Ex wants to take DD (4) to Jamaica

[Butterfly789]

Hi, would be grateful to hear from anyone who has had any similar experiences:

My ex and I have a 3 year old. He walked out when she was 10 days old and since then I have been the primary caregiver. She sleeps over at his house every other weekend, and on the weeks she doesn’t sleep over, she just goes for the day on Saturday (hope this makes sense).

I have just had a call from his mom saying that they want to take her to Jamaica next August (she will be 4) to attend a family wedding.

I personally think she will be too young to go so far away, especially when she’s never even been abroad with him or spent more than 1 night with him. I have told him I would be more open to somewhere closer, like Spain for example.

AIBU?

What steps can I take to prevent it?

Hague is not a signatory to the Hague convention, which would make me nervous.

Absolutely not.

What I meant is, if the risk is based only on the fact that he has a family and house there, it doesn't sound fair to preventively forbid it.
In that case no-one would be ever allowed to take children to visit their family abroad.

Google parental abduction abroad and see the recommendations, plus info about what you'd need to do if that happens

It sounds fair to me. A nine hour flight for a four year old to go to a wedding of people she barely knows is ridiculous, even without the risk of him not returning.

And it won't be a memorable trip - she's four. If she remembers anything about it, it will be something completely random like having an ice-cream at the airport. Or worse, being away from home and missing her mum.

Just don't let her go. Ignore the Mumsnet bleeding hearts, she's your daughter and she's your priority, not "being fair" to a mostly absent father.

I absolutely wouldn't let her go to his home country, where he owns property. There is a risk that he won't come home - not that he necessarily would want to be a full time parent, but to do it out of spite, or because other family members have said that they'll bring her up.

If she doesn't have a passport yet, get one now so you have it.

Even if there wasn't a risk that she might not come home, it's a very long trip for a small child who I imagine doesn't know his family well.

She's likely to be very clingy to him, as the only person she knows, which he might not appreciate, as he'll want to spend time with wider family and friends.

Id say no. No way in fact. She's too young IMO

Well they haven't chosen Jamaica for a holiday, they want to take her there because it's where the wedding is. So whether Spain would be a better destination is somewhat besides the point.

Personally I think Jamaica is too far at that age unless you are also going with them.

I'd also want to look into the legalities of what happens if they don't bring her back before even thinking about it.

Absolutely not. He needs to earn trust and build up towards that

Absolutely not. Unless they want to pay for you to come as well, she would not be going

I don't see an issue if the father is a decent person and you don't think there is any risk of abduction and he has experience of having her for extended periods by himself. Is the family from Jamaica? If so there will be lots of extended family she can meet and I am sure they will dote on her.
We have done long haul flights with young kids its fine ( tiring) but fine.

Fair enough. It's just you can prevent it if it really is a risk. If it's unlikely, that's a good start

I would not be happy with this, unless I was also traveling.

I'd let her go on the proviso she spends more time with dad in one go near home first, to see how she coped without you, her main care giver, for so long. X

I'm surprised at some of the advice on here. Absolutely not.. Jamaica is not a particularly safe country, you're her main carer giver, she's only four and it's too far. Just no

Can you say it’s too long away from you? Id personally say no at that age. Unless
you go too.

International parental child abduction - GOV.UK

Same. I think you'd need to have a really unusually strong and trusting coparenting relationship for this to be acceptable

Absolutely not. Far too far away and far too long a trip given that she only spends every other weekend with one overnight with him when she's only 4.

I also wouldn't countenance my child being taken to a country where my partner had a home / could easily remain, particularly one which is so far away and not a Hague signatory. As pp have stated, if she doesn't have a passport yet, sort it now so it comes to you and keep any passport / docs under lock and key. Would she be entitled to and would he try to apply for a Jamaican passport for her? What could you do about that?

No, what if he doesnt bring her back?

I think you'll find that in cases like this, mothers often refuse to allow their ex-partners to take their children back to their home country, due to the risk that they won't be brought home.

I've only heard of cases where the father takes the kids, sometimes out of spite, sometimes to ensure the child grows up with their fathers culture or religion, and always with the bonus that the father doesn't have to pay child support anymore, and it's likely far cheaper gor the child to be brough up by family members in the fathers home country.

There are cases of UK women who's children are in countries like Pakistan or Egypt, where even if there's a court order for the kids to be returned to the mother, the police say they can't find them. I would worry that something similar could happen in Jamaica.

I just wouldn't risk it.

I've just read the UK governments travel advice for Jamaica.

Not a chance would I allow my child to go there.

She’d be away for much longer than a weekend (how long?!) in a completely strange place with no way of seeing you. It is ridiculous. It would cause her an emotional rupture.