Husband constant white lies, what to do?

[Teanandtoast]

My husband has a history of telling lies. These have ranged from saying he drives to saying he'd been to new Zealand when he hadn't to more recently tiny white lies which are seemingly pointless. Other than this, we are happy and get on well. We have 3 kids and are about to move house.

Yesterday i had a cup of tea, and asked where he's put the biscuits. (We'd had a pack in the car) He said I ate one, but the other was smashed and I had to bin it. I could tell it was a lie, so asked multiple times about it, and after a while he said yeah I ate them both.

We were driving, and his driving was erratic and fast, in a 30 the '30' light flashed on, and I said what speed are you doing? He said 36, it 100% wasn't it was faster, I asked him and I said I know you're not telling the truth, I then said I could see the speed, he said. Yeah it was 38.

He will say something to kids eg I'll ask mum to text them, and I said no you can text, then it's I didn't say that etc and he'll lie about what he's said to the kids. So we end up arguing as I'm trying to work out what the hell is going on.

These seem like small little lies, but it's constant the 3 examples I've provided were the 3 I worked out were lies just yesterday.

we've been together 14 years. I am absolutely sick of it. I don't get it. I don't understand why can't just say the truth rather than a half truth.

I feel like he gaslights me about it as he will say things like, why are you even asking? Or why would I lie about something like that? Etc then eventually say yes I lied. We've done couples counselling years ago. I feel like I'm going crazy as I can't trust the simplest thing that he says. I don't know what to do.
Has anyone got any advice or been through anything like this before? Help please!! ❤️

I was in a relationship with someone like this. You feel like you're going mad and because it's a 'little' lie, you're made to feel like youre making a fuss over nothing.
The thing is a person who will lie over pointless things will lie over big ones too.
Basic trust is the cornerstone of a relationship. If its not there, you're always on the backfoot waiting for the next thing to come out.
It messed me up for years and destroyed my self esteem because I got into a place where I could not longer trust my own judgement on anything.
I had to have a lot of therapy to be able to trust myself and others again.
OP, I rarely give LTB advice on here but you're already questioning yourself. This kind of relationship can do long lasting psychological damage. I can't think of any man who is worth it.

Have you considered if he's a pathological liar? What Is Pathological Lying, and Can It Be Treated? https://share.google/VUdcS2No5Z6DNe0tc

Driving erratically with me and my dc in the car would be a deal breaker for me
he sounds utterly tiresome but only you know if you want to continue with this circus

My sister is the same way, she tells many lies. I've asked her why. She's denied it then said, it's to make me look interesting?! She lies about where's she's been, who she saw, what was said, her top cost just £5, the cafe owner gave her a discount?! All kinds of pointless lies. Everyone knows she lies! She gets caught out numerous times and she'll just continue the story then admit its not true. Her friends and family laugh at her, behind her back. My nan's side call her "liar" but I can't laugh, it drives me mad. I don't speak to her anymore, because you don't know where you stand with someone like that. I honestly don't know how you'd stay with someone like that! I often wonder what big lies they tell too.

I don't agree with any advice you have had here about trying to understand/change him. You are dealing with enough already and don't need to invest time in understanding this for him. It is his shame and his stuff to face and understand and work with, not yours, and I very much doubt he will want any form of counselling or support as this would mean talking to someone who will see right through him and I would imagine he will avoid this at all costs.
I couldn't live with this OP, it is the little things that all add up and make you think you're going mad. My Dad lied a lot and my Mum tolerated it and tried to understand him to the ends of the earth and their constant dance with this meant that they had no interest in anyone else.

I was married to a lazy manchild, who lied all the time. All the time. I’d catch him out, and he would keep lying.

tt Was exhausting
and then he left me when our second baby was 10 days old.
life was so much easier. Loving and living with a liar is so so draining.

and he has bee lying to you since before the marriage,
i wouldn’t be buying a new house. I would be ending it.

di you really want your life to look like this in 10 years?

You really can't say things are "so good". Because they are not because of this I couldnt live like this

@Ratafia

Co-parenting is generally a term applied to parents who have split up but both remain in the DCs lives.

Why would your family think you’re crazy for splitting up with someone for constantly lying? Whatever the lies are? Surely they’d recognise that that is a very unhealthy relationship and that being unable to trust a word your husband utters is a huge issue?

Hm. We were told 'we can tell if you're lying' so now I have trouble lying. Not being able to tell even white lies really hinders you in life, particularly at work.

I have been with someone like this, it's draining and leaves you on eggshells. I also don't think it's your job to figure out what to do and what's wrong. You are both adults and you sound like you have enough on your plate. I'd honestly consider ending it as unless he is willing to put in the work it won't change. It is not your responsibility to work out the why and fix him. You've been clear with him about the lies already so he already knows how you feel and if he won't change then he needs to leave.

I couldn't live with the pointless lying but looking at your position I understand why it might be difficult for you to leave.
Perhaps stop giving him the opportunity to lie. Instead of saying 'what speed are you doing?' Just stay 'stop speeding'. Make everything an end of discussion so that there is less chance for him to lie.

If you really can't leave, just stop asking him questions in a kind of grey rock sort of way.
Not ideal but it might keep your sanity.

This. They don’t get a vote. They don’t get to dictate to OP that she has to live on eggshells, never knowing which way is up or down.

I've had two LTRs where I often suspected the bloke was lying. Their motivations were different. I think lots of then do it to try and deflect any heat they think is coming their way if they think they might be accused of fucking something up. That would be the speeding and biscuits one in your examples. Did his parents give him a hard time for stuff as a kid? (Not that this should be any excuse). Sounds a bit like your husband.

The second bloke would just lie because it suited him at the time e.g if we'd arranged to meet and then he didn't fancy it. This got worse over time because of the entitled way he did it. This one disturbed me a lot more

Constant lies are destabilising no matter what they're about. The problem isn't in you having completely normal conversations with him and you don't need to reframe anything - you're clearly exhausted from this and you don't need to add to that by trying to cajole him out of something he's been doing for years. You've already given him options. It's up to him to fix this which you can support if you choose to but it is not on you to baby him through it. It sounds thoroughly depressing.

This. My exH lied about the little things, and was also the son of an abusive alcoholic. It turned out he lied about the big things too. After living with him for two decades I finally accepted that he wasn’t the person that I thought he was. The gaslighting completely wrecked my sense of who I was and my trust in myself. You deserve better. And so do your children. I doubt your DH can change as this is his default behaviour for self-protection. This will literally drive you crazy.

So you have ND dc, you or he are likely ND as well which will add to the pressure.

You don’t have to rethink and reword everything but it may help if you try get into that habit.

A no shame household will help your DC too.

The fact you need to point out it was two BIG biscuits suggests it may well not have felt safe enough for him to say he ate both of them.

You are really focused on the concrete issues of the lie, the biscuit, the walk to the car.

Your husband is dealing with the same things as you, plus an overwhelming sense of shame.

So it’s up to you. Split up, or change how you deal with the lies.

Sounds like with the big lies it was sorted with counselling? Maybe since then you’ve become paranoid about it and developed a mindset that everything he says he is lying about, so you’re quizzing him on everything he says so he is then reacting by trying to pre-empt that? Maybe you both just need to go back to counselling to unpick what’s going on here.

So in this example perhaps rather than asking what speed he’s doing, as you’ve already admitted you could see the speedometer, you could just tell him to slow down. This would remove the opportunity of him lying again.

Asking questions of these type of people is almost setting them up to fail. It’s exhausting trying to reframe everything you say to them so they don’t have the opportunity to lie. Having less opportunity to lie helps them break the habit.

My DP is very similar. I take everything he says with a pinch of salt now. I remember the first lie many years ago. I saw him get off a bus to cross road to meet me. On greeting me he said he had waited so long for a bus he had to get a taxi. I was shocked and said I just saw you get off the bus. He was quite flustered! Pointless lie. He is a lot better now but that’s in part to not questioning him on things I already know or reframing how I speak to him to make it easier for him to be truthful. Regards lies about going to a country he’s never been to I would perhaps just laugh and say ‘of course you have’. Then move on.

If you’re unable to manage his lies though you have to take account of how this affects your own mental health and seriously consider what options you have. As you mentioned earlier, co-parenting might be a nightmare with someone like him so the situation could go from bad to worse if you separate. Do what’s best for you and your own sanity!

The advice here certainly is reinforcing that it is a valid reason to leave, and OP, it seems to me that you actually do want to leave, but just don’t know how… that logistically, it feels impossible to you.

would it help to start a new thread / offer more info here about your set up? Ie what ages are the kids, what is their childcare arrangement? Why would you have to give up work if you work now, for instance?
perhaps then people could try and solve that problem for you so it feels more achievable.

@PrizedPickledPopcorn

This is great advice. If you were dealing with a child. This man is an adult - and a father.

It’s not OP’s job to manage his dishonesty and shame or whatever. He has to do that for himself.

She is allowed to ask about the biscuits. If he did eat them the only sensible answers from an adult are “oh sorry i snaffled
them all / sorry I didnt think you wanted any - shall i get some more when i next pop out?”

If he is speeding in the car with DC in the car after having had points and a speed awareness course then of course she should raise it.

I hate that you are asking @Teanandtoast to contort herself into all sorts of mental and emotional positions.

This man is an adult and he lies. It’s not for
OP to fix. She is not an emotional rehabilitation centre for this man.

OP my partner's mother does this. I find it really difficult because lying is my absolute pet hate! Her lies can be so trivial, or really big. What makes it harder is when there is seemingly no reason or consequence for her lying! I want to say over the years I've accepted her for it, but it grates on me massively and I now only communicate with her out of necessity.
My OH also used to do it until I called him out for it and then he became aware of it and actively stopped. I couldn't have lived with it if he didn't recognise it. His brother also does it. I feel that maybe OH and brother did/do it as a learned behaviour from their mum. I feel Mother of OH has a very real undiagnosed mental health issue that she cannot help. That said, the whole family know she does it, but nobody brings it to her attention.

I just wanted to share with you because although I have no advice, I do understand how frustrating it is!

Exactly - he has to take responsibility for his own behaviour and his behavioural impact on his children. If his children are aware then OP will have more of this to deal with going forward as by minimising it, glossing over it and enabling they won't see any issues with it. That begins the cycle for their families as adults.

Once you are an adult you and you alone are responsible for getting help for issues that affect your life, working on them by yourself and putting the effort in. Just as with stopping an addiction; no one else can do that for you.

Would making a joke of it be worth trying. Like ok Pinocchio did you eat my biscuit! Like you might do with a child. Children lie because they say what they want to be true which is why they have imaginary friends sometimes who break things. Hard with a husband i know but.?

Hi OP. I was married to a man like your DH. We're divorced now.

Like you, I kept picking up on little white lies and half-truths. I kept asking over and over for him to be honest, that the lies were eroding my trust in him. He would always agree, then revert back to type. Over the years we were together, I also caught him telling some awful, big lies too. He had an avoidant personality and basically would just lie to make things easier in the moment. I think his issues with lying also stem from his childhood. We ended up in a very parent/child dynamic which i honestly hated. In the end, it was a small (kind of) lie thaf split us up. I asked about his weekend plans, invited him to an event i was going to, and he lied and said he was free. Turns out he wasn't free at all, and I only found out as he was heading out the door!

We tried counselling but, by that point, I was just so mad at him. I was done. So I left. We didnt have kids, which I guess makes things more straightforward. But I can honestly say I felt such a relief walking away. I think when you're in a relationship like this, day to day it's easy to minimise the harm this causes. You think to yourself "it's not bad enough to leave" - because you're so used to it. But it wears you down, bit by bit, doesn't it?

My advice, leave. Figure out how to untangle yourself from him. It is obviously affecting you. Liars don't change btw. My ex has a new gf now and lies constantly still (I've heard things that are simply not true, so I know he's still doing it). It's a hard habit to break, he's had it since childhood. But it's not your issue to fix. So go and live your life, and in time you'll find a partner who can truly be your equal. An actual partner. This isn't it - unless he's prepared to do some serious work.