Huge row with neightbour, AIBU?

[Nikki3009]

Hi,

I moved into a small shared-ownership house on a new-ish build estate to get away from domestic abuse and I'm very thankful for my home, but tonight I have had an awful row with a neighbour, and I feel so upset.

Adjacent to my house, is a row of houses that are LHA - I want to preface this by saying that I have no issue with this, and I'm only putting in this detail because I think it's relevant. I'm not trying to throw shade on people in local authority housing.

When I moved in, one of the fence panels at the side of my house had a load of scaffolding poles leaning against it. The fence panel was buckling under the weight and bits of it were breaking off so I popped round to let them know (thinking it was their fence). The women basically said, it's your fence, your problem. But to give them their due they did remove the scaffolding poles. And I've not mentioned it since even though they've damaged it. I've just had to accept that it'll be down to me to replace it at some point.

They have 5 children, I think, and they are loud which you would expect but hearing them playing in the garden doesn't bother me. My garden is often very noisy because there are lots of houses in close proximity so I just don't use my garden very often.

The kids from this house are always kicking their balls into my garden and they'd come and knock at my door and I'd have a chat with them and then throw their balls back over. Or, if I found a ball in the garden I'd put it back over the fence for them. Again, no problem.

The issue started when I realised that the kids were coming into my garden whilst I was at work (my daughter caught them when she was staying). I think they were climbing over the fence onto my bin, because I noticed my bin lid was damaged one day and then the following day it was worse. The bin hadn't been moved, so I don't know how it had spontaneoulsly crumpled. When I tried to get a new bin my local council wanted to charge me for it, so in order to get a new bin I had to file a criminal damage report. The police did say they would go and speak to them, but I said not to worry as long as I got a new bin, it would be fine.

One day I was working from home, and I was on a teams call with a really high value client. I could hear the kids banging on my front door but I couldn't go and answer it. Then I heard them rattling my side gate and shouting 'oi we want our ball back'. I had to mute my call and ask them to stop shouting and that I'd be there when I could!

There's been lots of this sort of thing going on, it's irritating but nothing I've complained about. They flooded my side alley way by emptying their swimming pool at the bottom of their garden. They're (the parents) just generally just a bit laissez faire I think and don't really have any respect for their neighbours or their neighbours property.

Roll on this evening and I'm sitting in my lounge with my DD and all we can hear is the fence being smashed by a football. A bit later I'm doing a bit of clearing up and I go out to my side alley to take some rubbish and SMASH the ball hits the fence, the fence panel which is hanging on by a thread anyway looks like its going to fall on me.

I shouted "Excuse me, could you not hit the fence like that please". Now, I hold my hands up, I was stern when I said it but I think it was the shock of the noise. When they shouted back 'we're shooting goals', I replied 'perhaps you could move your goal'? I personally think the parents should be telling their children not to kick a football at their neighbours fence or am I just a bit old school?

The next thing I know, there is hammering at my front door and I mean absolute bashing my door. I wasn't going to answer it, but whoever it was, clearly wasn't going to stop. So I opened the door and it was the mum from the house adjacent to mine.

She shouted "who the fck do you think you are, if you've got a problem you come to my door, you don't speak to my children". It was so aggressive, so I said hold on, the kids are smashing a ball into the fence. And she said "you and that fcking fence....just because you're too tight to f*cking fix it". So, I said why should I pay to fix the damage you caused? And then she went a bit mental.

I thought she was going to hit me. The women's husband had come along and he was holding her back! I was really trying to calmly explain to him why I had said something.

She was going ballistic screaming and shouting about the fence being damaged before I even moved in and so I said well they've damaged it even more by climbing over it to get into my garden. She said 'what's your problem with them getting their ball back"? I said, because if I'm not here, they don't have permission to come onto my property. She laughed and said 'Oh you're a fat fucking bitch". At which point my daughter got involved and told her to f*ck off.

I made my daughter go inside, she was so angry, but she's seen me being verbally abused by her Dad so many times that I think it just triggered her.

The women then said that the kids don't climb over the fence, they come in at the side gate (which I do leave unlocked when it's bin day). She was sneering at me, saying they're just kids, whats the problem. She's lived there 8 years and never had any problems until I moved it (what?)

I was mortified by all the shouting and screaming on the street. I was having a reasonable conversation with her husband but even as she was walked off she shouted "I'm going to tell them to kick your fence even harder".

I feel a bit gaslit...am I being unreasonable? How would you feel if strangers' kids just came into your garden when they felt like it? How would you feel about your fence being used as goal and being damaged? Maybe I'm not cut out for being in close proximity to people with younger kids.

And the 'f•cking fat b*tch' comment has just brought back so many horrible memories of all the verbal abuse and the constant put downs. I kow I'm overweight (I'm a menopausal woman, size 16 and struggling to shift the meno weight). I just didn't really need that being sceamed in my face in my safe space. My daughter got it on video and I'm so tempted to make a police complaint, but I don't want to make things any worse.

What would you do in my situation? I don't want any animosity. Clearly she has different ideas of being neighbourly, respecting neighbours property etc.

I'd been feeling so good recently, I'm having CBT, I'm trying to re-build my life and this has made me feel so small and I'm embarrassed because I'm sure the other neighbours heard it all.

Thank you for listening and letting me vent... xx

Agree

I agree with those saying de-escalate first. You can always escalate later.

This woman sounds awful, but this

She knows she's at fault, she knows her kids are in the wrong so she leaps to the defensive, if that's any consolation. She's yelling at you to distract you from being right and to try to scare you into stopping being assertive.

is correct, from what you’ve said. I would try and speak to her husband calmly, but I wouldn’t necessarily go round to their house to do so, just do it in passing. I would also seriously consider speaking to her, in passing, probably over the fence (obviously don’t put yourself at risk) and try to lower the temperature. She feels very threatened by you and some people can only deal with this via aggression, they literally have no other tools - and because they are so aggressive, others are aggressive in return and so it goes on.

you sound like an extremely brave, tough person, and I think you can manage this situation with a mix of toughness and calm. I would ring the HA and ask for an informal, confidential chat at this stage. Don’t put it
in writing. You could also approach your local councillor in a similar way.

Fix the fence and/or move the bin etc. I would throw the balls back personally, and tell the kids look, I will throw them back but you can’t come into my garden so you might have to wait a bit sometimes. And see how that goes.

OP, it's harassment. Keep a diary if anything like that happens again and report her to the police.

You are totally reasonable to not want kids or anyone else letting themselves into your property and not wanting your fence damaged,

Could you plant a thorny hedge to make it more difficult to get into your garden? Eg berberis.

Oh dear, that's awful, I'm so sorry.

@ADifferentDay "You could then put broken glass on the top to prevent people climbing over." Unfortunately, that's illegal in the UK and OP could be held liable for any injury to her neighbour's kids (or anyone else who cuts themselves on it).

Also put Ring cameras or similar up front and back.

You've taken my comment entirely out of context. I haven't said the kids aren't trespassing. Try reading the history that prompted my comment.

If you can afford it, I'd suggest replacing the fence with concrete fence panels. My NDN's four kids damaged our wooden fence in the same way, so when we replaced it we went to the more solid option. They're not panels, they're like planks; but made of concrete, that slot into the uprights.

You needed to repair the fence and to have a civilised conversation about the kids damaging your property. Too.late now, but I'm sure it will all blow over.

You're right to caution. "Plastic spikes on fences are legal in the UK (broken glass is not), but only if they are at least 2 metres (6.5 feet) high and accompanied by clear warning signs stating that the spikes are present. You must not use them in a way that causes injury or is a nuisance to others using a public highway. It is recommended to check with your local council and potentially seek legal advice before installation to ensure you comply with local regulations and to avoid legal issues, especially concerning animal welfare."

Yes to cameras. I wouldn't have reported the bin as 'criminal damage' before knowing it was 100% true (via cameras). Cameras on the front and back will help ensure you have evidence in future.

De-escalating in the meantime is wise advice. Sounds shit OP!!!

This advice is spot on.

Report them to the LHA. Report them to the police if she is threatening. Film everything on the camera that pp have suggested you put up as evidence for the ASBO. Don't leave your side gate unlocked

Contact the housing association. Tenants will have a clause in their lease about anti social behaviour or something similar.

Don't let her ignorance upset you. She is just a foul mouthed cow and I am sure that the neighbours all know what she is like.

Definitely report her to HA, there are bound to be clauses in her rental agreement that she has to not cause problems to neighbours, can't think how it's worded but have seen it before.

Keep a record of everything in a notebook and report it to the police who would definitely be interested if she started to deliberately harass you or cause damage to anything.

I'd seriously consider moving asap. If she's HA then odds are she will be there for decades and she won't become any less of a twat with age. Her already feral children will be 5 twats in another few years, so 6 twats. This is entirely too many twats living next door.

Ooh yes, the Pyracantha in my front garden is huge, beautiful (currently laden with bright red berries, but white flowers in summer) - and VICIOUS! 😂

But threatening behaviour is.

The police won’t be interested. The HA will be less interested. Once they’ve given the tenancy the property is theirs for as long as they want it. To be classed as anti social behaviour drugs or lots of rowdy visitors would have to be involved. No one apart from the right-minded people who have to put up with cunts kicking a ball class kids “playing” as anti social.

Unfortunately, the use of barbed wire and broken glass on top of boundaries in the UK is illegal, and OP would be liable for any injuries caused. Plastic spikes are legal, but their use must be in line with strict legal requirements.

OP can report the incident to 101 (and email her DD's video of it) to have it logged for information only and ask that no action be taken.
I wouldn't, as others have suggested, send the balls back deflated - that would definitely escalate the situation.

There's not a chance they will move, especially if it's a 4 bed. The council won't move 5 children and they seem settled if they've been there 8 years. It would be difficult for the HA to evict them as well.
You've had some really good advice up thread. I understand what it's like to have bad neighbours and it's just depressing. I fear the poster who said they'll grow up and move on to mopeds is likely correct.
I hope it all settles down but I'd be prepared to move if I were you.

Regardless of the smug advice often posted on MN by those who don’t have to put up with this sort of thing, the message is ‘Don’t live near HA housing’.

As I was scrolling the page my thumb his YABU
but ignore that vote because I do not think you are being unreasonable. What a vile woman your neighbour is.

My neighbour was not HA. Idiot neighbours are out there, private renters, home owners, LHA, it doesn’t matter what the status of ownership is. If they are idiots they are idiots.