Page 20 | To wonder what people actually expect and why they can’t just be happy to live simply?

zingally · 09/10/2025 11:05

Iremembercandlecove · 09/10/2025 10:41

They’re at the bottom because they are the most basic and necessary needs. That doesn’t really make them unimportant.

I’m guessing most people on MN (myself included) have never faced the prospect of being homeless or hungry though.

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Where did I say they were unimportant?

They are literally the MOST important. The foundation that everything else sits on. But while they are the essence of survival, there is more required to be happy and fulfilled, as I said.

OP was saying that food and shelter is all we should expect in order to be happy. That is not the case.

UnicornLand1 · 09/10/2025 11:25

Some people claim their toddlers just cannot survive without soft play every weekend. Some people are claiming 'We are not a Communist country'. Some people are saying we are the 6th economy, so everybody should afford luxuries, such as holidays abroad 2-3 times a year, new cars for every family member and new phones.
I was born in a Communist country. We had no softplay and my mom never took me to the playground. I only had a swing in my garden. Every year we planted vegetables and flowers. I never went to nursery, only to Reception aged 6. I was looked after by other family members while both parents worked full-time and after they came home, they worked more in the garden. I spent a lot of time at my grandma's farm with lots of animals (chickens, pigs, ducks, rabbits, geese, etc.). I watched how animals were born, how they were fed and how they've grown. I helped to plant the potatoes on the fields and weed the garden. In summer, aged 8, I learnt to swim in a nearby pond with other kids coming from they neighbouring farms. Totally unsupervised. After school and on holidays, we rode out bikes and compared our brake patterns on the sand (it was kind of a competition). In winter we went to the frozen lake with our sledges and skis. I learnt how to ski by myself. We walked to school alone from the age of 7. And that was the age when we started going alone to the corner shop to buy lollipops. In summer, aside from swimming, we used to go to pick mushrooms or berries in the forest with the whole family. Then we made preserves for winter that we kept in the basement. Children learnt hard work by observing their parents and they helped.
I had a fabulous childhood.
I have 2 kids now and live in the UK. They are driven to the costly clubs every day because at home they would be glued to screens. We have to supervise them at all times, because it's not allowed for the children here to roam together alone or it's not safe. Every time I take my son to my home country, he goes to his cousins' in the morning, they roam on bikes in the town, buy all the food they need by themselves or get fed by different family members around the town, and come back home by sunset. He is 10. When we have to go back, he cries that he doesn't want to leave, "because here it's a paradise". He doesn't say that about costly holidays in e.g. Spain.
Now I think people here have got used to having luxuries to be somewhat a necessity. Sometimes due to social media, sometimes due to peer/family pressure. We just want to have more and more and we are never happy. It's pure consummerism and it doesn't really make anybody happy. People buy more and more (stuff that they don't really need), they spend more and more, and they always feel skint. Why the need for 2 costly cars when you really need only 1? Why does it have to be a new phone with a costly plan? Does a child really need this xBox or Nitendo? How about a Cloud gaming monthly subscription, provided they behave well and clean their bedroom? I appreciate that my childhood world doesn't exist anymore and this world here is so different, but I think what we have come to is something extreme and we are living in a vicious circle of consummerism that doesn't really make anybody happy or do us any favours as a society.

Mosaiccat · 09/10/2025 11:29

ThisOldThang · 08/10/2025 22:03

"I'm starting to see a bit of a trend to young people saying they'll take a job that they think is fun, albeit low paying, so that they can get topped up on the grounds that there is no point going for the grind if the grind doesn't pay."

And this is why communism doesn't work. If you get the same reward for a hard or difficult job (e.g. night shift at the sewage works) as you do at an easy job (e.g. 9-5 at a library), why would anybody choose the hard jobs?

We're creating the problems of communism via the benefits system.

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I worked as a TA while my children were little. As soon as they were old enough I went full time in an office job. The only people who stayed as TAs were those on benefits - why would you give up the school holidays and work full time at tesco for the same outcome?

GreenFriedTomato · 09/10/2025 11:37

Catquest · 09/10/2025 09:37

Not necessarily

I have a group of friends who all swap seeds and plants.
I've saved seed from what Im growing for years.
I barely spend a few pounds a year.
I compost so I don't even buy that.

Sewing and knitting yes guilty but it takes me a while to sew or knit something.
I compared it to instant gratification items such as online shopping, make up and gaming which have an instant novelty which requires more and more purchases.

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Note that I said 'can be costly' not that they always are.
Bottom line is that many activities can be both inexpensive or cost a lot. Depends.
I might spend less on my foreign holiday than someone else spends on a regular hobby they do at home.
Everyone's idea of fun is different. I enjoy the outdoors and would prefer a camping weekend over a spa day or restaurant outing , but neither is worse or better than the other.
Also the OP (and others) comments about simply enjoying family time, playing games etc and being grateful.
Not everyone lives surrounded by family or loved ones. So maybe they should take that into account when singing the praises of staying at home and never going out.

GreenFriedTomato · 09/10/2025 11:55

Bra848tofjn · 09/10/2025 10:52

Just making excuses. We both work full
time and I manage to bake and cook from scratch. You don’t need a greenhouse to have a garden, windowsills and zippers work fine, walking by outdoors don’t need to be in jaw dropping beauty- parks and all kinds of places get you outside.

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Well, by the time I've finished my 12 hour shift, I have neither the time or energy to start baking from scratch. Hats off to you!
When people talk about the joys of gardening I assume it's being OUT in the garden, enjoying the fresh air, pruning the plants etc. not growing some bits in window boxes.
As for you can walk anywhere. Why don't you come for a lovely walk where I live. It certainly isn't a jaw dropping beauty park.
Perhaps you can teach me how to enjoy walking down endless dreary estate roads with identical booze bargains and pound shops and local parks full of yobs and drunks. Mindfulness is great when you're in pleasant surroundings. Not so much when you're not.
Thanks but I don't just walk for the sake of it. Seeing pretty flowers and hearing birdsong would be nice too 🙄

CoreyFlood · 09/10/2025 12:24

I had a totally free range childhood too, and love all that. Did loads of free stuff with my kids outdoors. But that’s only 1 kind of fun. Other kinds of fun shouldn’t be sneered at just because the lower orders enjoy them 🙄
I love fell walking and gardening but I also love to be able to put in something nice and go out for cocktails! There’s nothing wrong with that. People in the 1980s got dressed up and went out a lot- I remember watching adults do that and thinking ooh can’t wait until it’s my turn. As an adult now I can rarely afford a night out.

Londonmummy66 · 09/10/2025 12:53

SouthernNights59 · 09/10/2025 00:27

You are the one talking shite.

The pp agreed that people did things for leisure in the past, however it was an occasional treat, not something which happened regularly - and they are correct. Now people go out so often that they are always looking for something new and exciting.

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Well keeping the masses entertained to keep them quiet is fairly well established - bread and circuses was well known in ancient Rome (and in some years the games etc took up about half the year) and the Greek plays we have were performed for everyone in classical Athens. I suspect that not many people today would think that all three plays of the Oresteia was a fun day out but there again 9 hours of theatre would be rather expensive.....

GreenFriedTomato · 09/10/2025 14:03

TheSwarm · 09/10/2025 09:19

Nope, I'm not.

OP is painting the sodding 80s and 90s as if everyone was stuck down the mines and everyone was happy about it.

Which is complete bollocks. If anything, people these days have less disposable income than 10/20 years ago, which is why people are going out less and so many leisure facilities/ pubs etc are closing.

Edited

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What on earth are they on about? Going out a rare and occasional treat? Pubs were full in the 80's. I should know because my parents were in them every weekend (and some weekdays too) . I'm pretty sure it was cheaper to go out back then (comparatively) than it is today.
And as a child, I'd go ice skating, cinema etc with my paper round money and then clubbing as an older teenager. Could even spend the day in Blackpool and just walk around the pleasure beach without going on rides. Now it's £40 to get in or something. All these things are much more expensive nowadays and many people tend to stay at home now instead of going out. Not to mention most of the pubs in my area have closed down anyway.

Edited for spelling

Catquest · 09/10/2025 14:05

Londonmummy66 · 09/10/2025 12:53

Well keeping the masses entertained to keep them quiet is fairly well established - bread and circuses was well known in ancient Rome (and in some years the games etc took up about half the year) and the Greek plays we have were performed for everyone in classical Athens. I suspect that not many people today would think that all three plays of the Oresteia was a fun day out but there again 9 hours of theatre would be rather expensive.....

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It's not just about keeping the masses entertained.
Now it's getting them hooked by exploiting their vulnerabilities, telling them they look and feel shit, hooking them onto UPF then telling them they are too fat, here's an injection for your face, now you can have one because you are too fat.
Throw away the food you buy because it's out of date, then buy more.
Oh now you are stressed and cant sleep so here's another app to help with that

Awww feel depressed and old- buy this!

On and on it goes

InterIgnis · 09/10/2025 14:24

UnicornLand1 · 09/10/2025 11:25

Some people claim their toddlers just cannot survive without soft play every weekend. Some people are claiming 'We are not a Communist country'. Some people are saying we are the 6th economy, so everybody should afford luxuries, such as holidays abroad 2-3 times a year, new cars for every family member and new phones.
I was born in a Communist country. We had no softplay and my mom never took me to the playground. I only had a swing in my garden. Every year we planted vegetables and flowers. I never went to nursery, only to Reception aged 6. I was looked after by other family members while both parents worked full-time and after they came home, they worked more in the garden. I spent a lot of time at my grandma's farm with lots of animals (chickens, pigs, ducks, rabbits, geese, etc.). I watched how animals were born, how they were fed and how they've grown. I helped to plant the potatoes on the fields and weed the garden. In summer, aged 8, I learnt to swim in a nearby pond with other kids coming from they neighbouring farms. Totally unsupervised. After school and on holidays, we rode out bikes and compared our brake patterns on the sand (it was kind of a competition). In winter we went to the frozen lake with our sledges and skis. I learnt how to ski by myself. We walked to school alone from the age of 7. And that was the age when we started going alone to the corner shop to buy lollipops. In summer, aside from swimming, we used to go to pick mushrooms or berries in the forest with the whole family. Then we made preserves for winter that we kept in the basement. Children learnt hard work by observing their parents and they helped.
I had a fabulous childhood.
I have 2 kids now and live in the UK. They are driven to the costly clubs every day because at home they would be glued to screens. We have to supervise them at all times, because it's not allowed for the children here to roam together alone or it's not safe. Every time I take my son to my home country, he goes to his cousins' in the morning, they roam on bikes in the town, buy all the food they need by themselves or get fed by different family members around the town, and come back home by sunset. He is 10. When we have to go back, he cries that he doesn't want to leave, "because here it's a paradise". He doesn't say that about costly holidays in e.g. Spain.
Now I think people here have got used to having luxuries to be somewhat a necessity. Sometimes due to social media, sometimes due to peer/family pressure. We just want to have more and more and we are never happy. It's pure consummerism and it doesn't really make anybody happy. People buy more and more (stuff that they don't really need), they spend more and more, and they always feel skint. Why the need for 2 costly cars when you really need only 1? Why does it have to be a new phone with a costly plan? Does a child really need this xBox or Nitendo? How about a Cloud gaming monthly subscription, provided they behave well and clean their bedroom? I appreciate that my childhood world doesn't exist anymore and this world here is so different, but I think what we have come to is something extreme and we are living in a vicious circle of consummerism that doesn't really make anybody happy or do us any favours as a society.

You’re painting it as quite the idyll. I was also born in a Communist country, as were my parents. Some of my childhood resembles yours, but people absolutely did want more than what the state or nature offered. There’s a reason why the black market and the culture of bribery was so huge, and a reason why those who had the opportunity went west as soon as they were able to and embraced the ‘decadent Western’ lifestyle.

There is no one universal route to happiness. What person loves and finds value in, you can be sure another will loathe. And that’s okay, we don’t have to find our happiness in the same things.

fishtank12345 · 09/10/2025 15:02

UnicornLand1 · 09/10/2025 11:25

Some people claim their toddlers just cannot survive without soft play every weekend. Some people are claiming 'We are not a Communist country'. Some people are saying we are the 6th economy, so everybody should afford luxuries, such as holidays abroad 2-3 times a year, new cars for every family member and new phones.
I was born in a Communist country. We had no softplay and my mom never took me to the playground. I only had a swing in my garden. Every year we planted vegetables and flowers. I never went to nursery, only to Reception aged 6. I was looked after by other family members while both parents worked full-time and after they came home, they worked more in the garden. I spent a lot of time at my grandma's farm with lots of animals (chickens, pigs, ducks, rabbits, geese, etc.). I watched how animals were born, how they were fed and how they've grown. I helped to plant the potatoes on the fields and weed the garden. In summer, aged 8, I learnt to swim in a nearby pond with other kids coming from they neighbouring farms. Totally unsupervised. After school and on holidays, we rode out bikes and compared our brake patterns on the sand (it was kind of a competition). In winter we went to the frozen lake with our sledges and skis. I learnt how to ski by myself. We walked to school alone from the age of 7. And that was the age when we started going alone to the corner shop to buy lollipops. In summer, aside from swimming, we used to go to pick mushrooms or berries in the forest with the whole family. Then we made preserves for winter that we kept in the basement. Children learnt hard work by observing their parents and they helped.
I had a fabulous childhood.
I have 2 kids now and live in the UK. They are driven to the costly clubs every day because at home they would be glued to screens. We have to supervise them at all times, because it's not allowed for the children here to roam together alone or it's not safe. Every time I take my son to my home country, he goes to his cousins' in the morning, they roam on bikes in the town, buy all the food they need by themselves or get fed by different family members around the town, and come back home by sunset. He is 10. When we have to go back, he cries that he doesn't want to leave, "because here it's a paradise". He doesn't say that about costly holidays in e.g. Spain.
Now I think people here have got used to having luxuries to be somewhat a necessity. Sometimes due to social media, sometimes due to peer/family pressure. We just want to have more and more and we are never happy. It's pure consummerism and it doesn't really make anybody happy. People buy more and more (stuff that they don't really need), they spend more and more, and they always feel skint. Why the need for 2 costly cars when you really need only 1? Why does it have to be a new phone with a costly plan? Does a child really need this xBox or Nitendo? How about a Cloud gaming monthly subscription, provided they behave well and clean their bedroom? I appreciate that my childhood world doesn't exist anymore and this world here is so different, but I think what we have come to is something extreme and we are living in a vicious circle of consummerism that doesn't really make anybody happy or do us any favours as a society.

This is perfect, the only way to sum it up. Life feels a lot harder now.

fishtank12345 · 09/10/2025 15:04

Catquest · 09/10/2025 14:05

It's not just about keeping the masses entertained.
Now it's getting them hooked by exploiting their vulnerabilities, telling them they look and feel shit, hooking them onto UPF then telling them they are too fat, here's an injection for your face, now you can have one because you are too fat.
Throw away the food you buy because it's out of date, then buy more.
Oh now you are stressed and cant sleep so here's another app to help with that

Awww feel depressed and old- buy this!

On and on it goes

Show quote history

This is also depressingly true

fishtank12345 · 09/10/2025 15:09

GreenFriedTomato · 09/10/2025 11:55

Well, by the time I've finished my 12 hour shift, I have neither the time or energy to start baking from scratch. Hats off to you!
When people talk about the joys of gardening I assume it's being OUT in the garden, enjoying the fresh air, pruning the plants etc. not growing some bits in window boxes.
As for you can walk anywhere. Why don't you come for a lovely walk where I live. It certainly isn't a jaw dropping beauty park.
Perhaps you can teach me how to enjoy walking down endless dreary estate roads with identical booze bargains and pound shops and local parks full of yobs and drunks. Mindfulness is great when you're in pleasant surroundings. Not so much when you're not.
Thanks but I don't just walk for the sake of it. Seeing pretty flowers and hearing birdsong would be nice too 🙄

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This. I live in a crappy area too. Makes things feel so much harder.

KayMarie121 · 09/10/2025 18:01

For me there’s so many free great days out, but you still have to find £40 for fuel to get there and back. I can walk for miles from my home and swim in a river if I want to, but if you don’t have that on your doorstep, there’s massive pressure to take your kids to special things. I do feel a bit for kids spending half their days in backs of cars going here there and everywhere while parents get frazzled & burnt out. I used to take my son camping, beaching and walking, reserving shopping, ice skating and cinema to times when there was more money.

MustWeDoThis · 09/10/2025 18:08

Terrazzomazzo · 08/10/2025 14:47

So many posts on here of people saying that they are running out of money and “I have no fun money” et. Why can’t people just be happy that they have enough to pay their mortgage pay their bills and feed their family and clothe their children? When did holidays , excess “stuff” and weekends of fun days out and take away etc become a given right and expectation?

I don't know where you get your money from, but a majority of us work for our money and expect to get more from it than working just to pay bills and eat.

FlyMeSomewhere · 09/10/2025 18:08

For my partner and I, the reward of building careers and grafting hard is travelling, we don't do a lot of materialistic stuff, our passion is booking flights and Airbnbs and going exploring. I love it all, seeing stuff, eating stuff, drinking stuff and meeting lovely people. 62 countries under the belt now and I'll never look back on my life and have any regrets that I didn't do things I really enjoyed.

cornflakecrunchie · 09/10/2025 18:09

Hang on, @Katypp - only just started reading this thread & your 'hate the boomers' post came up. This boomer doesn't drive, doesn't drink, never been out of the UK.. do NOT generalise.

cornflakecrunchie · 09/10/2025 18:18

@Katypp - apologies! I reacted before I'd even finished reading your post, thinking it was a boomer bashing one, & it wasn't.. sorry..

Loolayloolaylay · 09/10/2025 18:26

SriouslyWhutNow · 08/10/2025 14:52

Because we’re not Puritans and I believe experiences give life depth and meaning. When did it become so wrong to want to see, do and eat nice things? Half the posters on MN these days are angry at anyone with half a can of beans to their name.

Half the posters on MN these days are angry at anyone with half a can of beans to their name.

So funny because its true 😂😂😂

mrlistersgelfbride · 09/10/2025 18:30

I do know what you mean.

I don’t need a lot of stuff and I’m happy to potter about with a book , go for runs and walks , cash in a free coffee or just stay in.
When I lived only my own (albeit it was now 15 years ago) , £100 went a long way.

I now have a partner and a DD who like stuff, expensive hobbies and big holidays.
We don’t need these things. But they do make life more fun.

Blablibladirladada · 09/10/2025 18:34

Maybe because life has seasons and so now you want to cost but later you want to travel?

Maybe because your partner doesn’t want to sit tight?

Maybe because your children aren’t thinking that?

Life is more than just how you think and want.

edit : cosy not cost (blimmmmmy phone!)

Blablibladirladada · 09/10/2025 18:36

Loolayloolaylay · 09/10/2025 18:26

Half the posters on MN these days are angry at anyone with half a can of beans to their name.

So funny because its true 😂😂😂

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Yeah…they are my beans 😂😁

Donttellempike · 09/10/2025 18:41

Katypp · 08/10/2025 15:05

This is really interesting and is what DH and I were discussing this morning. I have a child in his mid-30s, I had another who will be graduating next year. I get that life is hard for younger people and families.
But I do think what is forgotten in the many, many threads on MN about how greedy boomers are having 14989 cruises a year while young families struggle is that expectations are SO much higher these days.
We passed a nursery at drop-off time today in an ordinary wc area and my goodness, the cars were all massive and no more than two years old. When did it become the norm to drive a huge SUV around? When I was a teen, an average family car was something like a Ford Escort or similar, and most (not all) families only had one car.
The amount of activities families seem to consider normal has ramped up massively too - all costing money from the family budget. Holidays and takeaways seem to be expected too.
So while I would not ever say young families can't afford to buy a house because they buy a takeaway coffee every day (although that's another relatively-new thing), the incremental increased cost of all these things that people seem to feel they are entitled to because both parents work, or we are a rich economy, or whatever.
Because what a pp described upthread as a miserable existence is pretty much they way life was up until about 25 years ago.

Not true. And until the mid to late 80s most people in a decent job could expect to buy a property by their mid 20s. On their own

Since Thatcher’s neo con project wealth has flowed ever upwards to the Meg rich.

That’s the real issue

CoffeeCantata · 09/10/2025 18:53

TheSwarm · 08/10/2025 18:19

Why? Because that's literally the point.

If we can't or shouldn't try to make things better for future generations, why bother with anything? Let's all just say "fuck it" and not bother investing in or researching anything.

Hello - Earth calling!

The West is in decline. This century will (if it doesn’t already) belong to China.

There is no natural law which says our lives will continue to get better. Maybe we’ve peaked in Britain and Europe? I think historians will say that the peak years were the early 2000s, pre2008 financial crash and Covid.

Things are not going well for this country or for other European nations. Pressure from migration and economic decline are playing into the hands of right wing movements across Europe. Sorry, but this is where we are.

I think we’ll get by but I DON’T buy the “Things should be getting better all the time” line. Read your history!

Crikeyalmighty · 09/10/2025 18:55

@mrlistersgelfbride I think this is important too - if you are in a family/couple - then very often you can have differing ideas of priorities - it doesn’t always start out that way but it’s easy for situations to change - my rather bohemian H from 1995 has turned into quite a lover of nice hotels, good cars ( even if 7 years old) , nice quality meals, goodies wine and living in high end areas etc even though he could quite easily compromise and have life far easier from the money end of things- but nope he won’t .