To think that if you commit a male crime, you should do male time, even if you identify as a woman?

[TheAvidAmberPeer]

I know this is a sensitive topic but I’ve been thinking about how justice systems handle trans women who commit serious crimes, especially violent or sexual offences, and whether it’s fair to house them in women’s prisons. To me, if you were born male and commit a crime typically associated with male offenders, particularly one involving violence against women, it seems like common sense that you should serve time in a male facility. Identity doesn’t erase biology or risk in those cases.

AIBU to think fairness and safety, especially for vulnerable female prisoners, should come before ideology?

Except that there is nothing inherently wrong or problematic about being trans. You can live a perfectly normal life and be a perfectly healthy and be trans. You can be perfectly sane and perfectly cogent. You can be a doctor. There is no ‘cure’ for being trans, and there’s nothing wrong with it. It’s very similar to being gay in that respect - people used to call that a mental illness until they got over themselves and realised that gay people weren’t mentally ill they were just gay and that is fine.
So call being trans a delusion or mental illness all you want, it doesn’t matter. Trans people are who they are, and that’s not going to change, and also it’s ok.

That’s what I think. These people claiming TWAW obviously believe that TWANW. If they did, they’d hold them to the same levels of conduct as women. When did you last see a woman threatening to pee in the streets? When did you last see a woman calling for the rape of other women? The fact that people like some posters on this thread believe a male saying he’s a woman over women saying he’s not, shows they know fine well TWANW.

There is nothing inherently wrong with being trans no.

There is something very wrong with trying to force your own personal "reality" on other people.

Particularly when you are a doctor and supposed to be taking care of your patients.

No Dr U doesn’t have a personality disorder. No she is not “lying for control”.

Dr U is trans.

That’s it. Trans. Some people are trans.

Except both are mental illness and delusions. Gender Dysphoria is even in the DSMV. It is a mental illness. And it is nothing like being gay. Gay people didn't seek to sterilise gay children or think cutting a limb or organ or their dick off will solve a mental health problem. That there, proves it's a mental illness.

The irony here is that that is how I would describe your views and the statements you have made.

You have demonstrated a complete lack of ability to recognise that many many women (the biological female kind) do not feel comfortable for a variety of reasons being in an intimate setting or situation with a Trans woman (biological males) and you continue to state that they feel that they are female therefore they are women.

You have failed to articulate in any understandable way why their feelings should surpass ours, why their feelings should have precedent and we should ignore ours and capitulate to their demands for validation of something we fundamentally do not believe in.

If a practicing medical doctor in an NHS hospital is a) unable to understand biology and (b) unwilling to respect the wishes of their patients to the extent that they would deliberately take an action that they have been told causes distress and which is completely unnecessary medically then they should not be practicing medicine. Can you think of any other scenario where it would be considered ok to lie to a patient when there is no medical need to?

That's great but we're still not pretending they're women.

Whose feelings are most important in the doctor/patient relationship? Who is already likely to be experiencing worry and distress? Who needs to feel safe? Who is most vulnerable?

Its an entirely meaningless claim to me because I don’t share your ideology.

What I want to know is, if genitals don’t define gender and a woman can have a penis, why are so many adults so invested in getting children to take dangerous drugs and get surgery to “affirm” their gender?

There is something very wrong with trying to force your own personal "reality" on other peopl

like when you insist over and over and over again that you know who Dr U is, what she thinks, and how she feels, better than she knows herself??

Yeh I agree, there is something very wrong with that. Very wrong indeed.

I want to know this too.

That would be a predatory man.

It’s a very good question. Upton claims to not even recognise the concept of a biological female person.

Right. It’s an entirely meaningless claim to you because you do not accept or understand the reality of trans experience. You don’t believe that it’s real or that it exists. You think it’s an “ideology”, rather than an actual facet of human diversity.

If that’s how you want to frame it. I don’t particularly take anything you say seriously.

It just confirms his unfitness to practice

It is unquestionably an ideology, not a fact, that people can have an innate “gender” that is more important than their biological sex.

How Dr Upton feels isn't more important than how his colleagues and patients feel.

And utterly absurd that these “genders” are claimed to not be based on stereotypes when they generally involve some of the most regressive, misogynistic ideas about women possible.

Dr Upton has had no complaints from patients, nor most of her colleagues.

We don't give a fuck. The trans experience isn't relevant to women or our needs.

There is absolutely nothing that the trans experience could possibly mean which would make one iota of difference to what a woman is and whether we should exist in law as well as in reality. (By which I mean actual reality, not our own personal reality.)

He's currently under investigation for harassment.

Very well said.

You don’t speak for women or ‘women’s needs’. You speak for yourself.

And no one is disputing the existence of women in reality or law.

Women exist AND trans people exist. At the same time. Fascinating stuff isn’t it? There can be more than one thing in reality and law and stuff.