To wonder what people actually expect and why they can’t just be happy to live simply?

[Terrazzomazzo]

So many posts on here of people saying that they are running out of money and “I have no fun money” et. Why can’t people just be happy that they have enough to pay their mortgage pay their bills and feed their family and clothe their children? When did holidays , excess “stuff” and weekends of fun days out and take away etc become a given right and expectation?

Why do they deserve to be happy? Why do they deserve a life that they consider to be worth living?

It's just meaningless drivel.

Who's job is it to provide their happiness and living standards?

I am not sure what your point is. Are you saying no one deserves to be happy?

There are many fun things that don't cost much money. It largely depends on who you are doing them with or even if you are happy with your own company.

Don't be a knob.

Tell that to the victim of the famine in China in the 70s.

Well, yes. Some people will be happy with the latest iphone, some will be happy with a walk in the woods looking at trees.
We are all different.
If you can afford whatever gets your dopamine going, then go for it. It is no one else's business really.

I respect your reply. It has me questioning whether happiness isn't a static thing but a sliding scale that we all interpret differently. You appear to have a good grasp of, what for you is happiness, I would define as real contentment. Thank you for your perspective. You've given me something to consider. I like that very much.

That's exactly what I'm saying.

Well, that viewpoint sounds like depression to me.

A sliding scale, and individual to each person.
Thank you for your respectful reply.

It's just reality.

People are free to pursue their own version of happiness, but nobody deserves to be happy.

I think we can all agree that we'd like everybody to be happy (except nonses, abusers, violent criminals, scammers, etc), but happiness isn't something that is externally conferred, which makes the idea of it being deserved ludicrous.

Well, we shall have to agree to disagree on that one.
Years of therapy taught me that I deserved happiness and a life worth living. Knowing that has kept me alive. Otherwise what was the point in even engaging in therapy....

I don’t think it’s entitlement as such, more that people have had to readjust their expectations for the same or more work.

and it’s painful.

Most people are having to make difficult choices which are really difficult and painful if you’re having to choose between heating and eating, or refusing a party invitation because you can’t afford to get there because you spent the money on parking to take your mum to the hospital. It’s pretty shit actually

We are well off and we baulk at the price of a box of tea bags or a box of dishwasher tablets.

There is equal pleasure in life in the simpler things. Hiking, reading, growing your own fruit and veg etc but it takes adjustment, and that’s where most people are at I think.

your post just shows your lack of empathy.

As someone living with depression for years, but still making a rewarding and meaningful life, you are wrong.

It isn't 'depression' to break the link that happiness = spending money.

On the contrary, no matter how much money I spend it doesn't fix my mental health. Whereas taking the time to appreciate what I do have, every day, does help (along with the free at the point of delivery of the NHS).

I didn't say it was about spending money. PP said no one deserves to be happy, and I actually gave examples (for me) where experiencing happiness costs nothing.

Thinking that no one deserves to be happy is not a healthy way of thinking.

Everyone deserves to be happy.

Around 1900, when people started being paid fairer wages, and had regular working hours, which meant for the first time ever, the working class had leisure time, and a little pocket money to treat themselves.

I can’t believe this post but at the same time I feel sorry for you. Imagine tomorrow a dr tells you that you’re terminally ill? Life regrets anyone? Or more chances of being hit by a vehicle?/ crash.
this is quite a big topic that entails a lot with no wrong/right answers. People are working much harder and expect to have downtime and sometimes at home with a coffee doesn’t cut it. I looked after my grandparents, then my dad now I have a complex 2 year old. I am tired, yes I work; in STEM so I’d at least want to go on a holiday away from home country. I lost my mother when I was 2 years old I think everyday how she never got to do anything with me. Foods have chemicals, meds are expensive, climates have changed, people have become horrible & less helpful so one has to pay for everything in life because you don’t know who is who or what is what. I have been travelling for 22 years long haul and everytime it has been an enjoyable and educational experience. How are kids supposed to find their passion in life if they are home to school everyday?

Perhaps it is an ongoing thing. If people are raised by parents with the same attitude of not having enough, they will grow up not knowing how to overcome the cost of living.

Some may have had parents whose prime importance lay in entertainment, holidays: enjoying themselves, at the expense of house maintenance and bills, ending in crippling debt and without the ability to repay and demonstrate they can. Charles Dickens had something like that in all his novels, as did Jane Austen, so nothing new there, is there>

I was talking to someone not long ago about credit cards. I said I paid the balance of mine off each month and never pay interest. It was a shock when they said ''Can you pay it all off? I thought you only paid the minimum payment!

That was a new one for me. I had no idea that young people thought like that. A large part of their income was going in interest payments. It isn't easy to pay the balance off each month. You have to be strong with spending for a while, and get the balance down to something you can pay with income. Not only do you not have to pay a lot of interest over the year(s), but you learn to control your budget and discover a lot of the things can be done without.

If you never max out a credit card, you have money available for emergencies - so long as you don't have too many of them.

Note to OP: I am speaking generally, please don't take the 'yous' literally.

We are the 6th largest economy in total GDP, not GDP per head. Huge difference. The GDP number is also made up of a massive 53% of total gdp by the Govt (taxes, borrowing and spending). On GDP per head, the true figure to understand wealth, we are ranked 20 - 26 in the world depending which metrics are utilised, and we are in decline.This is massively distorted by output from City of London (the square mile financial district as opposed to the wider metropolitan area). This doesn’t change your point for sure - but beware when you read / hear that we are the 6th richest country and therefore should have a different quality of life. Without growth the country will decline further because of structural costs which will increase above inflation (population age profile, welfare, unfunded govt state pensions, welfare bills and most important our very low productivity as a nation. We simply have enormous numbers of people who are inefficient at work compared to other nations in Europe and the world. Final massive thing is energy costs. With virtually the highest energy costs in the world (driven by net zero), everything is expensive and why our inflation numbers were higher than other countries and stayed high for longer)). What we have now is the quality of life standard appropriate for a country of our economic performance globally as we are a poor(ish) country with some large wealth generating areas. Get used to it unless we can change and get growth.

You must be well off and miserable.

This. There’s a reason why the gap with the richest people in the world is widening exponentially. Elon Musk for instance doubled his billions in the last year alone.

I get your point however about being satisfied with simpler things, but people shouldn’t have to spend half their lives working to do this.

Yeah but always wanting more is not the route to happiness either. There’s something to be said for not taking things for granted and ,if not satisfied exactly, grateful for what you have even if it seems basic.

@Sally20099 having lived in Denmark the difference is chalk and cheese - so when people say it’s tough too everywhere else , it’s relative - we have too many non working people and claiming here as well - ( and I say this as a centre left voter) -

Yes. There are definitely odd attitudes to credit. I don’t know how common it is but some people also regard the credit limit as the equivalent as cash in their pocket; if it goes up they spend it and if it gets paid off they are happy to go back to the same debt quickly.

in the 70s, 80s, there was still shame about debt, and a credit card was seen as somewhat of a moral failing to live within your means. Only about ten years ago I bought a Christmas shop and an older checkout assistant smiled sympathetically and said ‘ooh it does get tight at Christmas doesn’t it?’ and I was puzzled as it took a while for me to remember that credit cards used to be for emergencies/being caught short back in the day!

I also clear my credit card every month and use it to track family spending - I know you can do this with current accounts now online/by app but back in the day when I started doing this, you couldn’t. I remember collecting 12 months of paper statements and auditing by going through tracking and categorising our spending to work out what the budget was for a house purchase. My banking app can do this for me now!

now for better or worse, debt has become more respectable. My dad used to say to me ‘never go into debt for anything other than a house or, if absolutely necessary a car’. That’s how I live and what I tell my child. As I said up thread, the choice of what you can do with 1k credit limit versus 1k of cash is vastly different. I can choose to spend my 1k cash if I wish or I can save it or invest it. With 1k credit limit,I can only spend it, which is what some people do never clearing the debt and never being able to save.

I've been there,and not just for q short time either. Lack of money contributes to greater social isolation, having to decline invitations to social events with family / friends, continuously means you start to lose those connections. Days out (even to free museums) still costs travel and at least a drink/snack as its not always feasible to carry everything. It denies broader experiences of travel and opportunities which enhance our heritage & culture and awareness /appreciation of other cultures. Yes, a certain amount can be done more cheaply/local, but its rarely easy without allocating some money aside. Humans are intelligent beings and the need for stimulating enjoyment and experiences could be argued is as much a need as a want.