Tried three places for lunch today and none cater for women

[Mrsmunchofmunchington]

I went out for lunch today with a friend.
Well, at least we tried to have lunch.
All three places, two pubs and one cafe, were not suitable for women because you needed a penis to get into them or to use the toilet.
We ended up coming back to my home instead.

AIBU to think that everywhere should offer equal service to women?
Or is it my fault for not checking in advance that I could eat there without a penis?
Should I have researched on tripadvisor?
Am I too entitled expecting businesses to ensure non penis having people can pay to eat lunch at their establishment?

Day in the life of a disabled person.

I completely understand and am sorry you have this ongoing experience.
Kids in pubs? Great!
Accessibility for all adults? Nah.

Most people, or at least lots of us plan in advance or need to. Its not unusual or strange. Its not onerous either. Not as onerous as being turned away and having to shlep about trying to find somewhere, getting more and more hungry and upset

I also dont know why such a focus on listed buildings on this thread either, there are countless buildings, built all the way from the 1800s right through to the 60s and 70s which wouldnt be accessible necessarily or perhaps able to provide that accessibility.

Some are very easily remedied but many arent. In my small town you couldnt even get a wheelchair or pram on the pavement really let alone manage to move around some of the small gift shops.

If a restaurant doesn’t allow a wheelchair user it’s because they don’t have the correct accessibility, such as steep stairs and no life etc. If a restaurant just doesn’t allow women, or people of different races for example it is outright discrimination and is a totally different issue.

This is awful to read. I wish disability access would become a priority. You'd think we'd have moved far beyond this point by now.

Clear to me. Not unreasonable at all. Good way to help us to relate to the experience. It’s so unfair. I guess some old buildings are maybe too hard to adapt? But so unfair and discriminatory.

Not every small business can afford to install lifts and things though, and some listed buildings can’t allow it. Should we let small business close down and old buildings go derelict if they can’t make all these accommodations?

I didn’t get it initially but I also think it’s a great way to same your point. Sorry this happened to you.

I thought your message would have hit harder if you had simply framed it in terms of what happened to you as a disabled person. I think the overwhelming majority of people would agree that disabled people should be able to go out and about and have food at a pub/cafe.

But if your disabled sometimes it's just the way it is.
I have mobility issues so I check before I go rather than hoping for the best.

OP tried 3 places. I can't imagine they were all unsuitable due to no lift access, although i.admit I haven't RTWT

It shouldn't be the way it is which is exactly OP's point.

I get it

But there are 33 million women in the uk, and far fewer people who have physical disabilities/lack of working legs. For some small businesses they can't afford it for the tiny number of potential customers who ask for it.

If every single cafe or pub was required to be designed to be completely, easily accessible to things like wheelchairs, a huge proportion of venues would simply close down, because:

• they are in old period buildings where the necessary renovations can't be made
• they are in very tiny spaces where there simply isn't room to manoeuvre/add a changing places loo
• the cost vs any additional profit due to more disabled customers, would result in them losing money and going bust
• they would have to compromise huge amounts of features/furniture/space the vast majority of their customers value, risking them losing all their business

It absolutely should be a requirement for new/modern venues to be accessible. But you can't try and shoehorn ramps etc into a tiny 16th century pub.

Inability to form coherent analogies?

I didn’t say it was due to just no lift access, lift access was an example but it’s clear what I meant.

Speaking as the Mum of a disabled child I do get it’s tough and the extra planning for everything can be a pain!

BUT there does also need to be a realistic expectation and understanding that not all buildings can be made fully accessible even with best will in the world. New builds should of course be accessible but we can’t go back in time to change every older building, some can be altered retrospectively which is great but for others it simply isn’t feasible.

I got it, but I am also disabled.

Unfortunately its gone over the heads of many, who believe that having to ring and check with measurements of your chair, book the day before, double check again the day you want to do the thing, take a friend with you to help...still means it's accessible.

If I can't show up without a pre-booked, pre-arranged visit, without a friend to assist... it isn't accessible.

You're spot on that if various places denied access based on not having a penis, vs not having usable functional legs, there would be outrage and riots in the streets.

But it seems it is still acceptable for modern transport and modern buildings - trains, train stations, shops, restaurants, hospitals, dentists, opticians... to not be accessible.

And the number of people willing to voice an opinion that we should shut up and put up, and that we're all just out to find something to moan about is growing daily.

In vast countries like the US, where real estate is equally vast and restaurants spacious, there's no excuse.

Unfortunately in the UK, most of the housing stock is old and so expensive that restaurants, which are very hard to run at a profit, have to make do with available options.
Nearly all high street cafes are tiny, often in victorian commercial spaces that can't be altered without losing half of the already minute square footage.
Since rebuilding the whole country isn't an option, I'm not sure what can be done.

I had noticed the problem as often there is no changing space for babies which means doing it on your lap in a cramped cubicle - but at least it's possible. I realise it's really hard for those who need accessible premises.

This seems likely! 🤣

For us it is not many places having full changing areas for disabled people. Nappy changing areas built for babies and toddlers are useless when you need to change a large 9 year old. I can understand that in some cases, there simply just isn't enough room with some buildings.

Other places might be ground floor but have steps and no option for wheelchair users to enter.

Well perhaps your analogy would make more sense if 50% of the potential customers were disabled!

As a pp has pointed out, not every building can be wheelchair accessible for umpteen valid reasons. It's unfortunate but there it is.

I don't understand why you wouldn't research suitable venues before you set out.

It's rather sounds like you are setting out to prove some kind of point.

It really wasn’t. Sorry.

It’s just not possible to make all places accessible for every single person.

It’s really not a hardship to check ahead, and prevents OP from wasting her time and energy as she did today.

Why do you need to give chair measurements, and double check on the day?

I understood it on first read op, it wasn't so difficult.

You say that, but I lived on a large Japanese island where there are American military bases, thirty years ago, and "all you can eat and drink" restaurants were a very common thing - most had "no foreigners" or "Japanese only" signs up, as did a lot of bars and clubs. They also had perfectly reasonable explanations - foreigners eat more and they can't make a profit (the all you can eat places) and foreigners cause trouble ... They'd often make an exception for my friend and I as we spoke basic Japanese and were women... and always made an exception when we were with Japanese friends and no foreign men in the group...

Does that make "no foreigners" signs okay?