To except DS21 to share a room with his sister? *edited by MNHQ*

[DasDrummer]

I'm a mum to 4 DC, DS21, DD15, and DS15, DD5

My eldest was born a girl but ill use DS for this thread as it's his argument for why he can't share a room. He is on testosterone and to a lot of people he “passes” as a man.

He barely finished school, he didn't take his GCSEs as it was in 2020, he briefly started a catering course at college but he dropped out after a few months. In 2019 I split with their dad and he started sharing a room with DD and has done since. I had to downsize and there was nothing I could do. They have the biggest room and DS15 has the box room. It isn't possible for me to sleep on the sofa and give one of them my room. DD5 is in with me (in her own bed though)

Anyway, he got a job at 17 (he turned 18 later that year) it was at the supermarket. He ended up buying tickets to see an artist he liked as they were going on tour and the manager said no he couldn't have it off, he ended up quitting. He got his trust fund at 18 and wasted it to go travelling around Europe to different shows for said artist. He basically said he could do what he wanted

He was gone for most of 2023, he came back and didn't get a job, he stayed in bed all day on his phone. He also met a girl that lived in Germany and spent Christmas 2023 with her (this was with him getting UC and buying cheap flights), he finally got a job early last year, the gf came here to visit him and DD had to share a bed with me for the week. I don't know why I allowed him to dictate but I regret it.

Anyway, they split up and he started saying he was depressed and he’d stay in bed all day etc. He ended up quitting the job in Feb/March and again he’d just stay in bed constantly. He did end up going to the GP and was given antidepressants and he's had 1 session of therapy.

He got a boyfriend in the summer and he was out with him a lot, he'd come over but honestly it was too much too soon. I never let him stay over apart from agreeing to when me and my younger DC were away (they broke up before this happened though). When they broke up the behaviour was the same, in bed most the time. He only eats one meal a day because I don't cook for him, he usually ends up ordering though.

He does go out drinking a few times a week, he gets UC and that mostly goes on nights out (and quickly), he sometimes disturbs us getting in drunk, but other times he stays out. The artist had announced another tour and he's been complaining he has no money to see him more than once which is his own fault tbh.

Anyway, to the point: he is saying he shouldn't have to share with DD15, he's an adult and if he should share with anyone it would be DS as he's not a woman and feels uncomfortable sharing with DD, this led to an argument over me not accepting him, he called me transphobic and I basically told him if he doesn't Iike it he should move out. He stormed out and hasn't replied to my messages, this was last night.

To add: they did used to share bunk beds but now they have their own single bed and the room is slightly partitioned with shelves but he still complains about her and sharing.

AIBU?

I think lines have to be drawn and you might have to be firm. You can’t magic another bedroom out of thin air, it’s not appropriate to ask your male child to share a bedroom with their adult female sibling, even if that sibling identifies as male. If your oldest child doesn’t want to share a room with your dd, then moving out is the only option. I would tell him this. Benefits are available. This is the best you can do rent wise.

I do think you need to be a little blunt and possibly harsh- this is a take it or leave it option and they are an adult who can make a choice to stay at your house sharing with their sister or move out.

Except this DC is also vulnerable and traumatised, potentially with undiagnosed ND holding them back.

OP is in a very hard situation, but that doesn’t change the fact her eldest is also in a very hard situation.

The solution isn’t to toss the young adult who potentially is only as capable as a 14/15yr old out of the family home and away from their support network of mostly OP.

It’s tempting sure, but OP is a caring and loving adult who fled a violent home with five children to protect them and herself from further abuse. She isn’t someone who strikes me as willing to sacrifice the eldest to make things easier on everyone else. I personally think she is trying to find a way that is best for everyone.

Overdosing on exogenous hormones won’t be doing your eldest daughter’s mental health or aggression levels any good whatsoever, but that is beside the point.

She needs to accept that if she wishes to not work and not pay rent, she has little choice in where she sleeps.

Your 15 year old son should not be sharing with his older sister, however his older sister identifies. It’s hardly fair on your 15 year old daughter either, as sounds like she’ll be making her life a misery too.

I have met a lot of people over the years who identify as trans (or used to) and all of them have mental and/or physical health issues and are incredibly entitled. The ‘trans joy’ that is talked of is all too elusive, sadly.

I’m sorry your family is struggling OP, but she needs to get a job or perhaps move out and go and study or something.

The best and kindest thing to do is to anchor your daughter (and all your other children!) in reality.

She is a young female adult and needs to assume responsibility for her own life.

Living in this gender fantasy land where nothing means anything and mummy pays for everything is not good for her.

She needs to move out and get a job.

Could the mental health crisis be in part due to the fact that adults have taken leave of their senses and fallen hook, line and sinker for all the gender nonsense? And children like this confused young woman (daughter, not son) are paying the price.

Absolute dereliction of adult duty.

And telling her DS that he will always have a home with her no matter what, but unfortunately this is the only home she can afford at the moment and that his bed is the only bed available for him in that house is a perfectly reasonable approach.

If he feels like he needs a different bed, then he needs to get a job and contribute to the household so OP can move somewhere bigger or he can move into a house share and have a bed there. Or maybe he sleeps on the sofa.

Because even though he is vulnerable and potentially ND, that doesn’t magic up more money or another bedroom, so unfortunately he is going to have to compromise. And I don’t think a 15 year old boy should be sharing a room with someone with a vagina/without a penis, so I think the OP is reasonable to say that’s not an option.

Eldest needs to move out and get a damn job. Time to grow up.

It's so common now though isn't it ? There are three of these kids on our road of 100 houses and my cousin's child too. That's just in the very limited number of young people I know. Adolescent MH services certainly have their work cut out.

I don't understand why you wouldn't have your DS's sharing a room and DD gets her own room?

Why on earth are you enabling this behaviour?!
He either gets a job and starts paying you rent or he moves out, simple as that!
He cannot be disrupting everyone else's lives because he can't get a grip of his own.
With regards to bedrooms, yes your other children do gat a say in this. What are they comfortable with?

It’s very concerning!

Though my understanding is that, as long as the adults around them don't affirm the delusion, these kids you know will most likely grow out of it and in many cases turn out to be gay, lesbian or bi.

And at least they’re now safe in a medical sense, post-Cass, and will not be medicated.

Though sounds like that course correct has come too late for the OPs daughter.

Not really the only reasonable approach long term imho.

Does not have to be the ultimatum of put up & shut up or move out.

If her trans man daughter is autistic, then she could look into supported housing for them nearby.

They could probably get PIP, which could be spent on the difference in rent for an extra bedroom.

If he feels like he needs a different bed, then he needs to get a job and contribute to the household so OP can move somewhere bigger or he can move into a house share and have a bed there. Or maybe he sleeps on the sofa.
agree with you here
Or if not autistic, if they get a part time job, and contribute to rent, then OP can maybe afford a place with one more bedroom.

If you look on Rightmove the price difference between a 3 or 4 bedroom can range from £200/mo to £500/mo most areas outside London.

It would give them motivation too. I don’t think they can survive independently. Even if not traumatised & autistic with burnout they are still traumatised and depressed.

Not a good idea to even suggest living alone is a reasonable option to anyone who cares for this young person.

If he is disturbing the house and not contributing. He needs to get a job or move out.
He needs some tough love

OP gets some of their UC
Its fair to wonder how much she is getting from her child and how much she depends on it herself?

This thread is just the most perfect example of why sex natters in terms of language

so many people on here are confused by the eldest child’s sex which is relevant to the help that is being sought.

She is a girl on testosterone, it is not an ordinary every day situation, of overcrowding.

@DasDrummer come to think of it you could ask the LA to rehouse you all given the vulnerability of your eldest they may be keen to oblige.

Because one son is female bodied and one is male bodied.

Well, I hope there are lots more therapy sessions, and that the therapist isn't the type to make this entitled attitude of theirs even worse.

At the end of the day, your eldest is an entitled, jobless adult. They have no place to dictate to you in your home. They are contributing nothing.

I'm also horrified that us taxpayers are paying for this entitled young adult to go out drinking multiple times per week. It's so easy to say you can't work due to poor mental health, but fuck me, most of us are depressed or traumatised these days and still have to bloody work.

As for them blaming YOU for how they are, NO, it's not your fault that you were abused, and not your fault that the abuse you suffered left them with mental health issues. They are blaming the wrong person here.

I'd be seriously losing my patience with this one. Weekly therapy, and get another job, door locked at 11pm, no more entitled dictating to you, and they need to grow the fuck up.

If they want their own room, they need to get a job and go get their own place, or a room in a house share.

She is 21 so it's time for her to move out. Don't allow her to dictate her wants over your needs.

Personally I wouldn't want my 15 year old daughter to be sharing with a man, trans or otherwise

But she isn't a man, she's a female on testosterone. She still female with a vagina. She just looks manly.

This

This. Moreover, if you formally evict them (eg send a letter) they can apply for social housing and UC/benefits while they are job hunting, which would cushion moving out. Pandering to your eldest is not doing her any favours. She needs to stand on her own two feet - if she is old enough to transition/take T etc, she is old enough to move out and work/claim financial support.

She is not your responsibility any more - but your remaining children are.

Of course you leave the two older girls together. If 21 yr old doesn't like it, she needs to find a place of her own.

there are jobs that come with accommodation - is that something worth considering?

there are also things like 'Workaway' & 'WWOOF' - both ways of travelling & visiting new places, and doing an agreed number of hours of work/ week in exchange for bed and board (and in some cases, pocket money as well)

@SugarandSpiceandAllThingsNaice

Just to correct a couple of things in your posts:

OP's oldest child is 21, not 17.
OP has 4 children, not 5.