Snapped in the parent and child parking

[seize]

Juggling my 3 month old from their baby carrier trying to get them into the car seat, a car pulls in and asks me to close my door, while I’m halfway into getting my baby in their seat.

Out hops a child in school uniform about 10 years old, not help needing any help to get out, my face must have had an expression of surprise. Someone in need of this space being asked to stop what they’re doing to allow someone not in need of the space to use it. The adult said “ignorant” loudly at me. So I snapped back, “these spaces are for people with babies and children that need help getting in and out, they aren’t for older children” she snaps something back at me about not knowing how old their child is (the one that is in school uniform, fairly tall, that needed no help getting out and is now safely stood in a car park without the adult needing to have them in their line of sight) and the bratty child screams “yeah!”.

I’ve had it with these spaces, they aren’t a convenience for people that happen to have a person under the age of 16 with them. They’re for people who genuinely need the help getting them in and out and need the extra space.

Because adults, regardless of age (unless they have mental decline and therefore should not be navigating a busy carpark), can keep themselves safe on a carpark. It might take them longer, it might be a bit shit and uncomfortable. But little kids have a mind of their own and often aren't aware of the danger, they haven't learnt to drive and so aren't clued up about which signalling lights mean what. Car parks are way more dangerous for kids than the average elderly person.

I'm disabled and have been told fairly regularly, at numerous shopping areas, that if there are no disabled parking spaces available, then I have the 'right' to park in a P&C space, because the disabled should take priority over P&C. So on several occasions I have parked in P&C spaces.
A far as disabled spaces go, across the whole of the UK, there are 52 times more people with blue badges than there are disabled parking spaces, meaning that in theory, there could be 52 people fighting for each and every disabled parking space. Hence the reason why we're regularly told to use P&C spaces.

Except at meadowhall apparently where you can be fined for parking in their P&C spaces.

Not the point of the thread but it's grated me a bit learning about it on this thread.

I use those spaces sometimes but usually park at the back far away but as near to the people walkway/zebra crossing as possible. My children are 8 and 10. They are both SEN and are a nightmare, swinging doors, it's like herding cats with no sense of danger at all. The amount of times i have to shout ITS A CAR PARK WATCH OUT, to them. It's actually worse now they are older as people think they should be able to sense danger and get out of the way but they don't see it.

I know it's more of a faff when they are babies OP but honestly, it's like living on a knife edge with my children now as they are meant to be getting more independent but cannot keep safe. This person may have just been an entitled dick, but I'm sure people think that of me at times.

@seize They shouldn’t have shouted at you … but you gave as good as you got 🤷‍♀️
No matter how many times you tell the story, you were being entitled about the whole scenario. They were equally as deserving of a space as you were.

It’s not just “a bit shit and uncomfortable though”, my own mother doesn’t go places based on parking.
Agree re little kids my own kids are pretty young, I think it’s the entitlement in this thread that gets to me.

They'd got their space, they just wanted OP to stop what she was doing rather than wait for a minute.

I'm sorry, I don't understand why it's more than just a pain in the ass for her? I'm not trying to be an ass about it, just would like to understand what things are like for other people.

You're pretty unreasonable IMHO - a parent with a 10 year old should be able to park in those spaces and there is extra space provided for you to keep within. It's not just about getting in and out, they are also a safer part of the car park for kids of all ages.

Because she is 74 and has had multiple operations on several body parts, she finds parking tricky, has a fear of falling and walks with a crutch. If she was able to use a big wide space near the door of the shop she would be far less stressed. She currently has a blue badge but is worried that it won’t get renewed.
Its not just a “pain in the ass”, if she is too stressed at the thought of going somewhere she just won’t go.
Her needed is greater than someone with a kid. And I have no doubt it’s the same for many old people. People who are crippled with joint pain, for whom a fall breaking a bone could be absolutely life changing and could mean they’d never leave the house again. And they won’t be “disabled” enough for a blue badge.

Being in physical pain and afraid of falling which many older people are isnt just a “pain in the ass”.

Yet we don’t have OAP parking.

And for people with multiple children close together like the women who said it’s on her, that choice is on her. Older people in poor health didn’t make a choice to be less able.

What does this have to do with the scenario in the post? Many people have already mentioned parking in the parent and child post if the disabled spaces are full. This wasn’t about disabled person though.

The child would have been better off being asked to wait a minute, or hop out the other side. Instead he/she got involved in an adult spat. I wouldn’t think it’s the first time - i work around kids who are all entitlement and no responsibility/ consideration of others and when you meet the families it all
becomes clear!

That was going to be my question. Surely older people (knowing a fair few 74 year olds I'm not sure I would actually consider that 'elderly' in all cases) with mobility issues should get a blue badge. Your mum has a blue badge... The blue badge spaces are often way more plentiful and in a better spot than the p&c spaces. So, given that your mum has access to these spaces, I'm not sure why you're upset...

If she can't park, she shouldn't be driving.

An adult feeling 'stressed' isn't a good enough reason to get a safer parking space. I'm sure a lot of parents with multiple children who developmentally cannot keep themselves safe feel very stressed crossing a busy carpark, but their stress isn't the reason they get the parking space near the front. It's so the children don't die from getting hit by a car.

I do think children not getting killed is the priority over your mothers comfort, who realistically probably should not be driving at all...

The spaces aren’t for babies only… they do state under 12’s!
and that’s because kids ‘throw’ the door open with no consideration fir
other parked cars.
I can’t remember how many times i
said to my daughter ‘watch the car or open door carefully - it’s stressful. She still managed to hit a car or two with her door! So yes I used to park in the mother and child spaces right up till she was 11 or 12…. And as she’s tall I’m sure she looked older than she was … not many 11 year olds are 5ft 8, but she was… and easily passed as 18…
I wouldn’t ask someone clearly struggling to close their door though!

A delivery for what? How do you know what the OP was doing?

It did me too, and l commented on the legality upthread. But thinking about it supermarket and shopping centre car parks are private and can impose their own rules, so I suppose it’s down to whether the parking charge notices are enforceable or not. Some are not, and you need to look at the signage - it should clearly state that there will be a fine for parking in the bays if you’re not eligible.

The car park operator should also be a member of an accredited trade association and contact details should be displayed. PCN’s are not enforced by the local authority, they are a private ‘invitation to pay’ and can be enforced through the civil courts - they can be challenged if you don’t think they have been issued correctly.

So I'm assuming the reason the other woman called you ignorant is because you didn't close your door when she asked you to? Did you respond in any way before you told her she shouldn't be parking there?

Either way, she was the ignorant one

Did you read the bit where I said she may be about to lose her blue badge? Because there is a clampdown on blue badges where we live.

Lots of 74 years old have health issues, no not all! The same way that lots of parents are perfectly able to hold a child’s hand crossing a car park.

Her GP is fine with her driving. Would you prefer her to be socially isolated because she finds parking a bit tricky.

Her is need is greater as is the case for many many people.

It’s not a case of Little Johnny needs access to a wide space near the door or he might get killed. His parent is supposed to be supervising him. If it is case of a child with additional needs that’s different.

If an old person slips has a fall they could in fact die. It has happened many many times.

How does where they park affect the probability of a trip and fall? I’m a bit confused.
Blue badge holders have PLENTY of allocated parking - you can see it everywhere because it’s always full of empty spots!

Because those parking spaces are closer to the shop/gp surgery etc so less distance to walk

Don't park in those spaces. I have twins and l have never used the parent and child spaces. I park further away, where no one wants to go. I can take my time getting them in the double buggy. Trouble is, everyone wants to be the nearest they can be to the shop doorway , it's a lot less stressful too

Absolutely this. Any half decent parent who genuinely believed that they and their able-bodied, almost teenaged child needed a parent and child space would have said to their child, "You need to wait until that lady has finished putting her baby into the car and shut her door before you get out."

I bet that both that child and her mother are hated by all the teachers at school.

It's the 'Old Sylvia' who can't park who is likely to hit 'Little Jonny' in a carpark, because they aren't confident or safe drivers anymore. I'm sorry but if your mother isn't confident at parking in a carpark, then she shouldn't be driving... Parking is part of the driving test. If she would fail a driving test now, it doesn't matter what the GP says (who has absolutely nothing to do with road safety laws) then she should not be on the road.

She could do a home delivery, couldn't she? Or get a taxi.

GPs have to sign off people as fit to drive. So absolutely everything to do with road safety laws. The forms they use are produced by the Road Safety authority. That is the system my mother is fully compliant with it. And she has a brilliant GP. She is not a danger to anyone.

You are being ableist and ageist, please check yourself & stop.

When you are old do be sure to only get takeaways and taxis. Until the money runs out. And you might die earlier due to loneliness. Another epidemic.

So, if they have a Blue Badge they get to park closer to the entrance. What are you suggesting? If they don’t have a Blue Badge, they should have allocated spaces, also close to the entrance, that are for ‘elderly’ people? What qualifies as elderly? How would this work? What if you are in your 50s, but have menopause-related osteoporosis?
Genuinely confused. Or are you just being a bit disingenuous to make a point?