that he says. I don't know what to do.
Has anyone got any advice or been through anything like this before? Help please!! ❤️

The workplace often has really clear codes of conduct which make it easy to know what to expect. Fewer opportunities to get told off for eating someone else’s biscuit. Depending on the workplace of course.

I did a hobby with someone who did this. Just constant lies about anything and everything from the extremely trivial to the gigantic life events. It was absolutely bizarre, we all knew, and I think she actually knew we knew as well, which made it weirder. It was like a compulsion.
She put herself across as an extremely confident and outgoing person, but underneath she was definitely insecure and had really low self esteem. She was desperate to be liked, but also to be "above" everyone else and never wrong. In the end, we all used to just take everything she said as a probable lie and nod along.
I'd find it unbearable to be in a relationship with someone like that. You just can't have any trust.

Sounds exhausting and he won’t change.

I really sympathise with you OP, and in your position I would be making plans to leave. I used to have a lodger like this, and it was absolutely infuriating. They'd lie about things they knew perfectly well I could easily find out the truth of, constantly and without conscience. By the time we parted company, I no longer believed a word they said, about anything but I couldn't tell from their demeanour when they were lying. I think they were some sort of low-level fantasist, but what annoyed me most was the contempt for me: people like this really think you'll believe their crap.

You have three high needs ND children.

So it's highly likely he's ND, as it's genetic.

Are you, too?

Have there been any investigations / help there? Not for the kids; for you both?

That needs looking at.

---

His behaviour is yours, too - you're both stuck in a destructive cycle.

You ask something.

He has a knee jerk learned response to fear - 'alert - we're under scrutiny. If I tell the truth I'll somehow get in trouble. Panic, quick - what will be the safest way for me to answer? Say that!'

= He lies.

Experience has told you he's likely to be lying, so you probe, investigate and interrogate.

He doubles down in panic, knowing it's going to get worse.

Your frustration with being lied to and taken for an idiot manifests in anger and confrontation with the evidence.

He buggers off for a few days because his ability to hold an adult / adult conversation is undeveloped. Fight or flight has kicked in, and he choses flight.

What was his childhood like? What were his parents like? Do you know them? Does he talk about them?

You both need help.

This would drive me crazy. I think it would most probably put me on high alert in all my interactions with him waiting for the lie to pop out. It messes with you emotionally because you are the one getting wound up and emotional and he can appear all reasonable and rationale while you know he's not.

Do you think it is a defensive mechanism? He feels under attack (not saying he is!) and has this knee jerk reaction in the form of a lie. My DH used to have an annoying habit of being defensive over the smallest thing. Rather than saying - sorry I forgot to pick up X from dance. I'd get a long reason why he didn't/ couldn't, basically justifying himself. Not a lie, but trying to put himself in the right. Drove me nuts. He did recognise it though and just said let me know when I'm doing it.

If your DH recognises it as a problem and will try and fix it, I think you are okay. If not this is going to drive you more and more crazy. Don't feel bad for feeling bad about it. This is him not you.

We were driving, and his driving was erratic and fast, in a 30 the '30' light flashed on, and I said what speed are you doing? He said 36, it 100% wasn't it was faster, I asked him and I said I know you're not telling the truth, I then said I could see the speed, he said. Yeah it was 38.

In our car both of those statements could be true. The speedometer might read 38 mph but the actual speed would be a few mph lower. That's been the case in every car I've driven. I know that's a minor point in the grand scheme of things but it's a questionable example.

I had the kind of childhood where I had to be perfect at all times. If I wasn't I was punished. As an example 97 percent in an exam was rubbish and being size 8 at 5'8 and 17 was fat. White lies were a safety mechanism allowing me to navigate my mother's moods/whims and temper and my father's facilitation of them. In my late teens/early adulthood I assumed no one would want to be my friend if they knew me as I was fat, stupid, ugly and worthless so I'd lie to avoid conflict. As an adult in a stable relationship who has had therapy, I no longer lie about about anything and haven't since my early 20s because I feel safe, secure and loved for who I am.

Everyone I've ever met who tells white lies turned out to have had a similar childhood and understanding it, is the key to fixing it.

I want to reassure you that none of your friends will think you are crazy for breaking up with a liar. Honesty and respect are the two most important qualities in a marriage and he doesn’t have either of them.

I remember a friend telling me she was separating due to: ‘constant lies. I can’t trust a single word that comes out of his mouth’. Nobody questioned why she broke up with him!

My husband has a bit of this but we sorted it out earlier on - it’s a defensive thing for him, and as time went on I realized his mum was/is abusive and a huge liar. So like a PP said it helps if I reword things so there is no pressure or fear. That reminds him I’m safe. I don’t do it all the time but enough that he doesn’t live in fight flight or lie.

edit to say that because it’s been so long and 4 separations this is probably not enough and I think divorce if I were you

I think you would both benefit from some therapy. Because it sounds like he's developed a habit where his go to response to conflict with you is to lie. There's a bunch of stuff that needs unpicking there. Why does he feel the need to 'get out of trouble' by lying rather than be honest and assertive with you? What's happened in his past or is happening now that makes him risk even bigger problems (being found out to be a liar) just to avoid your minor displeasure in the moment? He needs to understand his feelings about being 'in trouble' with you, and why that feels so uncomfortable he avoids it with a lie. I think you both need to be there, because you need to understand what's going on with the whole dynamic between you.

OP I too know what this is like because my ex did it - it’s exhausting. I agree with PPs it’s some kind of habitual behaviour to avoid being in the wrong or “getting into trouble” and can also be to impress, which my ex also did and he would ridiculously embellish and exaggerate his achievements, namedrop famous people he “knew” (i.e. had met once) etc.

It’s OK to be understanding about the causes but I also realised that it was quite narcissistic as it was all about him and making himself feel better/OK. He just didn’t seem to grasp that being lied to was making me unable to trust anything he said and feel disrespected and frustrated, as well as the constant lies, and then untangling and arguing about them, made life difficult in itself. He’d also gaslight me that he hadn’t lied and we’d go round in circles with me getting more and more outraged at the blatant bullshit he was spotting. Then he’d play the victim because I’d shouted, which made it all my fault and he could convince himself he wasn’t the problem - so even the arguments served his purposes and he had no motivation to change.

There were other problems too but the lying was the hardest to handle. Ultimately I told him I was over it and if he lied to me again we were done. He lied again that evening - again about something tiny and inconsequential that would’ve have been a problem anyway - and that told me all I needed to know.

not saying it can’t be fixed, maybe it can but he’d have to actually understand he’s doing it and care about the impact on people around him. I’m much happier separated from mine (10 years on) - I can’t say what’s right for you but I do want to say I know what it does to you, it’s absolutely horrible and don’t underestimate the stress it’s causing you. It’s not just about how big or small the lies are, but the fact that it means you can never just interact honestly so it makes all communication exhausting and infuriating. Sending you a hug and these

I didn’t say that she needs to fix it - I just said that I suspect it’s related to his childhood.

I’d go mental because I hate liars.

@Teanandtoast wrote "I also think what hell on earth it would be to coparent with him".

I assume that by "coparent" she meant "bring up the kids while not living together".

However, I am guessing that @greengreyblue took it to mean "become parents of a child together".

Use his money and ignore the bustard in the bedroom.

One of my two husbands was like that. A little spinny-tales coward, trying to get what I can give without seeing that I'm owed honesty....

If you have own money, get rid. Lying means he despises you and can't make a simple effort to his wife

Read about lying. It's criminal in some cases, could it he cheats as well

I despair of men

Me too. I'd gave nuclear storm to one , he cried on the floor begging to stay. Pretend cry also. Got rid of.

Oh and I have a teenager with quite severe adhd, and she doesn’t do this. She might lie sometimes in a more normal teenage way but not the constant gaslighting/denial about everything. It’s not necessarily anything to do with ND.

I have no advice OP but I empathise. I married a liar. I knew he exaggerated stuff but I had no idea of the extent of it until two years ago.
We are separated but because of circumstances that I wont go into, I'm stuck with him for a few years longer.
Its like he can't help himself. Sometimes he lies to get me off his case. Sometimes I guess for sympathy. Sometimes to make himself look more interesting. Sometimes its pointless lies that I can't grasp - why bother? I found out he had told a huge huge lie, a really serious lie, to his work colleagues shortly before he went off sick.
He told me when we first met that he had a heart condition. I spent extra money on travel insurance for two decades to cover it. It was a lie. I only found this out after he was hospitalised for something else and I asked the consultant if it would affect his current condition. Which of course was non-existent.
I cant believe I was so clueless, but I'm pretty much an open book so it never occurred to me before the big lies were revealed, that he's just been feeding me bullshit for 22 years.

My ex husband was terrible for this, the lies were always things that didn't even matter but he would double down and never admit that he was lying even when caught out. Looking back he would tell me one thing and other people another to turn people against each other to keep us separate, just so he had an easy life. For example he told his new wife that I walked out and took his kids which was the opposite of what happened, and he told me that despite the 6 month agreement we had in place for introducing a new partner he had rushed into it with her because she kept mithering him to meet our kids. Turns out that was also a lie ans he happily introduced them within a week or two.

My first thought is does your partner have ADHD/ASD. The lies sound like a trait. Or maybe something deeper that's happened in childhood.

I can't believe you even married him

Yes when I left my ex I couldn’t even face most of our mutual friends because I knew he would be spinning them a story that made him look innocent and the victim. And if I’d said what really happened I’d have looked petty and like I’d left someone for saying he had done the hoovering when he hadn’t, or examples like the biscuit or the car speed, that don’t in themselves matter. Because it’s not the actual things, it’s the damage it does to your relationship but my ex would act like I was such an unreasonable cow for being upset by it.

I wondered this, and again not excusing the lying but all of your examples @Teanandtoast of your husbands recent lies seem that they could come from a place of defensiveness over being chastised. And that’s not to say you would tell him off but you may have fallen into a life where you have a parent/child situation and his first thought is to defend which is ultimately the lie, rather than tell the truth and risk what he may perceive as being ‘told off’.

My concern would be that your children turn out the same.