“We need to stop importing people who hate us”

[OneAmusedShark]

Overheard an older couple of Caribbean couple talking about the Manchester attack on the train earlier and one of
them used this phrase.

Someone else (who was getting off at the time) shouted at them “You can’t say that! It’s hate speech!”

I didn’t get involved.

Was it hate speech?

I'm more bothered about what people do than what they think. We can't police the thoughts in people's heads.

Good post

Until it comes time to vote in local or general elections, then thought becomes a reality.

This absolutely one hundred percent.

You can see the world in black and white and seek to be offended or you can recognise there is nuance to what people say and me.

When you do so you make it difficult for others to have a reasonable and proportionate discussion on issues like immigration.

It's not racist. We're letting people in with completely different cultural values with no link or loyalty to the UK

This.

I accept that some adults are migrating to the UK who are intrinsically anti UK. There will always be people in the world with hatred and a desire to disrupt, harm, murder.
And thus it ever was.

What I think should be focused on is how young people are becoming radicalised (I am not just talking about extreme Islamist radicalisation either here) because it is tearing the fabric of our society apart. We need to focus on pulling all sides closer and have those difficult conversations about differences.

I feel like marking topics as taboo or too difficult to navigate for fear of causing offence are isolating people in minorities and making them ripe for the plucking for those who seek to radicalise people and spread hate from afar.

I don't think the Prevent programme has been helpful in preventing anything. Its been too reactive and really needed to stop the radicalisation happening not knee jerking after the fact.

I think that you are naive to think that the current tensions in this country relate to Muslims in isolation. Most south east Asian Britons are feeling the ramifications no matter which religion they subscribe to as white Britons can't typically distinguish between a person or Bangladeshi or Pakistani or Indian descent, let alone which region they are descendant, or which religion they follow.

When you are affluent and nobody flies flags in your area, this may all be a thought experiment for you, I suppose.

So, indulge me.

You have raised misogyny. You wrote:
"Men who have been socialised in environments where violence and subjugation of women are everyday realities should not be given free rein to bring those mindsets into this country"

Do you recognise that gender imbalance extends across south east Asia as a region?

Are you in turn suggesting an impass on immigration from south east Asia?

And then the whole waiting room applauded!

Cool story bro

Didn’t he move here as a baby? I’m not entirely sure what progress could have vetted him at that point!! I think it’s important to put money and time into community projects so we know everyone in our community and know who these hateful people are (regardless of ethnicity). Years ago we had Sure Start, neighbourhood policing teams, well-funded local charities working with a range of different groups. All those things are so important in terms of community cohesion but also building a picture of what’s going on out there. I don’t think the issue is migration. Plenty of killers were born and bred here.

Caribbean couple? Do you mean black? They might have been born here, which would make them British...

As a trained scientist I love the phrase 'without data it's just an opinion' so I looked for some trustworthy data. Anyone can do it. Obviously this does not account for illegal underage marriage of which there is plenty in many countries. Sadly it's often a result of desperate economic circumstances caused by our unequal world.

Hey it's her make believe story she's free to decide the ethnicity of the characters!

Oh I know🤣🤣.

"Second generation immigrant ends up becoming incredibly radicalised" is a common story and is an argument that the effects of immigration are long-lasting and we need to be incredibly cautious.

Yeah you're right I'd say the main cause of radicalisation is a cunty old grifter we really need to watch out for him.

And even if you're annoyed by that you know exactly who I mean 😉

The couple were correct. It’s not hate speech.

I think you’re underestimating the ideology, in this case the father of the most recent terrorist who made comments after October 7th on Hamas.

They have intolerant beliefs and behaviours, support those behaviours and instil children with them. Personally inflicting violence is not the only way to have a negative impact.

I dont know how to vote as Im not sure what your question is

They were absolutely right of course and of course its not hate speech.

One would assume the Caribbean couple were black, so yes, “colour” was mentioned

I mean, my very alternative take on the matter is that we shouldn’t have any net immigration at all on the account of our country being densely populated to the point we are 8th in the EU only preceded by the Netherlands, Belgium and then a handful of places like the Channel Islands, Gibraltar and Vatican City.

I don’t know why the debate about immigration is always made about race. To me the far more pressing issue is that of pollution, destruction of greenfield land, loss of wildlife habitats, constant ‘house building’ elevating our floor risk, a creaking infrastructure and a critical and ongoing housing crisis.

We are playing with fire in the craziest way by allowing our population to rise by nearly a million a year, with everyone bleating about us ‘needing immigrants’ while a million young people sit on the dole and do nothing. Not only does immigration see welfare go up and up, it’s basically a big Ponzi scheme whereby the immigrants themselves grow old and need care and then we need to import yet more immigrants to ‘fill the gap’. It’s absolutely crazy and I won’t judge future generations for wondering how we could’ve been so short sighted and blase about a looming crisis in order to appear to support ‘multiculturalism and diversity’.

We have added an additional 15 million migrants to the UK since the Millennium. If that still doesn’t meet our needs as a nation, then how many will? We’re going to end up a polluted, miserable city state.

I agree wholeheartedly with this however, British values find the rape and subjugation of women abhorrent.
Most men do not intend to rape their wives or treat their daughter's as second class citizens, on the whole life in the UK is is infinitely more secure as a woman than it is in many other countries.
We should be doing more about the minority of abusive men in this country but that is for another thread.
What we shouldn't be doing is allowing the dilution of our values with whole communities of young men that believe all women are beneath them and they are property to be used as they see fit.

I understand that his father celebrated the October 7 attack. Which is suggestive, I would say.

So how do you process who ‘hates us’ and who doesn’t?

Unless you are some sort of bigoted xenophobe who thinks ALL Muslims hate us and that we shouldn’t allow any in

but no, I doubt you are that sort of ignorant hate filled dogmatic partisan